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Old 24.06.2020, 23:37
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Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

Hi everyone,
I have read the forum, but have not found an answer for my situation.
After one year of marriage (no kids), it turned out that my new wife has another relationship(s). We have decided to divorce , as I find it no more a healthy situation for building a family.

The question is, that she is not from EU. And I don't want to cause her too much troubles. She is working full time, same as me and wants to stay in Switzerland. We both have "B" for five years

The question is will she be able to? As far as I understood, that if I sign divorce papers, will she have two years, as she will not sign of course.
Or should I keep it a secret to authorities and notify them later in two years?
I could give two years, but not four, as I am in my middle ages.

Thank you so much in advance for any advice, as the loyer or gemainde could potentially heat up the situation
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Old 25.06.2020, 14:07
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

Welcome to the Forum. As you posted this late last night, have a bump. I'm sorry to hear you're in this situation.

If she's non-EU, her permit is dependent upon yours. She can work because of that dependent permit. If you leave Switzerland, she no longer has a right to work or live here unless she qualifies for an independent permit. Once you're divorced it's the same situation.

I know you don't want to make things hard on her, but she's the one who has moved on to a new relationship. Don't lie to authorities or sacrifice yourself for someone like that.

I don't know how permits work during separation, how long separation lasts, etc. so hopefully someone with more knowledge will be along soon with some info.
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Old 25.06.2020, 14:52
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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I don't know how permits work during separation, how long separation lasts, etc. so hopefully someone with more knowledge will be along soon with some info.
Thank you for your advice, 3Wishes, and words of empathy!

As the authorities state,-2 years after starting living together, that means, potentially, if i notify the authorities only after 2 years, they will start counting from then, meaning i would be „married“ for 4 years.

Regarding her right of stay, citate from ch.ch:

"A divorced spouse’s or a child’s existing residence permit may be extended provided:

the marriage lasted at least three years in Switzerland and the spouse / family lived together... „

If we register at different adresses, that would mean, she would have to leave immidiately
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Old 25.06.2020, 15:10
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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Thank you for your advice, 3Wishes, and words of empathy!

As the authorities state,-2 years after starting living together, that means, potentially, if i notify the authorities only after 2 years, they will start counting from then, meaning i would be „married“ for 4 years.

Regarding her right of stay, citate from ch.ch:

"A divorced spouse’s or a child’s existing residence permit may be extended provided:

the marriage lasted at least three years in Switzerland and the spouse / family lived together... „

If we register at different adresses, that would mean, she would have to leave immidiately
Basically it is legal to live in separate flats and be married - many happy couples do that, in fact, it's what keeps them being happy couples.

Problem with one being dependent on the other re permit is that the permit says "Verbleib beim Ehegatten". I know one couple who still lived separately - probably still do - yet one of them was Swiss.

The way I see it is that during the two years of separation she can stay here as the point of these two years is to possibly find back together. If you divorce after that, those two years can't be counted as happily married though so she won't reach the three years.

Guess it's time for you to move on. She knew what was at stake and has other options (maybe get a permit of her own as she works full time, get a permit through her employer if she has a job she's difficult to replace, marry the lover .....)
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Old 25.06.2020, 15:35
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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Basically it is legal to live in separate flats and be married - many happy couples do that, in fact, it's what keeps them being happy couples.
BTDT for a few years back in the late '80s, but we had no permit problems to deal with.

Not sure which address we used for the tax returns, however.

Tom
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Old 25.06.2020, 16:57
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

Denis, you also need to take into account that your wife will get half your pension until the divorce is finalised.If you are a high earner and she isn’t your pension payments will be higher than hers. Only the pension payed during the marriage will be split.
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Old 25.06.2020, 17:41
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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Basically it is legal to live in separate flats and be married - many happy couples do that, in fact, it's what keeps them being happy couples.
...
The way I see it is that during the two years of separation she can stay here as the point of these two years is to possibly find back together. If you divorce after that, those two years can't be counted as happily married though so she won't reach the three years.

.....)
Thank you, for supportive words, Curley! We are not a happy couple and is no more possible, at least I am.

So I guess if i apply for divorce and we register in different appartments as separately leaving, she will have this two years for finding an option here?
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Old 25.06.2020, 18:19
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

Welcome to the forum.

Congrats for ending in amicable terms but there are several ramifications that make the whole thing complicate and risky.

As oldhand mentioned above the retirement funds will be split until the the divorce is signed. If you agree to not divorce, it's not hard to assume you'll also agree to be solidarmieter in her new apartment. Anything that happens there and you're liable for it. If anything turns bad, she has enormous leverage over you with the solidarmieter thing.

Also, there's the part about faking the marriage. Even an unintentional mistake while she applies for the permanent permit and you're in for some questioning. It may also be intentional, if someone wants to hurt you, the deceiving authorities angle can be used against you. Are you comfortable giving this powerful leverage to other people?

