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  #161  
Old 04.04.2020, 09:54
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Re: Face Masks

I see a few virtue signalling mask wearers walking about outside.
No idea why they are wasting masks like that.
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  #162  
Old 04.04.2020, 10:19
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Re: Face Masks

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I see a few virtue signalling mask wearers walking about outside.
No idea why they are wasting masks like that.
Perhaps because even the WHO has now worked out they will help to reduce transmission. Latest research suggests that droplet transmission is the primary vector - and droplets are produced by simple talking, not just coughing or sneezing. So yes, masks are looking important in helping to reduce the disease.

Seems the earlier advice was mostly driven by the need to preserve mask supplies for healthcare professionals. But now mask supply is improved time to adopt.

Link below has an interesting discussion plus instructions on how to make a simple mask yourself.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ovid-19-public
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  #163  
Old 04.04.2020, 10:24
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Re: Face Masks

Can anyone tell me of anywhere in Switzerland where one can actually buy masks? Not the best ones, but ones you can use when shopping and then dispose of?

And now that Trump has decided to seize other countries masks from third countries, I can't see the situation has been improved. Bar Steward.

We've been thinking of making our own, but some of the stuff needed (elastic cords, etc.) can't be found in the shops that are open. Any hints here?
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  #164  
Old 04.04.2020, 10:25
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Re: Face Masks

There‘s a really simple instruction for a mask using a bandana, cloth napkin or other similar object, folded over hair elastics, for example. If you‘re just going to the store, this is a possibility, if you want to use one.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/how-t...b63e06281d87d9
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  #165  
Old 04.04.2020, 10:33
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Re: Face Masks

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Sorry but they seem like they have been living under a rock. Back in end Jan scientists already knew there were asymtomatic patients who can unknowingly infect others through contact tracking. Why does it take them two months to consider this “new evidence“?
Two words. Donald Trump.

His ego will never let him allow anyone to prove he was ever wrong. So they have to phrase their releases accordingly.
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  #166  
Old 04.04.2020, 10:42
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Re: Face Masks

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And now that Trump has decided to seize other countries masks from third countries, I can't see the situation has been improved. Bar Steward.
He's doing what Germany was doing. He's got to look after the USA first, that's his job.
Can you imagine the furore if there is not enough masks in the USA and they are shipping them abroad?
We've already seen what a thin veneer the EU is, why would any country be different.
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  #167  
Old 04.04.2020, 10:44
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Re: Face Masks

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Perhaps because even the WHO has now worked out they will help to reduce transmission.
Transmission to whom exactly if you are outside walking along?
Even if the person was infectious, the dilution of breath after 2m makes the wearing of one pointless, outside.
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  #168  
Old 04.04.2020, 10:46
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Re: Face Masks

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He's doing what Germany was doing. He's got to look after the USA first, that's his job.
Can you imagine the furore if there is not enough masks in the USA and they are shipping them abroad?
We've already seen what a thin veneer the EU is, why would any country be different.
Another pertinent fact which is often omitted from the headlines is that private U.S. individuals and companies went to outbid EU countries and they paid upfront. Hence it's a matter of economics. Whereas Germany simply implemented a rule under the mantle of "personal use in times of crisis" which in my opinion makes a huge difference.
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  #169  
Old 04.04.2020, 11:31
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Re: Face Masks

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Can anyone tell me of anywhere in Switzerland where one can actually buy masks? Not the best ones, but ones you can use when shopping and then dispose of?

I would also like to know.


A similar shortage happened in Italy, but now you can buy them in pharmacies and they are even distributed together with newspapers, or delivered door-to-door. And they are clearly not out of the woods, therefore demand is still high, they simply activated new means of production and distribution.


Why is it still impossible to get them in Switzerland?



I would really like to have some at home, for a simple reason. I am stuck home with wife and two kids. I only go to the grocery every 10 days, but I have some minimal contact with other people (deliveries, neighbors, etc.). If I wake up one morning with just a little bit of fever or cough, I want to be able to wear a mask until I find out what's that. The consequences of both of us getting sick would be disastrous, especially in terms of taking care of the kids.
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  #170  
Old 04.04.2020, 11:52
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Re: Face Masks

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Can anyone tell me of anywhere in Switzerland where one can actually buy masks? Not the best ones, but ones you can use when shopping and then dispose of?

And now that Trump has decided to seize other countries masks from third countries, I can't see the situation has been improved. Bar Steward.

