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kri 21.11.2020 09:39

Protein and Metabolism
 
So I bought a Xiaomi Mi Scale.

Whilst I know not super accurate, it has made me curious on 2 of my readings:

1) Protein is low (not muscle, just protein)
2) Low basal metabolism (about 1300 when it should be about 1500)

Some notes:
1) I exercise every day early morning, mix of weights, HIIT and running.

2) I have a few kilos to lose also.

3) Rest of the measurement are fine.

4) I practice 16/8 intermittent fasting (eating window 12-20) since a few years and I like it.

I started researching this but am a bit at a loss on how to increase both figures?

I tried protein shakes but there is so much advice out there I got a bit lost.

Anyone has any word of wisdom on this topic?

newtoswitz 21.11.2020 09:56

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
A scale can't measure anything other than weight.

I assume you have it paired with some sort of fitness and eating tracking apps?

If you feel healthy and happy with your body, forget it.

If you don't, you probably already know roughly what you want to change, so why care what the scale says?

The sceptic in me says that:

a. a scale trying to claim anything about the content of the weight it measures is just making things up

b. they have a sponsorship deal with a protein shake company

MePeto 21.11.2020 10:08

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
A year here in the IF... from my experience the Basal Metabolism can be altered in a more or less significant way but not in IF because is an Hypocalloric diet and your MEtabolic rate is going down while you are in one... if you want to increse your protein intake maybe try different sources till you find one that your body assimilates more than others... the flora in your gut play a major role in this so maybe you need to check that... I take an Inulin suplemment and a prebiotic that really helps... also Omega 3 oil is a helper here...

kri 21.11.2020 11:03

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by newtoswitz (Post 3241310)
A scale can't measure anything other than weight.

I assume you have it paired with some sort of fitness and eating tracking apps?

If you feel healthy and happy with your body, forget it.

If you don't, you probably already know roughly what you want to change, so why care what the scale says?

The sceptic in me says that:

a. a scale trying to claim anything about the content of the weight it measures is just making things up

b. they have a sponsorship deal with a protein shake company

It's a body composition scale. It measure body fat, muscle etc. I understand the limitations of this and yet it has made me curious.

It also gave similar info than a trainer years ago had given me with traditional body measurements, i.e. eat more protein, so I am just investigating a bit.

Shifting weight lately has been hard, probably due to age, but wanted to get a bit more granular about it.

John_H 21.11.2020 11:21

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
I have a different brand of scale that does those measurements and i just don't believe it.. Especially those that only measure via the feet.. Obviously electricity takes the shortest path, thus goes up one leg and down the other.. How does it see and measure my beer belly or my big muscular shoulders?

My problem is i eat too much, mostly decent food but in too large quantities .. And I drink too much wine. I do crossfit up to 5 times per week, lift pretty heavy etc.. I burn up to 700 cals per session according to apple watch .. But that makes me hungry and so I eat more.

I took three months off the gym in the first lock-down and quickly lost 5kg.. I restarted in Aug and I've put that straight back on already.. Conversely my scale said it was FAT that I lost and put back on again..

MusicChick 21.11.2020 11:43

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Looks like some folks's bodies put themselves in an emergency mode when in a lot of oxydative stress (intense workouts, high intensity stress, intense fasting cycles), etc. High cortisol will make one retain podge and increase appetite, mess with insuline, metabolic imbalance, etc. Feed inflamation which will mess with what body does with proteins and block sending proteins where needed. Cortisol can increase even when we are actually trying to fix stuff with intense healthy routine and drill, because it still presents stress just in a different form. I can say that for me now (after a few years of pretty much the same routine as OP described, it was also great up to a point) mainly quality sleep, lowering the physical intensity but going for endurance with workouts and running, no extreme fasting but lower and balanced intake of particular nutrients decreases the emergency mode and puts the metabolism back into the well functioning mode. Better food (carbs are a waste of stomach space for me, really), less of it, better care of my microbiome (different food, actively blocking stress and enhancing the protein processing) instead of intense physical drill or fasts seem better now. But that's me. And a couple of close friends. And family.

kri 21.11.2020 11:56

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Thanks Musicchick.

I do intermittent fasting as it works well for me to keep in touch with my hunger and only eat when hungry (Vs social norms etc).

I started wondering if training at 6 am during the fast time without food until 12/13 is what is causing the potential issue? Thoughts?

Thank you

MusicChick 21.11.2020 12:09

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kri (Post 3241343)
Thanks Musicchick.

I do intermittent fasting as it works well for me to keep in touch with my hunger and only eat when hungry (Vs social norms etc).

I started wondering if training at 6 am during the fast time without food until 12/13 is what is causing the potential issue? Thoughts?

Thank you

Yes.

Honestly.

MusicChick 21.11.2020 12:20

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MusicChick (Post 3241349)
Yes.

Honestly.

That said - use fasting as an super efficient but heavy duty thing, pretty much like a lockdown. If too much or wrong timing, your body will kick in counter measures. Where are your extra kilos you don't want? Cortisol shifts them to particular areas. And cortisol triggered metabolic storm will alarm enzymes too, pang of post-wok out hunger directly after, extreme sugar cravings, carbs..or booze, John, to soothe the depleation panic with cheap dopamine. Welcome this though, your body seems to be doing its damage management.

