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View Poll Results: Moderna Vaccine side effects
Mild side effects. No time off work. 28 63.64%
Moderate side effects. Time off work - 1 to 2 days 14 31.82%
Serious side effects - more than 2 days off work 2 4.55%
Voters: 44. You may not vote on this poll

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  #121  
Old 09.04.2021, 19:33
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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Please, JackieH, what is a DNA, in this context? I just see double helix images.
did not arrive?
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  #122  
Old 09.04.2021, 20:43
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

It is a well known term in UK in hospitals and GP (general practitioner) surgeries/offices - Did Not Attend

it cost the NHS millions and also contributes hugely to waiting lists.
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  #123  
Old 10.04.2021, 23:54
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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The quoted article is refering to practices that drop out due to the low renumeration per jab given not due to lack of vaccine.
Others are also donating their free time to volunteer. Nothing says that vaccinations have to be given during normal working hours.
These are extraordinary times that require extraordinary measures. It should not be about money. So no sympathy from my side for those that make it about that.
The Blick is the local yellow press. Do you believe everything you read? Even so, it does say they‘re doing it for different reasons and the remuneration is just one of them. The vaccines come in batches of one hundred, no less. Try getting 100+ scared, forgetful, slow seniors organised in the spare time you (and your staff) have. Or don’t have: „normal working hours“? The FMH calls anything below fifty-five hours a week part-time. In its most recent survey of doctors’ working hours, it concluded that the average Swiss doctor „only“ put in 47+ hours per week. In a work force half of which is female. We have families too, you know. Would you volunteer in addition to that kind of workload? Many are. Workaholism is par for the course.

Last edited by missenglish; 11.04.2021 at 00:36.
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  #124  
Old 11.04.2021, 00:03
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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Tbh it's pointless having gps do this with the number of vaccines we have. We are now behind even our Eu neighbours.
The GPs get the Moderna vaccine only. The cooling logistics of Pfizer are too complicated for fine distribution. GPs still make sense for patients like my aged mother, a cancer survivor reluctant to travel into a crowded urban centre to get her shot. She just got her second one. My geriatric patients seem to be getting there too, not without the odd one dying before. (I‘m not a GP so can‘t participate.)
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  #125  
Old 11.04.2021, 01:13
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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The Blick is the local yellow press. Do you believe everything you read? Even so, it does say they‘re doing it for different reasons and the remuneration is just one of them. What you consider „normal working hours“ is up to you. The FMH calls anything below fifty-five hours a week part-time. In its most recent survey of doctors’ working hours, it concluded that the average Swiss doctor „only“ put in 47+ hours per week. In a work force half of which is female. We have families too, you know. Would you volunteer in addition to that kind of workload? Many are. Workaholism is par for the course.
I hear you & I fully understand that the majority of GPs do not have a 8 to 5 schedule. What I ment with "outside working hours" (for example) organise vaccination weekends in accordance with each elegible group in order to get their registered patients vaccinated.
From what I understand many prefer to recieve the jab at their GP rather than go to a hospital/vaccination center.
Atm I find cantonal organisation less than ideal from looking at the numbers of given jabs over all verses numbers of vaccines in stock.
The quicker we vaccinate the quicker we can return (hopefully) to normality.
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  #126  
Old 11.04.2021, 08:27
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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I hear you & I fully understand that the majority of GPs do not have a 8 to 5 schedule. What I ment with "outside working hours" (for example) organise vaccination weekends in accordance with each elegible group in order to get their registered patients vaccinated.
From what I understand many prefer to recieve the jab at their GP rather than go to a hospital/vaccination center.
Atm I find cantonal organisation less than ideal from looking at the numbers of given jabs over all verses numbers of vaccines in stock.
The quicker we vaccinate the quicker we can return (hopefully) to normality.
Of course. I know several practices that do vaccination Saturdays. It‘s not really doable after a normal day, given the numbers and the need to schedule 100 appointments in the few days the vaccine can be stored. Staff needs to be there too, to watch patients for a few minutes afterwards and to help with coats, fears, trips to the toilet, and so on (we are talking of the seriously ill and/or octo- or nonagenarians). Most health-care workers have high intrinsic motivation and are perfectly happy to do this. The need is obvious.

