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Old 08.08.2020, 12:43
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Re: Coronavirus

This is a bit like discussing the result - and player of the match - of a football game after 27 minutes.

There have been times where the Swedish approach looked awful, now it is looking okay. But this is not over. and we see an uptick of cases now everywhere and not necessarily in the sequence and areas you would expect.

And no one has figured this out completely and found the one right approach.
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  #11442  
Old 08.08.2020, 13:43
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Re: Coronavirus

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Rather 5000 lives that could have been prolonged by a few months. Sweden's death rate is high because, as they freely admit, they mishandled care homes, just as many other countries have done. Take care homes out of the equation and Sweden's death rate isn't that bad.

Sweden flattened the curve with no lockdown, Sweden has had less of an economic impact thanks to no lockdown, Sweden has not imposed masks on the population, Sweden's population has not seen their basic rights restricted, Sweden's hospitals were never overrun. It is now almost without doubt that Sweden's strategy was better than the rest of Europe.
The Swedish COVID-19 death rate per million is over two and a half times the Swiss rate, I am very happy I live here.
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  #11443  
Old 08.08.2020, 15:19
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Re: Coronavirus

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Oh dear, chasing likes now by answering comments not even addressed to you unfortunately this approach appears all too often on this forum.

You accused me of posting “scaremongering nonsense” I responded to that. Chasing likes? Not even.
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  #11444  
Old 08.08.2020, 20:00
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Re: Coronavirus

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How do you know that? A few months? Seriously, how could you possibly know all these predictions for each individual case. The cynicism in this statement is astonishing.
I don't know that, in the same way that hellacopters doesn't know that 5000 lives would have been saved had Sweden rather gone into lockdown. That was rather the point I was trying to convey.

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You accused me of posting “scaremongering nonsense” I responded to that. Chasing likes? Not even.
You've been a member since February, SURELY by now you realise that the points you took issue with was a reply I was making to Pankakes

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Just because you repeat your lies, it does not make them anymore true. Swedish economy, compared to most comparable countries (meaning other Nordic countries) took as bad hit as others and while difference is that Sweden has 10x more people dead and continues to have higher death and new cases per day rate than them even today.
Excuse me? My lies!? I'm not the one claiming Sweden has done worse economically to her neighbours when economic data is yet to be published by those countries!
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  #11445  
Old 08.08.2020, 21:04
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Serious science

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...navirus-covid/
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  #11446  
Old 08.08.2020, 21:15
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Re: Coronavirus

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I don't know that, in the same way that hellacopters doesn't know that 5000 lives would have been saved had Sweden rather gone into lockdown. That was rather the point I was trying to convey.



You've been a member since February, SURELY by now you realise that the points you took issue with was a reply I was making to Pankakes



Excuse me? My lies!? I'm not the one claiming Sweden has done worse economically to her neighbours when economic data is yet to be published by those countries!
Depends where you look!
Coronavirus: economic impact in the Nordic countries
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  #11447  
Old 08.08.2020, 23:04
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Re: Coronavirus

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Oh dear! Reading comprehension is clearly not your forte.

Sweden decided to refrain from imposing a strict lockdown and follow the herd immunity approach, nobody is disputing that. Based on my reading they have not yet achieved herd immunity and still have a way to go.

Contrary to what you might think I do not use the UK winter flu statistics as my source of information about the coronavirus situation in Sweden.

Why would I want to be looking at articles edited in 2018? And how is the flu situation in the UK in 2017 in any way related to the coronavirus situation in 2020?
I know no matter how hard I will oppose to what is happening now in world I can't change agenda pushed by capitalist sharks, darling...but will wait for the end...then will go from that...comprehensive is from vulgar latin word comprende which literally mean totality...making faces are not meant to look smarter...Uk has more deaths from flu in winter 2017/2018 than in Coronavirus outbreak...connection between UK and Sweden are the leading epidemiologist of Sweden Anders Tegnell who worked closely with UK epidemiologists in past, even in Ebola outbreak in Afrika...
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  #11448  
Old 08.08.2020, 23:45
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Re: Coronavirus

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I know no matter how hard I will oppose to what is happening now in world I can't change agenda pushed by capitalist sharks, darling...but will wait for the end...then will go from that...comprehensive is from vulgar latin word comprende which literally mean totality...making faces are not meant to look smarter...
  • Uk has more deaths from flu in winter 2017/2018 than in Coronavirus outbreak.
..connection between UK and Sweden are the leading epidemiologist of Sweden Anders Tegnell who worked closely with UK epidemiologists in past, even in Ebola outbreak in Afrika...
"Uk has more deaths from flu in winter 2017/2018 than in Coronavirus outbreak."
You are not comparing like with like.
Flu season without lockdown versus COVID-19 season with lockdown.
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  #11449  
Old 08.08.2020, 23:52
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Re: Coronavirus

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Is there a recent antibodies study in Sweden? I mean, more recent than April.
Antibody numbers are pretty meaningless.

No antibodies doesn't mean not immune if your B and CD8 T cells are capable of producing the antibodies on demand. Antibodies decreasing following infection is normal.

Reinfection clearly isn't happening often .... yet (and even then is likely to be so far mostly in those who are young and easily shrugg of the disease and so don't produce a significant immune response). Give me an example of someone hospitalised with a serious infection who has been reinfected (months later please - a week or two could easily be a false negative).
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  #11450  
Old 09.08.2020, 00:11
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Re: Coronavirus

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"Uk has more deaths from flu in winter 2017/2018 than in Coronavirus outbreak."
You are not comparing like with like.
Flu season without lockdown versus COVID-19 season with lockdown.
Then how many died from normal flu this year?...can that be separated from Coronavirus?...nobody can argue that normal flu didn't was this year, because normally in the UK every year from '70 when they started to register the cases of flu infection, average dying was between 12-15K(1976-2010 years)...from 2010 starting dying more as the financing of NHS for elderly start sharply dropping...and then older people start dying more and more...
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  #11451  
Old 09.08.2020, 00:46
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How do you prepare for 'THE SECOND WAVE' ?

