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  #21  
Old 12.03.2018, 14:40
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

Small intermediate update:

I called my law insurance to understand the situation and the below is their feedback:

While the insurance that firm has may decide to pay / not pay the sickness "Taggeld", the obligation to comply with Art.324 stays. I.e. as a minimum the firm will have to provide salary payments for the period indicated in the ZH Skala, in my case this would be 10 weeks.

This afternoon I will talk to HR, hopefully everything will be ok, last thing I want is to have a conflict honestly.

I'll keep you posted!
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Old 12.03.2018, 18:13
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

Hi All,

Another update from my side - answer from HR assistant:

"Maybe your insurance covers this, they will send you a letter. If we they do not cover it, then we will discuss, maybe we cover it, we have to see".

I tried to be as calm as possible and just tried to clarify that this is something I'd need to know because they may appreciate there are significant costs behinf this.

Any recommendations on what to do next?

Thanks in advance
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  #23  
Old 12.03.2018, 21:14
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

Perhaps irrelevant.

Why would you go to Germany and pay out of your own pocket if you need a new hip for medical reasons?

I am surprised to hear that the Swiss basic insurance would not cover this
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  #24  
Old 12.03.2018, 22:16
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

I suppose you do not wish to tell us which country, whether EU or not?

I wish you the very best of luck- but let's imagine that, for any reasons, things get complicated, either at the time or later. Who would pick up the bill for any further complications, linked issues, further treatment, etc? Would you expect Swiss insurers to pick up the tab? Or your employer to cover for more time off, support, etc.? Especially if the method used is new/experimental.
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Old 13.03.2018, 00:36
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

@Doropfiz, thank you! That's again a good approach to progress on this, I will probably need to know like tomorrow, cos the surgery is booked next week

In addition, I think tomorrow I will call my superior too. The thing is, that if I have to do it Switzerland, I'd have to start again the process of finding a surgeon I trust and book the operation again.

In my view, This'd be a lose-lose situation in my view as I am rolling off this week of my consulting project, so i wouldn't be staffed on another one, before doing this surgery. So I'd be more weeks "Unstaffed", making my firm losing even more revenue...

@Edwin / Odile - I am doing my first surgery in Italy (hip), and my second surgery in Germany (Sport Hernia), so both in EU. Multiple reasons attached to it, such as closeness to family for practical and moral support, method (not experimental, but rather superior as all football / NBA stars get treated there) and higher competence of the surgeons from the experiences I had (not intended to be a generalization of course).

I intend to pick up the bill for medical expenses in general.
What is also very vague and ambiguous about this insurance clause is that there is a specific mention about treatment AND care.
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Old 13.03.2018, 08:36
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

moral of the story: if you want support from your insurance and your employer, clarify it in advance.

anyway, good luck and hope you'll have speedy recovery.
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Old 13.03.2018, 08:58
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

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moral of the story: if you want support from your insurance and your employer, clarify it in advance.

anyway, good luck and hope you'll have speedy recovery.
Hi K_and_e,

Thank you and also hope to recover asap.

I am not sure this applies as I had informed my employer and HR more than a month ago.

My employer probably doesn't even know there is this clause in the insurance, HR just came up with this last Friday....
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Old 13.03.2018, 13:29
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

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I am surprised to hear that the Swiss basic insurance would not cover this
It probably does, but only in Switzerland.

IIRC medical treatments outside of the country are paid if a) emergency or an acute case while you're abroad or b) treatment or sufficient alternative not available in Switzerland. Everything else performed abroad (including drugs bought abroad) is excluded. You won't get financed what someone considers to be best, but effetive and (cost-)efficient treatment.
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  #29  
Old 13.03.2018, 14:54
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

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It probably does, but only in Switzerland.

