Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Family matters/health
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #301  
Old 15.10.2014, 16:40
Leggat's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Lenzburg
Posts: 234
Groaned at 8 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 252 Times in 116 Posts
Leggat has earned the respect of manyLeggat has earned the respect of manyLeggat has earned the respect of many
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
If they carry on like that they will run out of medical staff!
This is the real danger at the moment. Ebola may not ultimately be a big deal, but one can clearly see the leverage effect that it can manifest, vis-à-vis the response in Texas.

It is perhaps an ironic metaphor for the mechanism by which the disease endangers the patient: an initially limited response by the immune system, then, WHAM, over correction to the point that your own tissues are being attacked by the late [and now overwhelming] response.

Other systems could be sensitive to a potential hospital crisis. Fire response? Police? Most government's can augment police forces with their militaries. Would Local municipalities become threatened?

A cascade-like effect could pose more of a threat to the overall system than the disease itself.
Reply With Quote
  #302  
Old 15.10.2014, 16:49
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Kt. Zürich
Posts: 8,564
Groaned at 246 Times in 212 Posts
Thanked 11,553 Times in 6,309 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
Quote " Officials say they are actively monitoring 76 hospital workers in Dallas who may have had contact with Thomas Eric Duncan or his blood when he was being treated for Ebola."

76!! What sort of hospital is that? They must have been queuing up to be near him?

If they carry on like that they will run out of medical staff!

Link here.
Quote:
View Post
This is the real danger at the moment. Ebola may not ultimately be a big deal, but one can clearly see the leverage effect that it can manifest, vis-à-vis the response in Texas.

It is perhaps an ironic metaphor for the mechanism by which the disease endangers the patient: an initially limited response by the immune system, then, WHAM, over correction to the point that your own tissues are being attacked by the late [and now overwhelming] response.

Other systems could be sensitive to a potential hospital crisis. Fire response? Police? Most government's can augment police forces with their militaries. Would Local municipalities become threatened?

A cascade-like effect could pose more of a threat to the overall system than the disease itself.
Cascade effect indeed. I assume that people who had contact with an Ebola patient and so are at risk will not be allowed to continue with their day job until clear? Or am I wrong?
I would not like to be nursed by someone who could be incubating the disease?
Reply With Quote
  #303  
Old 15.10.2014, 17:56
3Wishes's Avatar
Moderately Amused
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Bern area
Posts: 7,561
Groaned at 51 Times in 47 Posts
Thanked 11,449 Times in 5,376 Posts
3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
Quote " Officials say they are actively monitoring 76 hospital workers in Dallas who may have had contact with Thomas Eric Duncan or his blood when he was being treated for Ebola."

76!! What sort of hospital is that? They must have been queuing up to be near him?

If they carry on like that they will run out of medical staff!

Link here.
It's fairly standard in U.S. hospitals for patients to come into contact with a lot of staff members. In my various stints in hospitals, it was not uncommon to encounter 4-5 staff plus 1-2 doctors per shift, and there are 4 shifts per day...but different people work different floors and divisions each day. So 76 sounds almost low to me given how long he was at the facility.

It probably sounds bad, but having lived in Texas this does not surprise me one bit. These folks did not conceive in their wildest nightmare that a guy from Liberia (which they would say is Libya and couldn't find either on a map) showed up with Ebola. Sadly, it just wasn't on the radar.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank 3Wishes for this useful post:
  #304  
Old 15.10.2014, 20:05
Island Monkey's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wallis
Posts: 3,579
Groaned at 62 Times in 32 Posts
Thanked 3,187 Times in 1,571 Posts
Island Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Excellent.....

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-29632433
Reply With Quote
  #305  
Old 15.10.2014, 21:00
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 6,369
Groaned at 221 Times in 172 Posts
Thanked 7,878 Times in 4,253 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
It probably sounds bad, but having lived in Texas this does not surprise me one bit. These folks did not conceive in their wildest nightmare that a guy from Liberia (which they would say is Libya and couldn't find either on a map) showed up with Ebola. Sadly, it just wasn't on the radar.
Yes, but the Spanish nurse knew full well whom she was taking care of, and I guess she used all the precautionary measures but still got the virus. It seems it is a highly contagious virus, no matter what some people might say.
Reply With Quote
  #306  
Old 15.10.2014, 21:18
cannut's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: canada
Posts: 6,575
Groaned at 178 Times in 138 Posts
Thanked 5,752 Times in 3,153 Posts
cannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Ebola - why are countries importing it ffs?