The kilos will go with consistent and mild endurance, it will only take a bit longer...

Hard to give up fasting for me, love the cognitive clarity and pace, endorfines. But if you do it to retrain your hunger signals, it means cortisol has already started messing up with hunger signals, as a stress protection. Curb stress instead of food, then cravings or over eating will go away because cortisol will drop.

JackieH 21.11.2020 12:47

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
makes sense - and yet, easier said than done for sure. But excellent post.

MegsB 21.11.2020 13:06

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by John_H (Post 3241328)
I have a different brand of scale that does those measurements and i just don't believe it.. Especially those that only measure via the feet.. Obviously electricity takes the shortest path, thus goes up one leg and down the other.. How does it see and measure my beer belly or my big muscular shoulders?

My problem is i eat too much, mostly decent food but in too large quantities .. And I drink too much wine. I do crossfit up to 5 times per week, lift pretty heavy etc.. I burn up to 700 cals per session according to apple watch .. But that makes me hungry and so I eat more.

This exactly. I finally got fed up with not making "progress" and consulted a nutritionist. She said the scales are inaccurate as are the fitness watch measurements of calories burned. True ratios of fat to muscle require sophisticated evaluation (she consults for high-level athletes... of which I am not).

Ditto the eating too much of the good things, working out at that level makes you more hungry. I might add the wine back in to round things out.

Off to stir the bolognese and check the bread rise :D

MusicChick 21.11.2020 13:22

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Meanie :D

I ran an hour ago, it was fab. An hour later I can have but don't really need it a 150ml bowl of lait fermentť with a spoon of tangerine youghurt and mix a teaspoon of linen, sunflower and pumkin seeds. And a lot of cinnamon. It's heaven, I feel that I am giving me a good lil support, a bit of carb to not crave and will up it with some meat and salad in the afternoon. I gotta watch out to not go low in calories, workout shifts my attention from eating, I am busy processing endorfines, tbh. If I fasted now, eat in the evening, I know that one gets high on adrenaline when in physical distress and you don't even notice the signals the body gives you.

But I can't remember the last time I looked at a scale, I think the batteries died. Try to lay off the discipline and measurements - protect your body from stress instead, I think. You are worth it, it will make you happy -> will shift the focus from size/shape challenges.

I also know from me and people around me that sole breadwinners and single parents or people with not much family support need to count a massive amount of stress in, even if they program themselves to not feel it and ignore the signs. They don't need more work outs, more starving oneselves, etc. than the innitial period when it still energizes. They need to carefully watch out for quiet signs of high cortisol, hormonal, enzymatic and metabolic changes. And self direct tlc, at least a bit, for a change. The body doesn't really care if we put it through good or bad stress, after a long enough period it shows.

kri 21.11.2020 13:47

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MusicChick (Post 3241353)
That said - use fasting as an super efficient but heavy duty thing, pretty much like a lockdown. If too much or wrong timing, your body will kick in counter measures. Where are your extra kilos you don't want? Cortisol shifts them to particular areas. And cortisol triggered metabolic storm will alarm enzymes too, pang of post-wok out hunger directly after, extreme sugar cravings, carbs..or booze, John, to soothe the depleation panic with cheap dopamine. Welcome this though, your body seems to be doing its damage management.

The kilos will go with consistent and mild endurance, it will only take a bit longer...

Hard to give up fasting for me, love the cognitive clarity and pace, endorfines. But if you do it to retrain your hunger signals, it means cortisol has already started messing up with hunger signals, as a stress protection. Curb stress instead of food, then cravings or over eating will go away because cortisol will drop.

Dropping the kilos is needed as I am slightly overweight. Never managed to quite shift the post second pregnancy weight, so about 10kg to lose.
It's not a vanity thing, more that I know that with getting old, carrying any amount of extra weight is not ideal. I have not put any weight on at all for the past 6-7 years.

Same reason for exercising - I want to grow old strong AND I love starting the day doing something for me and my body.

I never considered the 16-8 as hard fasting but perhaps this is now causing an issue - hardly have hunger pangs after workouts.

But agree with the rest that you are saying about the stress etc - we are just out of a superstressful intercontinental move period and whilst I am doing a lot to care for myself (stopped alcohol, sleep enough, sport and nutrition) perhaps even more is needed.

Ideally I would love doing intuitive eating - issue is that it does not work well with family life and family meals etc.

But perhaps I can reintroduce breakfast and see what happens - just a little afraid as the current system worked for not putting any weight on and before the scales I was not worried about protein or metabolism... Perhaps need to ditch the scale :)

K

mossie 21.11.2020 13:49

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
I had one of those scales before I would not read too much into them.
I have tried every kind of diet in the past and exercising and nothing really worked.

A trip to the doctor and high cholesterol/ liver enzymes once made me change my habits, I was off alcohol 18 months then so not alcohol related.

Now Iím just eating fish odd bit of Skinless chicken, vegetables, fruits , fibers.