1. Bought a folding bike to avoid crowded stations, where possible can be stopped by our great policemen...
2. Bought some toilet rolls...last time have to queue for 3 hours in the morning to have some...My colleagues were telling me before paper disappeared to buy some...I didn't believe people can be so crazy...
3. Bought some cloth masks with joker smile as a sign of protest...but also bought some surgical in case that will meet very though policemen...

You guys, how did you prepared?...maybe I can inspire from some of the folks on the forum...
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  #11452  
Old 09.08.2020, 01:43
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Re: Coronavirus

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You've been a member since February, SURELY by now you realise that the points you took issue with was a reply I was making to Pankakes
How do you know there's a difference?
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Give me an example of someone hospitalised with a serious infection who has been reinfected (months later please - a week or two could easily be a false negative).
Look up the events involving the USS Teddy Roosevelt and its crew since late March.
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  #11453  
Old 09.08.2020, 02:27
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Re: How do you prepare for 'THE SECOND WAVE' ?

I can’t recall reading of anywhere in Switzerland that there was 3 hour waiting time to get into the supermarkets. At the hight of the lockdown you had to wait maybe 15 mins at my local supermarkets and no shortage of toilet paper either. So I don’t know where you’ve been shopping...

The country has a stock pile of between 3 to 6 months of food supplies and if you have followed the general recommendations that were enforced even before the lockdown you have sufficient food to do you for a week. You should know where your nuclear bunker is and it has another week’s worth of supplies. So apart from some additional mask, of which there are plenty, there is nothing to do.

Here is the best translation I can find of the national emergency plan. Note you should have a battery operated VHF radio.

And you should of course have your iodine tablets as well.
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  #11454  
Old 09.08.2020, 08:02
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Covid

The other day I got complained at in the store by a Swiss lady that I was not keeping enough distance when I clearly was. She then proceeded to complain that I was wearing a mask -- I could not believe it. The mask actually protects her more than me...
Then, I ovserved another lady complaining to a young men with special needs sitting in a bus without wearing a mask that he needs to wear a mask. She started to talk how cases are on the rise in a very aggressive way.

I am just wondering if this is pretty common here in Switzerland.
I never observed/experienced stuff like that in California where we have many more Covid cases. People seem to follow the guidelines in place while minding their own business, not trying to police others.
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  #11455  
Old 09.08.2020, 08:06
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Re: Covid

Yes it is pretty common especially in the German part, you'll hear the occasional comments about what one is supposed to do or not, sometimes with a good reason, more often than not just because, but they're basically harmless in my opinion. Don't take it very personally. (try not to)

Last edited by greenmount; 09.08.2020 at 08:26.
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  #11456  
Old 09.08.2020, 08:10
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Re: How do you prepare for 'THE SECOND WAVE' ?

We really need another Corona-related thread for this?

If you are concerned then just buy a few big packs of toilet roll now... it's not rocket science. Same with yeast, masks, disinfectant and similar stuff.
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  #11457  
Old 09.08.2020, 09:14
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Re: Coronavirus

Lockdown 'killed two people for every three who died of coronavirus' at peak of outbreak

Estimates show 16,000 people died through missed medical care by May 1, while virus killed 25,000 in same period

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...d-coronavirus/
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  #11458  
Old 09.08.2020, 09:19
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Re: Coronavirus

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Then how many died from normal flu this year?...can that be separated from Coronavirus?...nobody can argue that normal flu didn't was this year, because normally in the UK every year from '70 when they started to register the cases of flu infection, average dying was between 12-15K(1976-2010 years)...from 2010 starting dying more as the financing of NHS for elderly start sharply dropping...and then older people start dying more and more...
"can that be separated from Coronavirus" Um, UK corona virus deaths are only reported when the death certificate listed coronavirus.
Edit: it is a notifiable disease so cases have to be reported.
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  #11459  
Old 09.08.2020, 09:28
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Re: Coronavirus

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I know no matter how hard I will oppose to what is happening now in world I can't change agenda pushed by capitalist sharks, darling...but will wait for the end...then will go from that...comprehensive is from vulgar latin word comprende which literally mean totality...making faces are not meant to look smarter...Uk has more deaths from flu in winter 2017/2018 than in Coronavirus outbreak...connection between UK and Sweden are the leading epidemiologist of Sweden Anders Tegnell who worked closely with UK epidemiologists in past, even in Ebola outbreak in Afrika...
Who are those capitalist sharks who push an agenda, in your opinion? I would say they are old money people who can't wait for everything to go back to "normal" even if that means many many avoidable deaths along the way.

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The world has survived the crash of 1929, world wars, Enron and the following bank crash, it will survive this. Hopefully in a better and maybe also more environmental friendly way.
Old money are trembling now. We'll have to come up with a more sustainable economic model, now that will shake a bit the establishment.
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  #11460  
Old 09.08.2020, 09:35
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Re: Coronavirus

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Lockdown 'killed two people for every three who died of coronavirus' at peak of outbreak

Estimates show 16,000 people died through missed medical care by May 1, while virus killed 25,000 in same period

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/202...d-coronavirus/
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That is just an estimate,
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