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  #121  
Old 21.06.2015, 10:26
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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Oh dear! Is Greenmount not reading from the Little Red Book?

Send her away for re-education! There's no place for heterodoxy on EF!

Of course Greenmount can have her say - she usually does.
I usually don't agree with though.
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  #122  
Old 21.06.2015, 11:14
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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I don't think at that age it is late! It really depends on the environment where you live/ socialise. I have not seen any LGBT people around us, so it is likely that my kids may go till their early/mid teens before we get the question! I think I may have seen one lady, who used to be a man (I think it was in Baden( but my kids did not even bat an eyelid. To them, she was a woman wearing a dress.
Maybe.. my home town LGBT community has a large presence and when my kids were little they visited my friends with me and saw them when they visited me so I did feel it necessary for them to understand from the off I suppose. I don't think you necessarily have to wait for direct questions though. My kids have asked me when they were little if they could ever change into a cat or dog (bless! <3 ) so I decided it was appropriate then, I told them they can't change from being human but they can change sex. Then I explained it involves operations and medicines (rather than spontaneously/magically/wishing hard enough!)
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  #123  
Old 21.06.2015, 11:18
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Re: Transexual as a coach

I will start by saying that I don't ( to my knowledge) know any transsexuals personally.

As far as the OP is concerned I don't think it's unreasonable to want to be informed about the new coach beforehand personally. A simple note saying that Monsieur X would be joining the coaching team as from next week would have been enough, no need to go into more detail than that and then the parents could decide what to do from there.

I think it would have been useful for a couple of reasons.

Firstly it would give the parents who wished to ( and who hadn't already done so) a chance to explain to their kids that the new coach was a bit 'different' in as much detail as they chose. The age range is quite broad and there's a big difference between what an 8 year old may have been told or encountered and a 12 year old.
If he is just starting out on the process he's going to look very odd to most of the children.

Secondly from the new coach's perspective it would mean the kids would be prepared before his arrival. Kids can be (unintentionally) very cruel and it could be quite unpleasant for him to have comments/finger pointing/sniggering etc from them when they first see him.

I suspect there'll be much discussion amongst the children in any case based on various bits of information they've received ( from parents, Internet etc) which may vary from extremely accurate graphic details to widely inaccurate assumptions and various others in between.

From the coaching aspect of it I don't see a problem as long as he/she us just doing their job as a coach.

Last edited by Belgianmum; 21.06.2015 at 15:37. Reason: Typos
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  #124  
Old 21.06.2015, 11:55
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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I will start by saying that I don't ( to my knowledge) know any transsexuals personally.
Don't encourage them!

Next they'll be telling us how all their best friends are black/Jewish/gay or whatever.

Validation by association: it's the thoroughly modern way to demonstrate your virtue!
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  #125  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:11
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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I was going to say I don't know any transgender folks, but then realised I actually know two (one of each). I'd forgotten about it, they're just a couple of people I know.
Same here. I simply forgot the fact some friends are transgender, and simply accept them as they are. There are a few friends I suspect of being transgender, yet insist they are not. Somewhere in the past, someone told me women cannot have Adam's apples as big as I've seen on them. I should stop staring.

To the OP. I don't think you can control what your daughter will be exposed to in this lifetime, unless you isolate yourselves from the world, and move to someplace like Antartica. You can't even control what takes place in her psyche. At most, you can damage it. I'm not convinced it is effective to try. Your daughter is not a computer robot. I suspect that if you insist and continue to try, the disconnect you will gain is not between your daughter and undesirable aspects of modern society, but a disconnection between you and your daughter.
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  #126  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:13
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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Validation by association: it's the thoroughly modern way to demonstrate your virtue!
People aren't demonstrating their own virtues. They're gently explaining to the Op that he really has nothing to worry about - in their experience, transsexuals are pretty normal people who just want to get on with their lives.

Isn't association and experience the the conduit that people use to hold judgments and views about almost anything?

How would you validate such things?
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  #127  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:14
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Re: Transexual as a coach

I don't know what we are all arguing about but I am pretty sure you are all wrong.

Perhaps a picture of puppies will help
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  #128  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:14
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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... unless you isolate yourselves from the world,
Well, there sure are people who moved to Switzerland for that reason.

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Isn't association and experience the conduit that people use to hold judgments and views about almost anything?
It's a shame the school holidays are coming soon, I could give that essay question to my class.
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  #129  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:17
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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How would you validate such things?
They're human. That's all the validation I need.
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  #130  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:23
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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They're human. That's all the validation I need.
But you're not the OP.

She has concerns. She's asking, not you!
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  #131  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:29
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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But you're not the OP.

She has concerns. She's asking, not you!
Bit early to be on the juice, Tom.
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  #132  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:30
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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But you're not the OP.

