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  #6501  
Old 07.04.2020, 10:24
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Re: Coronavirus

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Apparently does need oxygen and needs his vitals monitoring

There's plenty in ICU but not on vents for similar reasons.
Oxygen alone never used to require an ICU bed. Either he's worse off than the press are saying or he's getting the bed because he's the PM.
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  #6502  
Old 07.04.2020, 10:27
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Re: Coronavirus

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It is my genuine belief that it would be a positive thing for the world if Trump contracted COVID19 and was removed from office... of course preferably without dying.

Not just a positive thing for the USA and world at large, but actual poetic justice. I will be keeping my fingers crossed.

PS: Putln, Xl, 0rban, Erd0gan, Klm J0ng, all of these guys too...
I understand. But disagree that by one person's potential removal (and by tragic circumstances, too) the society would all of a sudden fix its ailments that they associate with their leadership.

I understand why people think that, lots of anxiety and inhibition going around to cloud one's own personal responsibility.

I know people who are still now behaving risky way (hang outside not keeping social distance) but would quickly blame the political leadership for keeping the borders open for too long. I think everything starts at home. The society is run on this principle here and I appreciate it.

If anything, I have empathy for political leaders who are now under a microscope and cannot be humans like us, get sick in privacy, heal in peace, are bugged even when in ICU...their details on medical secrets dragged all over the media. They are entitled to discretion, just because they don't claim it doesn't mean we shouldn't make room for that.

I would understand if they pretended that they aren't sick or are invincible just to keep people from panicking or to get away from all that media exposure when their lives are at stake. They are primarily human beings. And after that...some distance after that, they are politicians.

I wish all people to recover.
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Last edited by MusicChick; 07.04.2020 at 10:43.
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  #6503  
Old 07.04.2020, 10:30
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Re: Coronavirus

BTW when did the UK call it ICU vs ITU?
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  #6504  
Old 07.04.2020, 10:31
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Re: Coronavirus

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Oxygen alone never used to require an ICU bed. Either he's worse off than the press are saying or he's getting the bed because he's the PM.
It's because he's PM, I'm sure.
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  #6505  
Old 07.04.2020, 10:32
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Re: Coronavirus

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I understand why people think that, lots of anxiety and inhibition going around to cloud one's own personal responsibility.
If anything, anxiety and inhibition can make us more prudent. None of them good in excess, of course.
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  #6506  
Old 07.04.2020, 10:32
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Re: Coronavirus

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BTW when did the UK call it ICU vs ITU?
Probably when Grey's Anatomy peaked on TV.
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  #6507  
Old 07.04.2020, 10:38
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Re: Coronavirus

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Probably when Grey's Anatomy peaked on TV.
When I grew up I know it was ITU since it's where my mother worked, odd it changed.
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  #6508  
Old 07.04.2020, 10:48
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Re: Coronavirus

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When I grew up I know it was ITU since it's where my mother worked, odd it changed.
I worked in one, it was and still is a direct translation of ICU.

That said, I expect the focus from ICUs to shift to nursing homes and paliative care wards soon, that is where people are the most defenceless and probably not ready for people getting sick so fast that there isn't even time to shift them to ICUs.
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  #6509  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:00
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Re: Coronavirus

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If anything, I have empathy for political leaders who are now under a microscope and cannot be humans like us, get sick in privacy, heal in peace, are bugged even when in ICU...their details on medical secrets dragged all over the media. They are entitled to discretion, just because they don't claim it doesn't mean we shouldn't make room for that.

I would understand if they pretended that they aren't sick or are invincible just to keep people from panicking or to get away from all that media exposure when their lives are at stake. They are primarily human beings. And after that...some distance after that, they are politicians.

