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  #201  
Old 24.09.2020, 21:39
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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They did not play any part in bringing themselves into this world, so I will help them and already have been helping for many years
aren't you arguing against yourself here? the kids born in switzerland also don't have any part in bringing themselves into the world either. so why not help them too with free schools, healthcare, childcare, food etc. etc.?
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  #202  
Old 25.09.2020, 00:07
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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...about the extent to which the state should tax and redistribute.
OP seems to forget that mamas and papas pay taxes too...
Most people here don't even have the right to vote so the whole discussion seems a bit futile....whatever the Swiss voters decide, I tend to believe it doesn't make much of a difference for many people here. Well, maybe except the paternity leave. But some companies are already offering that anyway.
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  #203  
Old 25.09.2020, 02:29
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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I'm not sure what crime has to do with it. We live in Switzerland, there isn't all that much crime. There are quite a lot of absentee fathers. I've worked with some of them and gone to school with their kids. Those two weeks is society's way of telling me. That raising a child is not the sole responsibility of the mother.

I can't imagine you've actually raised a child if you consider paternity leave to be a vacation. I'm very glad my husband got three months so we could be spared the presence of grandparents and post partum depression.
Feel free to show that the correlation between low income and increased crime rate doesn't exist in CH, I see no reason to claim Swiss exceptionalism. Same goes with the lack of a father figure where the kids grow up with the mother only, which is still the typical single-parent situation.

I didn't mention vacation. Nor do I need to have had or raised a child to have an opinion and a vote - which doesn't mean I didn't, it's simply irrelevant.
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  #204  
Old 25.09.2020, 03:02
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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So yes, that time did, indeed, change his mind. And heart.
As so nicely demonstrate he (they if you prefer) didn't need two weeks paternity leave to have a change of heart.

Thank you for making my case.
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  #205  
Old 25.09.2020, 13:31
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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As so nicely demonstrate he (they if you prefer) didn't need two weeks paternity leave to have a change of heart.

Thank you for making my case.
I think it's nice to have those 2 weeks paternity leave though. And even nicer - a longer maternity leave...
However, I agree with you, this is a lifetime commitment. One is supposed to know before their child is born they're also going to be responsible for the new human being. With or without paternity leave. For the entire childhood. Unless they get through some existential/midlife crisis and resent their child or children for wasting their youth...

Anyways, I don't think anyone should justify their choices. I'm totally fine with other folks not wanting kids, not wanting their taxes geared towards children's needs. Apparently some of them seem a little bit judgemental, whereas they should not project their ideas or perceptions onto other people. I am glad some of our taxes are coming back to us one way or another. I don't mind if they can help other people too, it's how a society survives.

Last edited by greenmount; 25.09.2020 at 13:49.
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  #206  
Old 25.09.2020, 15:58
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

So you lot are having an after party?

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Haha, you actually made some good points here and can partially/to some extent agree with you. Don't feel bad or attacked, at least as far as I'm concerned you're very welcome to state your points of view.
Off course, I made good points, I don't have any doubts about that Neither do I feel bad or attacked despite the nonsense groans and red stuff I got. It is part and parcel of the online world, water off duck's back on the whole. I fully stand behind my points It is just too time-consuming replying to so many posts, specially as we are all going round in circles. Also, most of us are not even Swiss so a pointless debate My priority is mountain hut and not other people's kids or their rich parents begging for more money

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Anyways, I don't think anyone should justify their choices. I'm totally fine with other folks not wanting kids, not wanting their taxes geared towards children's needs. Apparently some of them seem a little bit judgemental,
In the real world, Mums are the ones who are EXTREMELY judgemental against child-free women Backed by scientific studies apparently and definitely by data I collected on the field

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aren't you arguing against yourself here? the kids born in switzerland also don't have any part in bringing themselves into the world either. so why not help them too with free schools, healthcare, childcare, food etc. etc.?
I help kids in poor countries who were abandoned and I hand money to someone who feeds and clothes them, they don't have parents. The kids in Switzerland that we are talking about on this thread, are the non-abandoned ones. Another important difference is that the help I provide is voluntary and not forced

Kids born in Switzerland on the whole have much richer parents. Apparently I read on this forum that anything under CHF120k is considered bad pay and CHF70'000 = poverty. I think you guys should be feeding and clothing me. People with kids should be taxed higher to pay for child free people
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  #207  
Old 25.09.2020, 16:05
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

I thought you were abandoning ship? Third time lucky?
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  #208  
Old 25.09.2020, 16:20
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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I thought you were abandoning ship? Third time lucky?
Saw someone had thanked me and then got curious to see who and why and could not help reading more Once you read then you got to respond. Anyway, it is my party, so I can come in and out unless the neighbours call the police
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  #209  
Old 25.09.2020, 17:24
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

https://youtu.be/m6KhXo13_H0
It's my party
Lesley Gore (1989)

https://youtu.be/acRMALrg1t4
It's my party
Lesley Gore (1964)
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  #210  
Old 25.09.2020, 17:34
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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In the real world, Mums are the ones who are EXTREMELY judgemental against child-free women Backed by scientific studies apparently and definitely by data I collected on the field
Maybe. Definitely not all of them though.