Quote:
View Post
funny then how something sooooooo hard to catch has been caught by incomplete TRAINED MEDICAL STAFF in not so full protective clothing in 1st world hospitals.


ftfy
Reply With Quote
  #307  
Old 15.10.2014, 21:20
spalebärg's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Baselland
Posts: 612
Groaned at 13 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 413 Times in 261 Posts
spalebärg has a reputation beyond reputespalebärg has a reputation beyond reputespalebärg has a reputation beyond reputespalebärg has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

It appears that the disease may well be also spread by airborne particles which complicates the issue of protection.
Already the numbers of people flying in the US is dropping off. Whether that is due merely to costs or ebola phobia is not clear yet.
Reply With Quote
  #308  
Old 15.10.2014, 21:46
3Wishes's Avatar
Moderately Amused
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Bern area
Posts: 7,561
Groaned at 51 Times in 47 Posts
Thanked 11,449 Times in 5,376 Posts
3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
Yes, but the Spanish nurse knew full well whom she was taking care of, and I guess she used all the precautionary measures but still got the virus. It seems it is a highly contagious virus, no matter what some people might say.
I'm not disagreeing, just that when you are thousands of miles from the disease and it is happening to "those people" it's easy to think it won't get to your little hospital. Or, it was easy to think that way. Now I think the awareness and preparation will kick into a higher gear.
Reply With Quote
This user groans at 3Wishes for this post:
  #309  
Old 15.10.2014, 21:58
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Misery-Courtion
Posts: 17,817
Groaned at 299 Times in 231 Posts
Thanked 13,127 Times in 7,523 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Unfortunately, once again too late. From Island Monkey's link:

"Both the newly diagnosed nurse, who has yet to be identified, and Ms Pham treated Mr Duncan early in his stay at Texas Health Presbyterian Hospital in Dallas when he had "extensive production of body fluids", CDC director Tom Frieden told reporters on Wednesday.

The second nurse flew to Cleveland on 10 October, even though she had had "extensive contact" with Mr Duncan and was being monitored for signs of Ebola and therefore should not have flown on a commercial aeroplane, Dr Frieden said.

Ms Pham subsequently became ill and was diagnosed with Ebola. When the second nurse returned from Ohio on Monday evening, she was not showing symptoms of the disease, the crew has told CDC investigators.

Health experts say people who are not showing symptoms are not contagious.

"We will from this moment forward ensure that no other individual who is being monitored for exposure undergoes travel in any way other than controlled movement," Dr Frieden said, meaning, for example, in chartered flights or ambulances.

On the morning of 14 October, the second nurse came down with a fever and was isolated within 90 minutes. Her diagnosis was announced early on Wednesday."

So they're now trying to track down another 132 people who've been in contact with God knows how many people since they landed, who've also been in contact with how many people, who've also ....

This whole thing has been a disaster from the moment the first cases in Africa were reported.
Reply With Quote
  #310  
Old 15.10.2014, 22:13
Island Monkey's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wallis
Posts: 3,579
Groaned at 62 Times in 32 Posts
Thanked 3,187 Times in 1,571 Posts
Island Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

I find it astonishing that she nursed Mr Duncan & 2 days later got on a commercial flight

Common sense would say that you have an Ebola nursing team…. they should not nurse any non Ebola patients at that time…. after finishing treating Ebola patients they should not treat anyone without Ebola for 21 days and also stay away from situations which may cause mass infection should they have caught the disease
Reply With Quote
  #311  
Old 15.10.2014, 22:28
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 2,833
Groaned at 56 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,697 Times in 1,479 Posts
rainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
This whole thing has been a disaster from the moment the first cases in Africa were reported.
That was when? In February, I think?
Read an online-article in Wired or wherever a couple of weeks ago - the article itself was from April when doctors and researchers still hoped to have it "under control" by June or July.
Look where we're now....

I would be interested to know if the number of infections has already plateaued or is still rising.

At best, we can hope for a a very slow decline.

We are entering the Autumn and Winter season here - having more cases in Europe would probably cause a significant strain on the health-care system as people with normal colds would want to get tested for Ebola.
Imagine sitting in an overheated, overcrowded commuter-train like every day, people coughing and sneezing around you as usual - only to hear the next day that some infected person took the very same train.
Maybe (s)he was in the same compartment, maybe not....