I wish all people to recover.
I wonder if you'd extend the same kind of altruistic views and wishes to someone like Hilary Clinton...
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  #6510  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:04
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Re: Coronavirus

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PTSD is one of the most insidious mental conditions to deal with because it's born from a loss of control of your surroundings and what you're confronted with, so overloads the sufferer with opposing control impluses and emotions (fight, flight, rage and despair), plus absolute denial that there is something wrong.
It's not necesarily a conscious denial. The brain does a marvellous job of papering over the cracks and holding on to both ends of your rope. Until it can't. And it's not always born out of a loss of control. Trauma has a myriad forms. This I know.
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  #6511  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:04
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Re: Coronavirus

There might be a relationship between the tuberculosis vaccine and lower contagion and lower mortality rates for the virus https://www.euronews.com/2020/04/06/...-for-a-century

Right now some trials being done in the Netherlands and Australia with healthcare workers to find out if the relation between the BCG vaccine and some immunity to covid19 really exists or just chance https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...w-coronavirus#
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  #6512  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:05
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Re: Coronavirus

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BTW when did the UK call it ICU vs ITU?
In our house, and just when OH was working there, it is still called Casualty (as it is on the telly )
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  #6513  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:08
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Re: Coronavirus

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BTW when did the UK call it ICU vs ITU?
It's been ICU and NICU for easily 20 years.
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  #6514  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:09
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Re: Coronavirus

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In our house, and just when OH was working there, it is still called Casualty (as it is on the telly )
Casualty is A&E. Very different department to Intensive Care.
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  #6515  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:10
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Re: Coronavirus

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There might be a relationship between the tuberculosis vaccine and lower contagion and lower mortality rates for the virus https://www.euronews.com/2020/04/06/...-for-a-century

Right now some trials being done in the Netherlands and Australia with healthcare workers to find out if the relation between the BCG vaccine and some immunity to covid19 really exists or just chance https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...w-coronavirus#
With all these ideas trials need to be based on randomised testing so the carers do not know which patient has the real stuff to avoid them subconsciously bending the results.

This is possibly the issue with the discussions around anti-malarial drugs.
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  #6516  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:11
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Re: Coronavirus

One guy from the Luzern council starts to talk about reopening shops by April 20. "population at risk" stays at home while everyone else resumes productive life

https://www.luzernerzeitung.ch/schwe...fte-ld.1210926
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  #6517  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:21
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Re: Coronavirus

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Actually it was 50% of those on ventilators that died according to a UK study, not "merely" intensive care. Although that was a very small sample (162) and I've seen other reports of nearer 25%.

In any event Johnson is in intensive care not ventilation and according to a Chinese study currently has a 17% chance of moving on to a ventilator.
read somewhere that those admitted to ICU typically go on ventilator within 24 hours
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  #6518  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:24
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Re: Coronavirus

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With all these ideas trials need to be based on randomised testing so the carers do not know which patient has the real stuff to avoid them subconsciously bending the results.

This is possibly the issue with the discussions around anti-malarial drugs.
It's impossible to do randomised testing. The BCG vaccine creates a unique blister and then a scar on your shoulder.

The real randomised testing is the natural experiment of countries with mandatory BCG vaccination and countries that don't apply that vaccine.
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  #6519  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:24
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Re: Coronavirus

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One guy from the Luzern council starts to talk about reopening shops by April 20. "population at risk" stays at home while everyone else resumes productive life

https://www.luzernerzeitung.ch/schwe...fte-ld.1210926

We are well ahead of that discussion curve here on EF.
Baselstadt figures for recent days are now 13, 23, 9, 10.
'Hiiiiii Hooooooo, Hiiiiiiii Hooooooo............'
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  #6520  
Old 07.04.2020, 11:28
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Re: Coronavirus

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I understand. But disagree that by one person's potential removal (and by tragic circumstances, too) the society would all of a sudden fix its ailments that they associate with their leadership...
there's also the notion that a society deserves its leadership. take Putin, some argue that Russians deserve him because their masses are so inert, gullible or whatever...
btw, he recently went to visit the main corona hospital and shook hands and hung out with the head doctor there (no masks) and said doctor tested positive shortly afterwards, but Putin not, so people are joking "Oh no, he is immortal!"

Last edited by jimk; 07.04.2020 at 11:38.
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