I personally feel sorry for those who went through all sorts of medical procedures and treatments to get pregnant and/or carry their pregnancy to term and couldn't. I don't judge anyone who has or had different priorities and never wanted a child. Each to their own.

Oh, and btw adoption is not always as simple as it seems. In some countries this is a very long and complicated process, you'd say it is meant to see how willing some people are. So no judgement on anyone, really. Too private a matter.
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  #211  
Old 25.09.2020, 18:12
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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Saw someone had thanked me and then got curious to see who and why and could not help reading more Once you read then you got to respond. Anyway, it is my party, so I can come in and out unless the neighbours call the police
Just make sure you pipe down by 22:00. Unless you're test-driving one of those mountain huts already.
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  #212  
Old 26.09.2020, 00:34
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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Just make sure you pipe down by 22:00. Unless you're test-driving one of those mountain huts already.
He's trolling peacefully, I wonder whose reincarnation he is.

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Kids born in Switzerland on the whole have much richer parents. Apparently I read on this forum that anything under CHF120k is considered bad pay and CHF70'000 = poverty. I think you guys should be feeding and clothing me. People with kids should be taxed higher to pay for child free people
We'll see what can we do for you.
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  #213  
Old 26.09.2020, 08:04
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

Chuff,
Just saw your post, full of stupid.

What happened to the rules against personal insults?

PS The best way to control trolls, is to not feed them.
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  #214  
Old 26.09.2020, 08:06
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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Something Village Idiot, Chuff wrote
A respected long time member here told me to ignore you as you are a....
I see now what they meant.

I don't know you nor am I interested in knowing you, so walk along and don't make it personal.


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He's trolling peacefully, I wonder whose reincarnation he is.
I am nobody's reincarnation. This forum comes up many times on Google search, so I decided to finally join after having read many useful info threads in the past. Do people troll violently?
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  #215  
Old 26.09.2020, 08:21
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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Definitely a reincarnation. His first post when he joined was in the Coronavirus thread, writing like he had already been here months. No intro, no questions that drew him to the forums, nothing. Classic sign of a returning member under a new alias.
I have not been here before I joined!!!!! Stick to your day job, Poirot! It is amazing that these days if someone is secure in their skin and holds non-mainstream views then insecure people come with all kinds of drivel to shut them down!

I was listening to Joe Rogan's recent podcast with Douglas Murray and you sound like the typical SJW they were talking about People like you just want an echo chamber where they hear no alternative opposing views.
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  #216  
Old 26.09.2020, 20:48
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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Saw the thread title: full of stupid. Saw the posts supporting the title within: full of stupid.....
About 6 million Swiss discuss this subject for months now until their final verdict tomorrow. After 3 different divisions of the Swiss government have discussed it (for years probably, LOL).

Full of stupid, this country you claimed you could not imagine not living in in a other thread.
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  #217  
Old 26.09.2020, 21:19
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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I was listening to Joe Rogan's recent podcast......
you don't have kids but you do consume like a dad
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  #218  
Old 26.09.2020, 21:45
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

I voted yes for the paternity leave.
Itís no longer my concern in my early 50s, but I do remember how difficult it was as a young mother and it would have been wonderful had a decent paternity leave (and a better maternity leave) been in place.
As my little one had special needs at the time, it would have been so much better had my ex-husband been available.

So hereís to all the young parents out there, may you be blessed snd may you have time together when your baby arrives.
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  #219  
Old 27.09.2020, 18:25
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

And BOOM we got it through. Thank you to our more open-minded friends in the west who balance out the reactionary Nein-Sager.
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  #220  
Old 27.09.2020, 19:04
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Re: I have to pay for your kids? :-O

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And BOOM we got it through. Thank you to our more open-minded friends in the west who balance out the reactionary Nein-Sager.
Was it ever in doubt? I am surprised that so many said NO in the first place.
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