People would freak out - I'd freak out, too.
Reply With Quote
  #312  
Old 15.10.2014, 22:33
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 2,833
Groaned at 56 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 2,697 Times in 1,479 Posts
rainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
I find it astonishing that she nursed Mr Duncan & 2 days later got on a commercial flight

Common sense would say that you have an Ebola nursing team…. they should not nurse any non Ebola patients at that time…. after finishing treating Ebola patients they should not treat anyone without Ebola for 21 days and also stay away from situations which may cause mass infection should they have caught the disease
You wish.
Easier said than done, apparently.
Because, meanwhile, in the Real World™:

http://www.20min.ch/schweiz/basel/st...enten-26674417
Reply With Quote
  #313  
Old 15.10.2014, 22:39
jacek's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Aargau
Posts: 7,790
Groaned at 98 Times in 77 Posts
Thanked 5,265 Times in 2,958 Posts
jacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

If you come to think of it and put paranoia aside, what are the chances for average inhabitant on this planet of being infected by the Ebola virus. Not only for us living from the distance but also for locals. One must bear in mind that Africa is a large continent and the recent outbreak is not a major cause of death. There are much more problems like malnutrition and poor sanitation which favour spread of any diseases making them all much more difficult to be contained than similar disasters in the First World countries. Just in a nutshell:

http://www.vox.com/cards/ebola-facts...virus-outbreak
Attached Thumbnails
recent-ebola-outbreak-image.jpg  
__________________
🎾That's what we do to help English speaking expats community in Switzerland:
General Information About Swiss Tennis
Tennis Lessons Summer Winter Seasons
🎾🎾Our charity organization to help unprivileged kids to realize their dreams:
FMTF Supports Tennis For Children in Southern Africa
Reply With Quote
  #314  
Old 15.10.2014, 23:02
Leggat's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Lenzburg
Posts: 234
Groaned at 8 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 252 Times in 116 Posts
Leggat has earned the respect of manyLeggat has earned the respect of manyLeggat has earned the respect of many
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
"Both the newly diagnosed nurse, who has yet to be identified, and Ms Pham
They may have updated the article, because I see two names, Ms Vinson, and Ms Pham, and the line above has been [poorly] edited to: ""Both the newly diagnosed nurseand"[sic]

They say one of them gets to go to the 'good' [successful at treating ebola] hospital, ..., why not both?
Reply With Quote
  #315  
Old 15.10.2014, 23:14
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Misery-Courtion
Posts: 17,817
Groaned at 299 Times in 231 Posts
Thanked 13,127 Times in 7,523 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
If you come to think of it and put paranoia aside, what are the chances for average inhabitant on this planet of being infected by the Ebola virus. Not only for us living from the distance but also for locals. One must bear in mind that Africa is a large continent and the recent outbreak is not a major cause of death. There are much more problems like malnutrition and poor sanitation which favour spread of any diseases making them all much more difficult to be contained than similar disasters in the First World countries. Just in a nutshell:

http://www.vox.com/cards/ebola-facts...virus-outbreak

Sorry jacek, but that chart's pretty irrelevant. Apart from HIV, Tuberculosis and Malaria none of the other stuff is catching and they've simply tagged the Ebola cases from this year so far on to 2012 figures.

Here's Wiki:
Projections of future cases

On 28 August, the WHO released its first estimate of the possible total cases (20,000) from the outbreak as part of its roadmap for stopping the transmission of the virus.[224] The WHO roadmap states "[t]his Roadmap assumes that in many areas of intense transmission the actual number of cases may be two- to fourfold higher than that currently reported. It acknowledges that the aggregate case load of EVD could exceed 20,000 over the course of this emergency. The Roadmap assumes that a rapid escalation of the complementary strategies in intense transmission, resource-constrained areas will allow the comprehensive application of more standard containment strategies within 3 months."[224] It includes an assumption that some country or countries will pay the required cost of their plan, estimated at half a billion dollars.[224]
When the WHO released its first estimated projected number of cases, a number of epidemiologists presented data to show that the WHO's projection of a total of 20,000 cases was likely an underestimate.
On August 31, the journal Science quoted Christian Althaus, a mathematical epidemiologist at the University of Bern in Switzerland, as saying that if the epidemic were to continue in this way until December, the cumulative number of cases would exceed 100,000 in Liberia alone.[225] According to a research paper released in early September, in the hypothetical worst-case scenario, if a BRN of over 1.0 continues for the remainder of the year we would expect to observe a total of 77,181 to 277,124 additional cases within 2014.[226]
On 9 September, Jonas Schmidt-Chanasit of the Bernhard Nocht Institute for Tropical Medicine controversially announced that the containment fight in Sierra Leone and Liberia has already been "lost" and that the disease would "burn itself out".[227]
Writing in the New York Times on 12 September, Bryan Lewis, an epidemiologist at the Virginia Bioinformatics Institute at Virginia Tech, said that researchers at various universities who have been using computer models to track the growth rate say that at the virus's present rate of growth, there could easily be close to 20,000 cases in one month, not in nine.[228]
On 8 September, the WHO warned that the number of new cases in Liberia was increasing exponentially, and would increase by "many thousands" in the following three weeks.
In a 23 September WHO report, the WHO revised their previous projection, stating that they expect the number of Ebola cases in West Africa to be in excess of 20,000 by 2 November.[6] They further stated, that if the disease is not adequately contained it could become endemic in Guinea, Sierra Leone and Liberia, "spreading as routinely as malaria or the flu",[229] and according to an editorial in the New England Journal of Medicine, eventually to other parts of Africa and beyond.[230]
In a 23 September CDC report, a projection calculates a potential underreporting which is corrected by a factor of 2.5. With this correction factor, approximately 21,000 total cases are the estimate for the end of September 2014 in Liberia and Sierra Leone alone. The same report predicted that total cases, including unreported cases, could reach 1.4 million in Liberia and Sierra Leone by 20 January 2015 if no improvement in intervention or community behaviour occurred.[11]
On 2 September, an assessment of the probability of Ebola virus disease case importation in countries across the world was published in PLOS Currents Outbreaks.[231] The projections are based on simulations of epidemic spread worldwide. The analysis was updated with simulations based on new data on 6 October, and the updated results are available online.[232]
On 14 October, during a news conference in Geneva, the assistant director-general of the WHO stated that there could be as many as 10,000 new Ebola cases per week by December 2014.[12]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebola_v...ica#Prevention