She has concerns. She's asking, not you!
How long have you been on EF? it's always about DB, regardless of who the OP is.
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  #133  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:53
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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How long have you been on EF? it's always about DB, regardless of who the OP is.
He asked me a direct question. I answered it.
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  #134  
Old 21.06.2015, 12:54
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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He asked me a direct question. I answered it.
You got lucky.
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  #135  
Old 21.06.2015, 13:30
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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Don't encourage them!

Next they'll be telling us how all their best friends are black/Jewish/gay or whatever.

Validation by association: it's the thoroughly modern way to demonstrate your virtue!
When you have seen and witnessed the suffering of a black/Jewish/gay - it's quite normal to understand what they went through, and sympathise, perhaps more than those who have not been in close contact with them. And understand they are different perhaps, but that does not make them dangerous! People who are not 'different' often are (dangerous)...

In the case of the young woman above (who was born male) - she suffered terrible bullying at school, and tried to commit suicide several times- until the psychiatrists agreed to the reversal which transformed her and her life. I didn't seek to meet her, or the friend I was with yesterday- they just happened to cross my path, somethow- and I am glad for it.
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  #136  
Old 21.06.2015, 15:07
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Re: Transexual as a coach

For those who were here in the 90's and watched SRF, you'll remember the documentary, "Traum: Frau," the story of Coco who transitioned from a man to a woman. Her story was very popular and got people talking about her situation back then. Coco has since committed suicide.

Watch the documentary (it's all in German) and you'll be surprised how how enlightening and insightful Coco and the SRF team were.

http://www.srf.ch/play/tv/srf-wissen...f-bac4fc4fc499

RIP Coco
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  #137  
Old 21.06.2015, 15:36
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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When you have seen and witnessed the suffering of a black/Jewish/gay - it's quite normal to understand what they went through

No, it isn't. In fact, it's pretty damn patronising to suggest that someone who isn't black, Jewish or gay has even the remotest notion of what it's like to be black, Jewish or gay.


I used to work with refugees. I heard stories that would make you bring your lunch back up. Do I know what it's like to be a refugee? Er, no. To suggest that I do would be ludicrous.


I do, on the other hand, know what it's like to be human. Sometimes it's great. Sometimes it isn't. I have judged others and been judged by others. I have taken a dislike to strangers on the flimsiest of grounds, and strangers have taken a dislike to me for similar reasons. Like anyone else, I try to see through the differences in other people and treat them simply as fellow humans. Sometimes I succeed. Sometimes I fail. But I keep at it, because it's the right thing to do.


It isn't the right thing to do because I knew a gay man once, or because some of my best friends are black, or because I read a newspaper article about the Warsaw Ghetto. It's the right thing to do regardless of these things.


If someone came onto EF and announced that she was concerned that her daughter's new coach was a Tatar, would all the members of EF who had never met a Tatar in their life stay out of the thread and leave it to those of us who had? Of course they wouldn't! Why, then, does it make a difference if someone once worked with a transsexual and found him "normal"?


As I said before: it's validation through association, and it's bollocks. As arguments for the decent and respectful treatment of fellow human beings go, it has to be about one of the worst.


But you all go ahead and tell us about your "surprisingly normal" friends. It just goes to show how virtuous you all are!


Well done!
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  #138  
Old 21.06.2015, 15:43
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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... perhaps more than those who have not been in close contact with them. And understand they are different perhaps, but that does not make them dangerous! People who are not 'different' often are (dangerous)...
You missed that bit. I was severely handicapped for a while, physically, and could not come up and down stairs, use public transport and get into most buildings, etc. I was so lucky that this only lasted for 2 years- but it certainly made me more aware of what it is like to feel so frustrated at the above.
Talking to those 3 friends who are transgender does not compare- but seeing their dispair, talking about their everyday lives- certainly did not make me know what it is like, but gave me a better understanding than if I had not met them and got close to them. End off.

Same listening to OH talk about his family split by Apartheid, or my best friend who had triplets when her other child was 18 months. Of course I'd never know what it was really like- but holding them tight ad listening to them did give me a better idea than if I had not.

Last edited by Odile; 21.06.2015 at 16:00.
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  #139  
Old 21.06.2015, 15:50
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Re: Transexual as a coach

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I was going to say I don't know any transgender folks, but then realised I actually know two (one of each). I'd forgotten about it, they're just a couple of people I know.
Yup, just folks,

I have friends some are fat, some thin, some gay, some straight, of varying skin tones, at least 2 vegans and some holy Joes... thing is it never struck me to ask what club they belonged to before I became friends with them.

Personally I'd trust a man wearing nail varnish over someone who won't eat abacon sandwich every time
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  #140  
Old 21.06.2015, 16:39
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Re: Transexual as a coach

[QUOTE=Papa Goose;2408208over someone who won't eat abacon sandwich every time[/QUOTE]

half our family do not eat bacon sandwiches ... and I would put my life in their hands. That comment really is way out of order
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