Yes itís hard at first but your body acclimatizes to it after a while. The weight dropped off in a controlled manner not like a crash diet and even going to gym way more energy than previously and throughout the day.

I donít count the hours between meals but I generally eat last meal not too late so I guess most days Iím fasting 12-16 hours between meals that helps a lot too.

Now I swear by high protein low carb diet even though I was a sceptic before.

MusicChick 21.11.2020 14:01

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kri (Post 3241389)
Dropping the kilos is needed as I am slightly overweight. Never managed to quite shift the post second pregnancy weight, so about 10kg to lose.
It's not a vanity thing, more that I know that with getting old, carrying any amount of extra weight is not ideal. I have not put any weight on at all for the past 6-7 years.

Same reason for exercising - I want to grow old strong AND I love starting the day doing something for me and my body.

I never considered the 16-8 as hard fasting but perhaps this is now causing an issue - hardly have hunger pangs after workouts.

But agree with the rest that you are saying about the stress etc - we are just out of a superstressful intercontinental move period and whilst I am doing a lot to care for myself (stopped alcohol, sleep enough, sport and nutrition) perhaps even more is needed.

Ideally I would love doing intuitive eating - issue is that it does not work well with family life and family meals etc.

But perhaps I can reintroduce breakfast and see what happens - just a little afraid as the current system worked for not putting any weight on and before the scales I was not worried about protein or metabolism... Perhaps need to ditch the scale :)

K

Ditch it little later, it may call your name next few days out of habit..it's like with food, deprivation will make one want it more. Brains are genius machines, it's not stomachs that call the shots.

You can do intuitive eating for yourself, really. In my house we all eat what we need when we need, our needs differ. Try 4 weeks with good lean protein breakfast and lunch, ditch carbs but if you crave, have a bit - early small dinner if any. Keep up sports but lower the intensity? But your stress is completely justified, it's just that often it's not the h/c measures that are the most efficient but smaller softer changes but endured. Our bodies incubate and bring humans into the world...to come back to ourselves can take years. Make your wellbeing a priority, really. Intuitive eating is great - you crave what you need and eat when you need. Fasting isn't a way to it, though, it's the oposite, and it can stress.

November 21.11.2020 14:52

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Hi there,

If I were you Iíd ditch cardio and focus on weights and resistance training only.

This is the most efficient (time + efforts) to achieve a lean and strong body.. just google it cardio vs weights.

Good luck!

MusicChick 21.11.2020 15:07

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
There is some truth to it. Moderate weights make people lean and cardio makes them process stress.

I also read on supplements not being ideal while fasting (C), they seemed to beat the purpose.

What is rowing - weights? I row between weight machines and sprints, but it feels like cardio, not weights.

John_H 21.11.2020 15:47

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MusicChick (Post 3241381)
Meanie :D

.....An hour later I can have but don't really need it a 150ml bowl of lait fermentť with a spoon of tangerine youghurt and mix a teaspoon of linen, sunflower and pumkin seeds. And a lot of cinnamon. ......

That's not real food for humans.. We put that on the bird table :msntongue::msntongue::msntongue:

Example session I did last week :
30 min warm up, run, form, technique, etc..
-- then --
60 Deadlifts, 80kgs
60 Box Jumps, 50cms
-- then --
60 Kettlebell Swings, 32kgs
60 Row Calories
(in 17 minutes)

Followed by going home for a big breakfast of bacon and eggs and toast. No seeds.

kri 21.11.2020 15:50

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by November (Post 3241415)
Hi there,

If I were you I’d ditch cardio and focus on weights and resistance training only.

This is the most efficient (time + efforts) to achieve a lean and strong body.. just google it cardio vs weights.

Good luck!

Thanks - I do 5 days/week weights and HIIT combos, 30 minutes using Fitnessblender programs and 2 days a week running. This split works for me as I want to keep my running trained and also would not want to list or do HIIT everyday.

I don't exercise with weight loss in mind but of course understand its benefits hence the program I follow.

K

MusicChick 21.11.2020 16:18

Re: Protein and Metabolism
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by John_H (Post 3241427)
That's not real food for humans.. We put that on the bird table :msntongue::msntongue::msntongue:

Example session I did last week :
30 min warm up, run, form, technique, etc..
-- then --
60 Deadlifts, 80kgs
60 Box Jumps, 50cms
-- then --
60 Kettlebell Swings, 32kgs
60 Row Calories
(in 17 minutes)

Followed by going home for a big breakfast of bacon and eggs and toast. No seeds.

Seeds are awesome. It is sublime human food, I been hooked for decades. Since vegan times. That was no human food :D

I think how good food for you is measured by guts in general. Gut - too many cals or high stress, slow metabolusm. No gut - right amount of food and decent metabolism. I don't think I'd trust an app with algorithms calculated mostly based on average functioning (I never had, nor kept "normal" weight percentile), nor scale with some sophisticated added perks. Mirror and how tired one is is usually good judgment, pains, difficult focus, forgetting things, antsiness, etc. too, but checking ambitions as well - so one doesn't add unhealthy stress to already stressed out body/mind. Go-getters don't notice and then things snowball.

Where's my bird feeder.. :D

Chirp.


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