That said, I have also heard of several practices that did not get the promised doses, or got them with a delay of several weeks. In some cases, it meant rescheduling. Sounds easy if you assume it‘s as fast as in the young and healthy, but it means one or more phone calls for each of those 100+ elderly people. If they‘re scared and frustrated and want/need to vent, how do you cut them short? If you‘ve ever done it, you‘ll know what it means. Hours of utterly abject apologies for something you have zero responsibility for. (Abject because we all know what it means for those at risk, and would like nothing better than to deliver.) And getting scapegoated by the local rags and their readers in the process, of bloody course! It’s true that medical associations protested the remuneration, but that’s part of their job and does _not_ equal stopping the vaccinations for financial reasons. It hasn’t been raised everywhere, but the cantons with the original low tariff are making comparable progress with vaccinations in the practices. Which proves the bottleneck is not greed. Stop bashing frontline health-care workers and accept that the first, second and third biggest problems so far are lack of vaccine, lack of vaccine and lack of vaccine, as has been reiterated over and over in the media. As said, practices only get the Moderna so far and there is simply not enough to go round. However, the silver lining is that a large batch was supposed to arrive by the end of this week, i.e. now. Hang in there!
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  #127  
Old 11.04.2021, 10:40
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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Vaccination weekends, perhaps, but staffed by whom? Maybe military medical staff? Weekends are when the doctors who run practices catch up on reading and writing reports. And when they're supposed to get in a little rest, too.

This is actually something that puzzled me - given that we are already using the army to distribute and transport the vaccines... why not train them to give the vaccines?


One doctor in an area (for patients who may have adverse reactions), and 20-30 soldiers can get through a LOT of doses in an 8 hour day. Say 20 mins per dose (5 mins talking/explaining, 1min for the vaccine, 10 mins waiting time for adverse reactions, and a few minutes of buffer to clean up), that's 24 doses per soldier, or just shy of 500 doses per overseeing doctor in a day.


The soldiers near my house routinely do training sessions where they erect a massive tent in a parking lot and do... something... no idea what. (but it's fun to watch them put out barbed wire, and have prone snipers all around)... That would be a perfect location...
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  #128  
Old 11.04.2021, 11:33
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

My GP practice in Schwyz has not received any doses of the vaccine, and has no idea when they will do so. I've heard the same from friends who go to other practices. As far as I know, vaccination is still only happening at the three hospitals.

---

Question for fellow Schwyzers: Have any of you been notified of eligibility to make an appointment via the SZ app?

The (admittedly few) folks I know here who have been vaccinated heard nothing from the app when their age group became eligible, but rather had to have their GPs call 'someone, somewhere' to get them an appointment at one of the vaccination centers.

Which leaves me wondering how well the SZ app is working. Would feel reassured to hear from any of you who were notified as expected...
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  #129  
Old 11.04.2021, 11:46
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

In Neuchâtel, most vaccinations were done at 2 clinics set up solely for this purpose. We had to travel about 50 mins and back again to get 'done, and on separate days. Our GP only called us 2 weeks ago to say we can get vaccinate there- but we told them that we had pro-actively booked our own appointments and had jabs done at one of the above centres.
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  #130  
Old 11.04.2021, 11:50
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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Of course. I know several practices that do vaccination Saturdays. It‘s not really doable after a normal day, given the numbers and the need to schedule 100 appointments in the few days the vaccine can be stored. Staff needs to be there too, to watch patients for a few minutes afterwards and to help with coats, fears, trips to the toilet, and so on (we are talking of the seriously ill and/or octo- or nonagenarians). Most health-care workers have high intrinsic motivation and are perfectly happy to do this. The need is obvious.

That said, I have also heard of several practices that did not get the promised doses, or got them with a delay of several weeks. In some cases, it meant rescheduling. Sounds easy if you assume it‘s as fast as in the young and healthy, but it means one or more phone calls for each of those 100+ elderly people. If they‘re scared and frustrated and want/need to vent, how do you cut them short? If you‘ve ever done it, you‘ll know what it means. Hours of utterly abject apologies for something you have zero responsibility for. (Abject because we all know what it means for those at risk, and would like nothing better than to deliver.) And getting scapegoated by the local rags and their readers in the process, of bloody course! It’s true that medical associations protested the remuneration, but that’s part of their job and does _not_ equal stopping the vaccinations for financial reasons. It hasn’t been raised everywhere, but the cantons with the original low tariff are making comparable progress with vaccinations in the practices. Which proves the bottleneck is not greed. Stop bashing frontline health-care workers and accept that the first, second and third biggest problems so far are lack of vaccine, lack of vaccine and lack of vaccine, as has been reiterated over and over in the media. As said, practices only get the Moderna so far and there is simply not enough to go round. However, the silver lining is that a large batch was supposed to arrive by the end of this week, i.e. now. Hang in there!
I am certanley not bashing health care workers, on the contrary I have the outmost respect for the nurses etc that fight on the frontlines on a daily basis.

My gripe was with the GPs that allegedly jumped ship due to low renumeration.
But if it was as you say due to lack of vaccine I apologize & I shall rest my case.
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  #131  
Old 11.04.2021, 12:28
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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In Neuchâtel, most vaccinations were done at 2 clinics set up solely for this purpose. We had to travel about 50 mins and back again to get 'done, and on separate days. Our GP only called us 2 weeks ago to say we can get vaccinate there- but we told them that we had pro-actively booked our own appointments and had jabs done at one of the above centres.
There are actually three centres in Neuchâtel although I think they have temporarily suspended vaccination in Cernier.
The first one was set up in Cernier at short notice when the vaccines became available but it isn’t a very convenient location for a lot of people.
The other two were added later once more vaccine became available.