We've been thinking of making our own, but some of the stuff needed (elastic cords, etc.) can't be found in the shops that are open. Any hints here?
elastic cords, fabric, needles, etc:

https://www.stoffkiste.ch/
https://www.kreando.ch/

and maybe google some other sewing shops near where you live, a lot of them still shipping, mine arrived 3-4 days average.
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  #171  
Old 04.04.2020, 12:06
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Re: Face Masks

Talk to any doctor or pharmacist, if you are healthy you don't need a mask. There are not enough around so donate them to the hospitals or sick people.

In a perfect world where there was 10 masks for each person yes they could help a tiny little bit if you are healthy, but we don't live in that world. Don't be part of the problem like the TP hoarders.

Buy gloves and wash your hands. Stay home.
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  #172  
Old 04.04.2020, 12:17
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Re: Face Masks

Posted by my mate 2hrs ago when she got home from the night shift at the local hospital.

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Can confirm, 7 hours in an ffp3 mask makes you feel like you've been punched in the nose for a bit afterwards.
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  #173  
Old 04.04.2020, 12:27
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Re: Face Masks

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Talk to any doctor or pharmacist, if you are healthy you don't need a mask. There are not enough around so donate them to the hospitals or sick people.

In a perfect world where there was 10 masks for each person yes they could help a tiny little bit if you are healthy, but we don't live in that world. Don't be part of the problem like the TP hoarders.

Buy gloves and wash your hands. Stay home.
Please read the previous posts.

-Talk to any doctor or pharmacist, if you are healthy you don't need a mask.(already been discussed, two school of thoughts, already a lot of doctors n scientists recommends them, and you don't know if you're healthy as you can be asymptomatic, and still infectious)

-Don't be part of the problem like the TP hoarders. (exactly why I started this thread looking for DIY solutions, I already mentioned since the beginning we should not buy masks and reserve them for hospitals)

-Buy gloves and wash your hands. Stay home. (we're already doing that, we're only considering masks as one of the measures, add: personally I'm not sure about gloves tho, washing hands should be enough?)

Thanks.

Last edited by spaghetti; 04.04.2020 at 13:04.
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  #174  
Old 04.04.2020, 13:31
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Re: Face Masks

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Talk to any doctor or pharmacist, if you are healthy you don't need a mask.
Here is the Catch-22: You do not know if you are healthy or already infected and contagious w/o symptoms. Sorry, but this sounds like in the late '80s early '90s when people said they only have unprotected sex with healthy, clean people. Yep you might have guessed right, they got AIDS , not HIV but full blown AIDS (and they died). Because guess what, seemingly healthy people can be contagious too.

Fact One: It is known, for many years, that droplets can spread much further than the WHO 1.5 meters, the CDC 6 feets, or the BAG 2 meters. It is in fact up to 8 meters!

You might inform yourself about the research down by Prof. Lydia Bourouiba and her team from MIT (Videos are all pre-Corona b.t.w).
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...5hmk9vgOnFx6Nd

Fact Two: "Feuchte aussprache" (wet speak) is not just bad manners but happens all the time we orally communicate.
https://youtu.be/LLzMDvzWeV8

Fact three: The US CDC has now this stance https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...revention.html about protecting others and regarding face masks made from cloths
Quote:
Cover your mouth and nose with a cloth face cover when around others
You could spread COVID-19 to others even if you do not feel sick.
  • Everyone should wear a cloth face cover when they have to go out in public, for example to the grocery store or to pick up other necessities.
  • Cloth face coverings should not be placed on young children under age 2, anyone who has trouble breathing, or is unconscious, incapacitated or otherwise unable to remove the mask without assistance.
  • The cloth face cover is meant to protect other people in case you are infected.
  • Do NOT use a facemask meant for a healthcare worker.
  • Continue to keep about 6 feet between yourself and others. The cloth face cover is not a substitute for social distancing.
(This is already elevated from what doropfiz posted earlier where the US CDC recommended cloth masks "where other social distancing measures are difficult to maintain".)

With the Germans (see a previous post) and the Japanese which will send out two cloth face masks to each household ( https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/20...-household-abe ) we have now at least a third country which officially think cloth face masks can help to reduce the spread of viral loaded droplets and to curb the transmission just a tiny bit more Remember: social distancing and all hygiene rules must still be followed. Cloth mask are just an extra measure on top. Like Airbags where you must still buckle up and drive prudently.

I am certain more countries will follow and possible the WHO soon too. Knowing the reaction and adoption time of my country it might be the very last some when in 2071 (Appenzell Innerrhoden 2090).
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  #175  
Old 04.04.2020, 13:38
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Re: Face Masks

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He's doing what Germany was doing. He's got to look after the USA first, that's his job.
Can you imagine the furore if there is not enough masks in the USA and they are shipping them abroad?
We've already seen what a thin veneer the EU is, why would any country be different.
The Swiss masks were produced by a third country but were being shipped here via Germany. An overzealous customs official seized them thinking it was contrary to Germany’s restrictions on the export of such goods.