Maybe I'm a horrible person that only thinks about awful outcomes. Albeit, be careful about who you give so much control over your life for the next years. There should be a more intelligent way to support apart from pretending to be still married.
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Old 25.06.2020, 18:45
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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After one year of marriage (no kids),

She is working full time... and wants to stay in Switzerland. We both have "B" for five years
So you moved over here, and she came with you. As concubine or what?

FWIW, I know someone who was divorced within a year of coming here, but was granted leave to stay on the grounds of integration (after appeal).

Your wife has already been here five years, and on that basis she might be able to convince the authorities to give her a permit in her own right.
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Old 25.06.2020, 18:53
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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So you moved over here, and she came with you. As concubine or what?

FWIW, I know someone who was divorced within a year of coming here, but was granted leave to stay on the grounds of integration (after appeal).

Your wife has already been here five years, and on that basis she might be able to convince the authorities to give her a permit in her own right.
I read it differently, maybe it's a phrasing issue? I read it as they have B permits that are valid for 5 years since OP is an EU citizen, not that they've been here for 5 years already. Thus she's only been here for a year. But I might be wrong.

You're right though, if she's been here long enough she might be able to get a permit on her own, although I don't know if the employer would have to go through the non-EU process to keep her.
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Old 25.06.2020, 19:04
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

If your wife is as concerned about her right to stay in Switzerland as you appear to be on her behalf, she will probably have already chosen a Swiss as her new partner. If not, recommend that she finds one double quick.
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Old 25.06.2020, 19:10
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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BTDT for a few years back in the late '80s, but we had no permit problems to deal with.

Not sure which address we used for the tax returns, however.

Tom
BTDT?

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Thank you, for supportive words, Curley! We are not a happy couple and is no more possible, at least I am.

So I guess if i apply for divorce and we register in different appartments as separately leaving, she will have this two years for finding an option here?
I should think so. Or the separation time (meant to mend things or become sure about not to) makes no sense.
Make sure the separation date is clearly stated, so you know when you can actually proceed. I had a witness sign a paper, saying his moving out was a separation and happened on such-and-such date. There is a moment in life when trusting someone is no longer a good idea. Deciding to get divorced is one of these moments.

By the way, you can not file for divorce before the two years are up (and not a bloody day before they are) unless you both fully agree to the divorce.
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Old 25.06.2020, 19:30
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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BTDT?
Been There Done That
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Old 25.06.2020, 20:31
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

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I read it differently, maybe it's a phrasing issue? I read it as they have B permits that are valid for 5 year..
Oh yes. That makes more sense.
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Old 25.06.2020, 20:59
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

I would strongly recomend speaking to a lawyer now, regardless of whether you decide to wait or not to learn exactly what the ramifications (such as the pension savings that other people mentioned) of waiting are.

Some examples of things I would want to know are...
  • What happens if your wife gets pregnant from her new partner (or from you - probably unlikely). Could you be obligated to provide child support?
  • Would you be obligated to give your wife a larger share of your pension fund if she stops working to have a baby?
  • Would you be obligated for more support for your wife if she loses her job?
  • Maybe it is even absolutely in your best interests to wait as long as possible?
  • What happens if or your wife leaves the country before getting divorced? Could this make the divorce proceedings much harder.

The point being, that there are probably a bunch of scenarios with unexpected consequences and it would be much better to understand them now. And, thinking and knowing the consequences of all of these things are what lawyers specialize in.
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Old 25.06.2020, 21:06
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

Another point.. it sounds like you are getting along reasonably well with your wife now. It may make sense to officially end things now, in case your relationship deteriorates.
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Old 25.06.2020, 21:36
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

not a month ago I spoke to a Swiss guy and he told me rather jokingly that he should have shot his ex and sit out the term rather than going the official way because in the end it cost him some 80k CHF(mainly from debts his ex has accrued) and it was finally all over after 9 years from the beginning.
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Old 25.06.2020, 22:00
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

it has been said and i'm sure you both have good intentions but still, get a lawyer.
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Old 25.06.2020, 22:17
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

Protect yourself, not her. I'm sorry to say it, but what she's done is really shitty. And I'm hoping that because you've only been married one year that she won't be able to take much from you. (For example, in many states in the US, I know you have to be married 10 years for things to be split down the middle -- but I have no idea what the situation is here in CH).

Get proof of her affair (emails, etc.). Keep it.

And yes, get a lawyer.

Protect yourself. Focus on yourself. Focus on moving ahead... You're better off alone than with someone who doesn't deserve you.

And I really do wish you the very best.
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Old 26.06.2020, 06:47
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Re: Divorce after one year of marriage/leaving switzerland

Put it this way; probably losing the right to stay here is one of the consequences she should have considered before having an affair. You and she both know the conditons that enabled her to get a family reunification permit. She chose to risk losing it - that's now her problem to deal with, not yours.
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