IIRC medical treatments outside of the country are paid if a) emergency or an acute case while you're abroad or b) treatment or sufficient alternative not available in Switzerland. Everything else performed abroad (including drugs bought abroad) is excluded. You won't get financed what someone considers to be best, but effetive and (cost-)efficient treatment.
Hi Urs Max, indeed i think it is what you mentioned, except the cost-effiecient part or at least, not cost-efficient for me Potentially the insurance could save if they ever decided to cover, but it's difficult to quantify their savings because they have processes in place with the swiss authorities, making it very efficient.

Anyway, as mentioned I am not really expecting that my health insurance covers this, it would be a nice plus. Rather, I am hoping my employer / insurance of my employeers provides me with the salary payment.
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Old 13.03.2018, 18:49
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

All,

An update on this:

Finally, after urging HR to double-check, I was told that should the sickness loss of earning insurance not cover, I would be given only the bare minimum indicated by the law, which, in my case, would amount to 10 weeks of salary.

I am satisfied that at least the law is being respected. However I am not of course thrilled that this is being done. But these are personal considerations and probably irrelavant for this thread

Moral -
1. Better have a law insurance to check these things
2. Ensure HR have checked their sources before providing you with an answer
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  #31  
Old 13.03.2018, 20:29
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

Those 10 weeks should cover your time abroad, shouldn't they? Then once you are back in Switzerland, a Swiss doctor can sign you off again if needed and the usual sick leave payment rules with the insurance company apply.
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Old 14.03.2018, 09:28
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

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Then once you are back in Switzerland, a Swiss doctor can sign you off again if needed and the usual sick leave payment rules with the insurance company apply.
I wouldn't count on that without prior confirmation. This may be seen as a follow-on, not a new incident, that is covered by ordinary insurance law rather than KVG (health insurance law), and the company apparently takes the position that they've alredy done their due. This may become particularly relevant in case of complications (you never know) that requires more than 10 weeks leave.
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  #33  
Old 14.03.2018, 10:19
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

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I wouldn't count on that without prior confirmation. This may be seen as a follow-on, not a new incident, that is covered by ordinary insurance law rather than KVG (health insurance law), and the company apparently takes the position that they've alredy done their due. This may become particularly relevant in case of complications (you never know) that requires more than 10 weeks leave.
Good point. Didn't think about that. As if surgery itself wasn't stressful enough, then one has to deal with the employer and insurance complexities.
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  #34  
Old 14.03.2018, 10:29
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

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Good point. Didn't think about that. As if surgery itself wasn't stressful enough, then one has to deal with the employer and insurance complexities.
even worse is if there are complications, you need to go back to the hospital in a foreign country.
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  #35  
Old 14.03.2018, 11:31
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

This is where I am struggling to understand now.

The insurance clause says that no benefits are granted for 1. treatment 2. care 3. childbirth taken abroad.

What if someone makes the "treatment" abroad (i.e. surgery), but the "care" (i.e. home-training for the first 4 weeks) in Switzerland? how would that work?

In general I am also trying to figure what is the point of having the clause... what difference does it make where you get treated?
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  #36  
Old 14.03.2018, 12:01
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

Marks, is your doctor in Switzerland involved in, or helping to coordinate, any of your treatment plans?
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Old 14.03.2018, 12:03
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

Hi Meloncollie,

No he's not really involved in this, would it make a difference in your view?

thank you!
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  #38  
Old 14.03.2018, 12:09
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

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Hi Meloncollie,

No he's not really involved in this, would it make a difference in your view?

thank you!
Where would you go for after-care? Check-ups? Medication if any needed?
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  #39  
Old 14.03.2018, 12:26
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

I was planning on doing my entire re-habilitation in a specialized center in Italy, including all of this.

Once I am back, I'd probably speak my GP (it's a bit of a stretch to say "MY" because in 5 years I have been only 2/3 times to him) if needed.

So far, I only informed him about my coming surgeries but I didn't involve him in the coordination of it.
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Old 14.03.2018, 14:40
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Re: Sick leave payment while taking surgery abroad

Did I get this right- you intend to have 1 surgery in 1 country and the other in another one? Could they not argue this will add quite a bit of extra time off?
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