They only started vaccinating in GP surgeries and pharmacies a couple of weeks ago and for the moment it’s limited to the Val de Travers as it is more difficult for people from that region to get to the vaccination centres. The GP and pharmacy programme will be extended soon once the larger deliveries of vaccines start arriving.
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  #132  
Old 11.04.2021, 23:57
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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My gripe was with the GPs that allegedly jumped ship due to low renumeration.
But if it was as you say due to lack of vaccine I apologize & I shall rest my case.
Thank you, I appreciate that.

I tried to find an article in the Zürcher Ärztezeitung, but unlike its national counterpart, it‘s not online. It consisted of dozens of one-paragraph reports from GPs reporting on their frustrations with the vaccination programme in their practices. One wrote an elegant little poem about waiting which I wanted to repost. Seems I‘ve thrown it out. Shame.
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  #133  
Old 12.04.2021, 09:47
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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This is actually something that puzzled me - given that we are already using the army to distribute and transport the vaccines... why not train them to give the vaccines?...
There are many soldiers who are already trained and qualified to give vaccines, my son being one. He also questions why he's not being used. He will be going back to do his annual service in June and will no doubt spend his time inserting IV drips and the like into his fellow soldiers to keep their skills up and erecting makeshift hospitals which have no purpose.
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  #134  
Old 12.04.2021, 10:00
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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There are many soldiers who are already trained and qualified to give vaccines, my son being one. He also questions why he's not being used. He will be going back to do his annual service in June and will no doubt spend his time inserting IV drips and the like into his fellow soldiers to keep their skills up and erecting makeshift hospitals which have no purpose.
I think it’s been a shortage of vaccines rather than a shortage of personnel up to now.
They may start calling in people once the large deliveries start to arrive.
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  #135  
Old 12.04.2021, 11:34
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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One wrote an elegant little poem about waiting which I wanted to repost. Seems I‘ve thrown it out. Shame.
If you find it somewhere please post it!
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  #136  
Old 13.04.2021, 08:46
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

Well, finally some new info from SZ, the first update to their vaccination page in six weeks:

As of Wednesday, 14 Apr they will start vaccinating health care personnel. Finally.

They are following the BAG strategy of age and risk first (currently over 65),
then health care personnel,
then those liviing with someone who is at risk,
then household members living with people at high risk,
then people in facilities at increased risk for infection and outbreaks,
then everyone else.

So now we've at least started on the second priority group. Finally.

I fall under the everyone else category, so am still expecting nothing before the second quarter, and according to my GP likely end of second quarter. So no change there.

---

In the meanwhile, back home everyone I know over 16 has received at least the first shot, most are now fully vaccinated. And life is starting to return to normal.
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  #137  
Old 13.04.2021, 09:27
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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There are many soldiers who are already trained and qualified to give vaccines, my son being one. He also questions why he's not being used. He will be going back to do his annual service in June and will no doubt spend his time inserting IV drips and the like into his fellow soldiers to keep their skills up and erecting makeshift hospitals which have no purpose.
I mentioned it before, but in the U.K. they have trained up out of work volunteers to vaccinate - air crew for example. They are running vaccinations 7 days a week!
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  #138  
Old 13.04.2021, 09:36
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

You can register here for canton Zh: https://zh.vacme.ch
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  #139  
Old 13.04.2021, 10:09
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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Well, finally some new info from SZ, the first update to their vaccination page in six weeks:

As of Wednesday, 14 Apr they will start vaccinating health care personnel. Finally.

They are following the BAG strategy of age and risk first (currently over 65),
then health care personnel,
then those liviing with someone who is at risk,
then household members living with people at high risk,
then people in facilities at increased risk for infection and outbreaks,
then everyone else.

So now we've at least started on the second priority group. Finally.

I fall under the everyone else category, so am still expecting nothing before the second quarter, and according to my GP likely end of second quarter. So no change there.

---

In the meanwhile, back home everyone I know over 16 has received at least the first shot, most are now fully vaccinated. And life is starting to return to normal.
We are 13 days into the second quarter already

I‘ve registered on the website today for all the (three) SZ locations even though I fall into the everyone else category. I don‘t have a formal GP as I‘m on Telmed, but I normally use the Arzthaus in Zurich as it‘s near work, so I guess I‘m going to be waiting until I get offered something from one of the SZ hospitals.
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  #140  
Old 13.04.2021, 10:24
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Re: When can we take covid vaccine

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We are 13 days into the second quarter already
Time flies when you are lost in the pandemic haze having fun.


---

My GP practice still doesn't have the vaccine, AFAIK it's still only the three hospitals that do. So not having a GP in SZ likely won't put you farther back in line. Yet. What counts now is being registered with the SZ app.

Follow up to my earlier post questioning whether the SZ app was actually notifiying people: A colleague was indeed notified when she became eligible. So that's reassuring.
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