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-   -   Praemienverbilligung? [health insurance subsidy/discount] (https://www.englishforum.ch/family-matters-health/236526-praemienverbilligung-health-insurance-subsidy-discount.html)

giff 01.07.2015 22:30

Praemienverbilligung? [health insurance subsidy/discount]
 
Hi all,

SVA Zurich sent me a letter saying that the Gemeinde informed them that I should get a discount on the health insurance premium. Thing is, looking at the tables, I earn quite a bit more than the 43k chf limit for requesting such discount...

Anyone had a similar experience?

Thanks

Sbrinz 02.07.2015 08:27

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
The amount is based on your taxable income, not your gross income. Don't claim if you earn too much. Does that help?

giff 02.07.2015 08:39

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sbrinz (Post 2413741)
The amount is based on your taxable income, not your gross income. Don't claim if you earn too much. Does that help?

Also my taxable income, AFAIK, is higher than the threshold they mention.

plumtree 02.07.2015 08:44

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Was the letter personally addressed to you?

Sometimes the canton or Gemeinde sends out an unaddressed explanatory leaflet to every household detailing which situations are eligible for the Prämienverbilligung and reminding people of the deadline by which to apply since late applications are not accepted.

If it was a letter just for you, maybe they are basing their calculations on salaries earned/income declared from up to 4 years ago.

Sbrinz 02.07.2015 08:45

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Maybe it is easier to send everyone the paper work, than to to scour the tax records? Usually the investigated salary is for the period 2 years ago.

giff 02.07.2015 08:57

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Yes, it is addressed to me personally and it says that they calculated from my quellensteuerbeitrage that I should get a 523 chf discount. The letter just asks me to control the information, sign, and send it back...

I have been having the same salary since I moved back to Switzerland 2.5 years ago.

Maybe I should just sign it and send it back and get the discount? What would you do? :)

plumtree 02.07.2015 09:00

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by giff (Post 2413767)
Yes, it is addressed to me personally and it says that they calculated from my quellensteuerbeitrage that I should get a 523 chf discount. The letter just asks me to control the information, sign, and send it back...

I have been having the same salary since I moved back to Switzerland 2.5 years ago.

Maybe I should just sign it and send it back and get the discount? What would you do? :)

I would apply for the reduction, if that is what is offered. It is only an application and you are signing for information that is correct to your knowledge. The worst thing that can happen is that the application for a reduction for the year in question is declined.

Guest 02.07.2015 13:19

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by giff (Post 2413767)
Yes, it is addressed to me personally and it says that they calculated from my quellensteuerbeitrage that I should get a 523 chf discount. The letter just asks me to control the information, sign, and send it back...

I have been having the same salary since I moved back to Switzerland 2.5 years ago.

Maybe I should just sign it and send it back and get the discount? What would you do? :)

The taxes they used to calculate your benefit are from previous years, no? They probably based the benefit on a lower amount than you estimated. Why not check the info on the papers, see if they are correct, and if so, call SVA and ask them to clarify what exactly they based the benefit on (despite the paper stating it is your Quellensteuer, have SVA explain things to you in more detail)?
When you're clear about the basis of your benefit, you can then sign and send if the info on the paper is correct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by giff (Post 2413615)
Hi all,

SVA Zurich sent me a letter saying that the Gemeinde informed them that I should get a discount on the health insurance premium. Thing is, looking at the tables, I earn quite a bit more than the 43k chf limit for requesting such discount...

Anyone had a similar experience?

Thanks

It looks like they took your definitive tax data which they had on April 1, and think you will be living here on Jan 1 of next year. In which case the maximum amount for a single person to be eligible is a taxable income of 42'900.- and assets worth 150'000.-, and Quellensteuer of max. 3'757.- (see last line of the document).

Perhaps one of your values (income or assets or Quellensteuer) is lower than or equal to the amounts stated on the PDF and thus you might be entitled to benefits.

So, gather your tax documents and call them up. Good luck :)

MathNut 02.07.2015 13:31

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by plumtree (Post 2413771)
I would apply for the reduction, if that is what is offered. It is only an application and you are signing for information that is correct to your knowledge. The worst thing that can happen is that the application for a reduction for the year in question is declined.

Actually the worst thing that can happen is that you get the reduction but then have to leave the country when your current permit expires.

In (at least) some cantons, health insurance subsidies are considered a form of social aid, and can be grounds not to renew a permit.
Here's a thread on the subject:
http://www.englishforum.ch/permits-v...-what-now.html

plumtree 02.07.2015 14:09

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MathNut (Post 2413929)
Actually the worst thing that can happen is that you get the reduction but then have to leave the country when your current permit expires.

