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  #11941  
Old 24.08.2020, 19:11
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Re: Coronavirus

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- median age of people who died was 86 (women) and 83 (men)
Life expectance of men in CH is 81.7 for women 85.5 so they lived longer than average. Does not seem anything to be too worried about.
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  #11942  
Old 24.08.2020, 19:41
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Re: Coronavirus

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Summary from BAG's epidemiological status assessment dated 19 August:
- 97% (!) of all deaths occurred in people with at least one pre-condition
- 85% of all hospitalizations occurred in people with at least one pre-condition
- median age of people who died was 86 (women) and 83 (men)
- median age of hospitalizations so far was 73 (women) and 69 (men)
- even "cases", meaning positive infections, showed a median age of 48 (women) and 50 (men)

Yes. This certainly is a totally reasonable foundation to continue to restrict freedoms of all 8.6m people in whatever shape or form.

Now bring on the groans given some still don't want to believe any of it, even if you throw actually proof at them from official sources.

https://www.bag.admin.ch/bag/en/home...rnational.html
So you think that we should have just let the virus spread un-checked and let people die and slowly suffocate because they have a preexisting condition?

"The true measure of any society can be found in how it treats its most vulnerable members" -- Mahatma Gandhi

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Life expectance of men in CH is 81.7 for women 85.5 so they lived longer than average. Does not seem anything to be too worried about.
Do you really think that someone deserves to slowly suffocate to death simply because they're a certain age?
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  #11943  
Old 24.08.2020, 19:53
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Re: Coronavirus

Are we in the world of Logan's Run yet?
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  #11944  
Old 24.08.2020, 21:07
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Re: Coronavirus

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So you think that we should have just let the virus spread un-checked and let people die and slowly suffocate because they have a preexisting condition?

That's an absurd statement.
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  #11945  
Old 24.08.2020, 21:12
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Re: Coronavirus

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That's an absurd statement.
It might be a tiny bit less absurd if we accomodate for the same sentiment regarding all health threats that exist.

Which we don't.
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  #11946  
Old 24.08.2020, 22:33
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Re: Coronavirus

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Life expectance of men in CH is 81.7 for women 85.5 so they lived longer than average. Does not seem anything to be too worried about.
Life expectancy at age 83 to 86 is 7 to 8 years. That is what the virus has cost them.
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  #11947  
Old 25.08.2020, 01:09
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Re: Coronavirus

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Life expectance of men in CH is 81.7 for women 85.5 so they lived longer than average. Does not seem anything to be too worried about.
Funny how actual experience blows the perception of median and averages out of the water. I only know 3 people who've died from covid. They were 53, 60 and 61. My partner's 58yr old cousin was finally discharged from hospital on Saturday after a month. She's been given an oxygen machine that she needs to use several times a day during her home recovery stage. She's a tall, slim, active business owner with no previous underlying health conditions, and from a family where most of the women live well into their 80s and 90s.
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  #11948  
Old 25.08.2020, 01:52
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Re: Coronavirus

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Life expectance of men in CH is 81.7 for women 85.5 so they lived longer than average. Does not seem anything to be too worried about.
I don't think you understand the difference between medians and means (or averages). Samaire13 quoted the median age of the men and women who have died from COVID-19. We know the disease kills disproportionately more older people than younger. Most of the deaths would have been in that "older people" segment, hence the median being where it is.

The life expectancy figures are means and apply to children born around the present time (depending where the figures came from). As baboon points out, men aged 81.7 in 2020 could expect to live to around 89, and women aged 85.5 today, to about 93. So yes, it's a big deal. A lot of time stolen from them, but also from their children and grandchildren. Not everything is about numbers and economics.
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  #11949  
Old 25.08.2020, 09:43
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Re: Coronavirus

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I don't think you understand the difference between medians and means (or averages). Samaire13 quoted the median age of the men and women who have died from COVID-19. We know the disease kills disproportionately more older people than younger. Most of the deaths would have been in that "older people" segment, hence the median being where it is.

The life expectancy figures are means and apply to children born around the present time (depending where the figures came from). As baboon points out, men aged 81.7 in 2020 could expect to live to around 89, and women aged 85.5 today, to about 93. So yes, it's a big deal. A lot of time stolen from them, but also from their children and grandchildren. Not everything is about numbers and economics.
It's probably fair to assume that those in their 80s who didn't survive were in worse health that those who did though.
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  #11950  
Old 25.08.2020, 09:54
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Re: Coronavirus

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It's probably fair to assume that those in their 80s who didn't survive were in worse health that those who did though.
UK deaths have been lower than average for 8 weeks now, many who died would have died of something else by now.
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  #11951  
Old 25.08.2020, 11:24
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Re: Coronavirus

There's an interesting opinion piece at BBG, the overall mortality rate on 2020 is approaching to the 1918 influenza in NYC....and there's still 4 colder months to go https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...o-top-1918-flu