It wasn’t and a simple phone call got them released.

In the other case the Berlin Police ordered masks from 3M, a US company, who produced the order in their Chinese factories and shipped them. For some reason, not yet known, they were seized at a transit point (Bangkok) and diverted to the US.

Not exactly the same thing. A simple mistake and piracy are a little different.
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  #176  
Old 04.04.2020, 13:46
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Re: Face Masks

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The Swiss masks were produced by a third country but were being shipped here via Germany. An overzealous customs official seized them thinking it was contrary to Germany’s restrictions on the export of such goods.

It wasn’t and a simple phone call got them released.

In the other case the Berlin Police ordered masks from 3M, a US company, who produced the order in their Chinese factories and shipped them. For some reason, not yet known, they were seized at a transit point (Bangkok) and diverted to the US.

Not exactly the same thing. A simple mistake and piracy are a little different.
a simple phone call got them released“. Where did you get this information from? According to my info. 200‘000 masks were pirated according to a new law that Trump has enacted. Would be happy to hear if that‘s not true.
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  #177  
Old 04.04.2020, 13:56
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Re: Face Masks

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„a simple phone call got them released“. Where did you get this information from? According to my info. 200‘000 masks were pirated according to a new law that Trump has enacted. Would be happy to hear if that‘s not true.
Trump pirated masks with destination Switzerland in Germany How the f. did they do that, and when? Through Ramstein or what? Now, we are truly f-ed. Source for that bold claim? Or did you simply misread and not understand do what situation "a simple phone call got them released" refers to?

Note: It is was about the resolvment of the Swiss-German situation, which had actually two stories. One was a container with masks manufactured outside EU/EEA/EFTA blocked at a German port by overreacting port authorities and one was a shipment of medical goods manufactured in Germany blocked by German customs. The "simple phone call" refers to the former.

In one thing you were right. It was more than "a simple phone call" and it involved diplomacy on the highest level, even involving the EU and the situation is still not fully resolved as some shipments were still blocked on March 25th by German and French authorities.
https://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/schweiz...story/29428234
https://www.nzz.ch/schweiz/deutschla...ein-ld.1546320
https://www.nzz.ch/wirtschaft/eu-gib...0?reduced=true
https://telebasel.ch/2020/03/25/lief...channel=105105
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  #178  
Old 04.04.2020, 13:58
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Re: Face Masks

https://www.wired.com/story/its-time...ca-masks-work/

this article covers a lot of points we mentioned.
and links to the researches.
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  #179  
Old 04.04.2020, 14:12
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Re: Face Masks

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Trump pirated masks with destination Switzerland in Germany How the f. did they do that, and when? Through Ramstein or what? Now, we are truly f-ed. Source for that bold claim? Or did you simply misread and not understand do what situation "a simple phone call got them released" refers to?

Note: It is was about the resolvment of the Swiss-German situation, which had actually two stories. One was a container with masks manufactured outside EU/EEA/EFTA blocked at a German port by overreacting port authorities and one was a shipment of medical goods manufactured in Germany blocked by German customs. The "simple phone call" refers to the former.

In one thing you were right. It was more than "a simple phone call" and it involved diplomacy on the highest level, even involving the EU and the situation is still not fully resolved as some shipments were still blocked on March 25th by German and French authorities.
https://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/schweiz...story/29428234
https://www.nzz.ch/schweiz/deutschla...ein-ld.1546320
https://www.nzz.ch/wirtschaft/eu-gib...0?reduced=true
https://telebasel.ch/2020/03/25/lief...channel=105105
Yes, that’s ‚old news’. Are we talking about the same case?:

From the BBC today:

The US has been accused of redirecting 200,000 Germany-bound masks for its own use, in a move condemned as "modern piracy".
The local government in Berlin said the shipment of US-made masks was "confiscated" in Bangkok.
The FFP2 masks, which were ordered by Berlin's police force, did not reach their destination, it said.
Andreas Geisel, Berlin's interior minister, said the masks were presumably diverted to the US.
The US company that makes the masks, 3M, has been prohibited from exporting its medical products to other countries under a Korean-War-era law invoked by President Donald Trump.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-52161995
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  #180  
Old 04.04.2020, 14:25
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Re: Face Masks

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a simple phone call got them released“. Where did you get this information from? According to my info. 200‘000 masks were pirated according to a new law that Trump has enacted. Would be happy to hear if that‘s not true.
We are talking about two different things. Please reread my posts.
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