It says at the beginning of the Wiki page btw that the first case was reported back in December 2013 so they've had nearly a year now to get on top of this and haven't managed to.
Reply With Quote
  #316  
Old 15.10.2014, 23:19
3Wishes's Avatar
Moderately Amused
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Bern area
Posts: 7,561
Groaned at 51 Times in 47 Posts
Thanked 11,449 Times in 5,376 Posts
3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute3Wishes has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
I'm not disagreeing, just that when you are thousands of miles from the disease and it is happening to "those people" it's easy to think it won't get to your little hospital. Or, it was easy to think that way. Now I think the awareness and preparation will kick into a higher gear.
Let me clarify, since I think Tasebo misunderstood my words (and I didn't choose them well).

By "those people" I am not insulting Africans. I mean to say it's easy to discard news about areas of the world you are not near. "It's happening over there, not in my backyard, so I don't need to worry about it."

I have family in Texas, and they didn't even give Ebola a second thought because they have never been to Africa and don't know anyone who has (except me). Now that it's been brought to their doorstep, they are paying attention..
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank 3Wishes for this useful post:
  #317  
Old 15.10.2014, 23:26
Leggat's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Lenzburg
Posts: 234
Groaned at 8 Times in 5 Posts
Thanked 252 Times in 116 Posts
Leggat has earned the respect of manyLeggat has earned the respect of manyLeggat has earned the respect of many
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/10/14/he...erman-apology/

old news, heh, from last night.
Reply With Quote
  #318  
Old 15.10.2014, 23:39
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: basel
Posts: 223
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 181 Times in 88 Posts
ladylou is considered knowledgeableladylou is considered knowledgeableladylou is considered knowledgeable
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
I would be interested to know if the number of infections has already plateaued or is still rising.

At best, we can hope for a a very slow decline.
Just scroll down on island monkeys link:

"The WHO says it will declare the end of the outbreak in Senegal at the end of this week (17 October) and in Nigeria next week (20 October), if no new cases are detected before then."

Lets see...
Reply With Quote
  #319  
Old 15.10.2014, 23:50
cannut's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: canada
Posts: 6,575
Groaned at 178 Times in 138 Posts
Thanked 5,752 Times in 3,153 Posts
cannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond reputecannut has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Blame Obama I like that it use to be Blame Canada
Reply With Quote
  #320  
Old 15.10.2014, 23:57
jacek's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Aargau
Posts: 7,790
Groaned at 98 Times in 77 Posts
Thanked 5,265 Times in 2,958 Posts
jacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond reputejacek has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Recent Ebola outbreak

Quote:
View Post
Blame Obama I like that it use to be Blame Canada
Obama is already on it as he canceled campaign trip to meet with cabinet on Ebola. All under control

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/10/16..._r=0&referrer=
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
EHEC (E coli) outbreak Ittigen Family matters/health 77 19.06.2011 22:58
Measles outbreak in Geneva kodokan Family matters/health 13 23.02.2011 19:09
Ebola today, maybe the common cold tomorrow phdoofus International affairs/politics 1 02.06.2010 02:09
Zombie outbreak... can you survive? Richdog General off-topic 18 05.04.2009 11:39


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:15.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0