Another interesting part is that the 1918 influenza and covid19 are nothing compared to cholera epidemics. People looking at numbers say don't worry, is there something else? I think so. It's important to remember the narrative of the last century. "We" have defeated infectious diseases, all we have to worry is about cancer and Alzheimer. Infectious diseases are only endemic to places with poor sanitation, epidemic of infectious diseases only happens to people without toilets, not to "us". Even if the covid19 looks small in comparison to any 19th century cholera epidemic, it kills the narrative of the defeat of infectious diseases in the developed world. It's not the magnitude of the mortality rate what matters but the incertitude left after the triumph narrative is crushed down by reality. At least I hope this helps to raise awareness on antibiotic resistance issue.
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  #11952  
Old 25.08.2020, 12:02
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Re: Coronavirus

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There's an interesting opinion piece at BBG, the overall mortality rate on 2020 is approaching to the 1918 influenza in NYC....and there's still 4 colder months to go https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...o-top-1918-flu



Another interesting part is that the 1918 influenza and covid19 are nothing compared to cholera epidemics. People looking at numbers say don't worry, is there something else? I think so. It's important to remember the narrative of the last century. "We" have defeated infectious diseases, all we have to worry is about cancer and Alzheimer. Infectious diseases are only endemic to places with poor sanitation, epidemic of infectious diseases only happens to people without toilets, not to "us". Even if the covid19 looks small in comparison to any 19th century cholera epidemic, it kills the narrative of the defeat of infectious diseases in the developed world. It's not the magnitude of the mortality rate what matters but the incertitude left after the triumph narrative is crushed down by reality. At least I hope this helps to raise awareness on antibiotic resistance issue.
Looks more like the level of Hong Kong flu from 1968
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  #11953  
Old 26.08.2020, 04:45
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Re: Coronavirus

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So you think that we should have just let the virus spread un-checked and let people die and slowly suffocate because they have a preexisting condition?

"The true measure of any society can be found in how it treats its most vulnerable members" -- Mahatma Gandhi



Do you really think that someone deserves to slowly suffocate to death simply because they're a certain age?
Yes. The world has sacrificed billions because of C-19 but has it made the same investment to combat cancer? Which is the bigger annual killer?
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  #11954  
Old 26.08.2020, 07:52
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Re: Coronavirus

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Yes. The world has sacrificed billions because of C-19 but has it made the same investment to combat cancer? Which is the bigger annual killer?
Thank goodness you're not in charge of running "the world".....
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  #11955  
Old 26.08.2020, 07:55
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Re: Coronavirus

On the radio this morning, the CFR of Covid has reduced to a third of what it was at the beginning of the pandemic, as the medical services now have some experience of dealing with it.
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Old 26.08.2020, 08:00
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Re: Coronavirus

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There's an interesting opinion piece at BBG, the overall mortality rate on 2020 is approaching to the 1918 influenza in NYC....and there's still 4 colder months to go https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...o-top-1918-flu



.............. it kills the narrative of the defeat of infectious diseases in the developed world. It's not the magnitude of the mortality rate what matters but the incertitude left after the triumph narrative is crushed down by reality.
Not sure; the peaks are due to outbreaks of infectious diseases, then and now. The generally much higher baselines in days gone by are due to ....... lower mortality during childbirth, decreased infant mortality due to decreased infectious diseases, better hygiene and sanitation leading to less infectious diseases, vaccinations, antibiotics?
Really interesting to know how it breaks down

This: At least I hope this helps to raise awareness on antibiotic resistance issue.
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  #11957  
Old 26.08.2020, 08:05
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Re: Coronavirus

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That's an absurd statement.
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It might be a tiny bit less absurd if we accomodate for the same sentiment regarding all health threats that exist.

Which we don't.
It’s so weird even now how many of these banal platitudes receives any number of likes. It's the gigantic straw (wicker) man flourish at the end that really makes it

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Yes. The world has sacrificed billions because of C-19 but has it made the same investment to combat cancer? Which is the bigger annual killer?
Just the 35,000-100,000 extra cancer deaths now estimated in the UK alone as a result of the Covid lockdown. Far more than who have actually died from Covid
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Old 26.08.2020, 09:51
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Re: Coronavirus

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Just the 35,000-100,000 extra cancer deaths now estimated in the UK alone as a result of the Covid lockdown. Far more than who have actually died from Covid
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Old 26.08.2020, 09:59
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Re: Coronavirus

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Just the 35,000-100,000 extra cancer deaths now estimated in the UK alone as a result of the Covid lockdown. Far more than who have actually died from Covid
Estimated at a worst case 35,000. Note worst case.
https://www.bbc.com/news/health-53300784

Which you have to compare to the lives SAVED by the lockdown.

Oh and I would actually agree that this is one of many things the UK government screwed up. There was no need to suspend cancer screening as the resources needed for that were not particularly transferable to Covid care.
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  #11960  
Old 26.08.2020, 10:04
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Re: Coronavirus

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How long before he realises...
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