In (at least) some cantons, health insurance subsidies are considered a form of social aid, and can be grounds not to renew a permit.
Here's a thread on the subject:
http://www.englishforum.ch/permits-v...-what-now.html

That can't happen to this person as they earn enough to live on and are not entitled to/have not applied for social welfare benefits from their Gemeinde because unemployment benefits have now run out. Only in that case would a B-permit be considered for rescindment, not for being in receipt of a Krankenkasseprämienverbilligung, that shouldn't happen in any canton.

porsch1909 02.07.2015 14:19

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by plumtree (Post 2413964)
That can't happen to this person as they earn enough to live on and are not entitled to/have not applied for social welfare benefits from their Gemeinde because unemployment benefits have now run out. Only in that case would a B-permit be considered for rescindment, not for being in receipt of a Krankenkasseprämienverbilligung, that shouldn't happen in any canton.

Did you read the linked thread?

plumtree 02.07.2015 14:46

Re: Praemienverbilligung?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by porsch1909 (Post 2413973)
Did you read the linked thread?

Of course. I can only assume that that happened in that particular case because a C-permit was applied for. The requirements/checks for a C-permit are more thorough than those for extending a B-permit.

A B-permit will be extended if nothing has changed income-wise or even if the income has decreased and the B-permit-holder is on unemployment benefits or is ill.

Whilst applying for a C-permit triggers a series of verifications which also take time. The foreigner can remain though in Switzerland during the entire time the application for the C-permit is examined as well as during the time in which any appeal is ongoing.

AFC 02.07.2015 15:18

Re: Praemienverbilligung? [health insurance subsidy/discount]
 
It is also the case that if your savings are of a certain threshold you are not liable regardless of income.

plumtree 02.07.2015 17:19

Re: Praemienverbilligung? [health insurance subsidy/discount]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AFC (Post 2414018)
It is also the case that if your savings are of a certain threshold you are not liable regardless of income.

If you tell them you have savings, this reduces the chance of you obtaining the Verbilligung! I wouldn't tell them you have any savings, - this money should be well hidden and is for your future, a rainy day or emergencies. You might write on the form you have Fr. 200'000.-- savings, yet the following month utilize it to purchase a house. Then you don't have any savings.

Guest 02.07.2015 18:52

Re: Praemienverbilligung? [health insurance subsidy/discount]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by plumtree (Post 2414107)
If you tell them you have savings, this reduces the chance of you obtaining the Verbilligung! I wouldn't tell them you have any savings, - this money should be well hidden and is for your future, a rainy day or emergencies. You might write on the form you have Fr. 200'000.-- savings, yet the following month utilize it to purchase a house. Then you don't have any savings.

Oy.

I hope you aren't implying that OP should be dishonest about their savings. The SVA base their calculations on your tax papers, and being dishonest with those is probably fraud (getting money based on an incorrectly presented situation).
Definitely would strongly recommend against doing anything like this.

It would also be highly unfair to those who really need the subsidy.

plumtree 02.07.2015 21:07

Re: Praemienverbilligung? [health insurance subsidy/discount]
 
Quote:

Oy.

I hope you aren't implying that OP should be dishonest about their savings. The SVA base their calculations on your tax papers, and being dishonest with those is probably fraud (getting money based on an incorrectly presented situation).
Definitely would strongly recommend against doing anything like this.

It would also be highly unfair to those who really need the subsidy.
If this person is on a B-permit, there might not be any tax papers where it would be stated how much was declared in savings. Even if there are tax papers, the savings could have been spent in the meantime since the tax papers always are from a previous year.

I understand where you are coming from though and you are quite right to point this out, indicating that this (not declaring savings) could potentially be fraud, but it is up to each individual to decide what to declare and what not to. Savings can be moved around and this wouldn't be verified for a Krankenkasseprämienverbilligungsgesuch.

The threshold pertinent could be much higher than the savings that a person actually has and therefore be completely irrelevant, in this case it wouldn't matter whether Fr. 100.-- or Fr. 1'000.-- was declared as a figure for example.

Guest 02.07.2015 22:01

Re: Praemienverbilligung? [health insurance subsidy/discount]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by plumtree (Post 2414180)
If this person is on a B-permit, there might not be any tax papers where it would be stated how much was declared in savings. Even if there are tax papers, the savings could have been spent in the meantime since the tax papers always are from a previous year.

I understand where you are coming from though and you are quite right to point this out, indicating that this (not declaring savings) could potentially be fraud, but it is up to each individual to decide what to declare and what not to. Savings can be moved around and this wouldn't be verified for a Krankenkasseprämienverbilligungsgesuch.

The threshold pertinent could be much higher than the savings that a person actually has and therefore be completely irrelevant, in this case it wouldn't matter whether Fr. 100.-- or Fr. 1'000.-- was declared as a figure for example.

Would you kindly knock it off with the indirect hinting at how one possibly could skate around fulfilling their legal duties when applying for social benefits?!


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