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Old 07.07.2009, 15:02
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Domestic abuse in CH

I moved to CH from the UK almost 3 years ago with my Swiss husband and children. We had marriage problems: my husband was suffering from stress and drinking a lot and I naively thought that CH would cure all of this. I certainly never expected that the children and I would end up staying in a women’s shelter.

Emotional abuse, which I experienced, was so clever I hardly even knew it was happening and that was the reason that I allowed it to go on for so long. The abuse was never physical and started off very subtly. I wish sometimes that it had been physical as then I would have seen it for what it was and put a stop to it. Instead, and over the last five years, the control that my husband had over me become so strong that I was not even allowed to go and visit family in the UK. Things all came to a head for me and I knew I needed to escape but I didn’t know where to get help here in CH. I was also terified about what my husband would do if he knew. I contacted women’s aid in the UK and they gave me the confidence to get a lawyer and make an escape plan. Unfortunately because of the children, we are not allowed to leave CH to be around close family and friends in the UK. So I had no option but to go into a women’s refuge with my children. I was absolutely terrified, but the women who ran it were actually very helpful and supportive in helping me apply for sozialhilfe (money) and finding an appartment.

I am still trying to come to terms with what has happened to me. Not only is the abuse in the marriage hard to deal with but now my husband and his family have pulled ranks. They are all in denial that such a charming man could have possibly done this (it was all done behind closed doors.) I think that they have convinced themselves that I am crazy and to be completely disregarded. They have treated me quite disgracefully, isolating me emotionally and financially, to the point where many of you expats rallied round to gather bits of furniture, toys and clothes (real charity case) for us. The family are well off but through clever accountancy, they are claiming that my husband has no money to pay alimony to me.

In the UK emotional abuse is treated as seriously as physical or sexual abuse, however here in CH they seem not to have caught up yet with this concept. I hope that by sharing my very difficult story it will help other people out there because when I searched here for help, I didn’t really find any. I also would like to warn others about the legal trap of moving here and then being stuck!

Last edited by evilshell; 07.07.2009 at 15:47. Reason: changed it to an easier-to-read font
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Old 07.07.2009, 15:07
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

I am really sorry to hear about your situation. There will be alot of EF members who would be able to give you help and advice.
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Old 07.07.2009, 15:29
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

you are quite a couregous women and good for you. the family of your x are surely in denial and who know if it is deeper seeded than just what he (your x) has done or others in the family as well. often people repeat what they know.

i had not thought too much of domestic violence in suisse- but strangely enough yesterday my man and i were having a drink at a cafe in montreux going to the festival when a suisse man just stood up- crazy- and started to try to punch his wife while she held their baby- 1 year or so. it was really wild, and even more strange was the people sitting with them at the cafe just got up and moved out of the way! they didn't wanna get involved but i was disgusted, really. my man, bravely , got in between them for a bit but then a security man for the festival just stood right next to them and watched him chase after her until finally we called the cops and they came only to "discuss" his behavior and find out what the problem was. never was this man taken away, and he struck his wife various times in front of everyone and tried () to pull the baby away from her by the arms/legs. i was so disgusted with both the people around and the police and us two were really shaken up.

i have seen someone try to hit their gf/wife before in nyc but honestly they themselves were beaten down so fast the police didn't have anything to do by the time they came. i am really shocked people seemed to be soooo complacent about domestic violence.

my heart goes out to you- all of the best of luck and stay strong!
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Old 07.07.2009, 20:11
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Domestic abuse in CH - an only too well known issue

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... In the UK emotional abuse is treated as seriously as physical or sexual abuse, however here in CH they seem not to have caught up yet with this concept...
I'm sorry to read what you experienced. However, contrary to what you think, emotional abuse is a well known issue here, too! It's recognized by the so called "Opferberatungsstellen" (counseling offices for victims). I'm a social worker, I deal with exactly this topic. If you wish further information, don't hesitate to contact me via my website: http://www.papa-help.ch
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Old 07.07.2009, 22:21
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

You are obviously a very strong and brave woman to have found the strength not only to have gotten you and your children out of a horrible situation, but having done it in a foreign country with little support. Given everything you are going through and dealing with, you certainly don't need more problems but it sounds like a good lawyer is essential. If your husband has a job, it doesn't matter how creative the accounting is, alimony payments can be made directly to you by his employer. The laws have been changing and improving the situation for women in divorce settlements but a good lawyer is essential.

You are right about Switzerland not having quite caught up on a lot of women's issues. There are no complete figures on such domestic problems and even the government recently pointed out in a report that things must improve in this area.

There are a few sources of help. At this point it sounds like you have found them, but here are some websites with information in case anyone else is in need of help:
http://www.wave-network.org/start.as...ry=SWITZERLAND
http://frauenhaus-schweiz.ch/index.php?id=22
http://www.bif-frauenberatung.ch/bif/index.php
http://www.frauenzentrale.ch/html/

Malinda is right: there are, I'm sure, lots of EF members who will help as best they can. I hope with all my heart that things improve for you and your children.
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Old 07.07.2009, 22:46
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

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In the UK emotional abuse is treated as seriously as physical or sexual abuse,
if there are in fact similar laws and punishments for emotional abusers then thats an insult to those who have been physically and sexually abused. i'd have thought the level of suffering for physical/sexual abuse victims would be far more serious than those who have been emotionally abused; am i alone?
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Old 07.07.2009, 22:53
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

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if there are in fact similar laws and punishments for emotional abusers then thats an insult to those who have been physically and sexually abused. i'd have thought the level of suffering for physical/sexual abuse victims would be far more serious than those who have been emotionally abused; am i alone?
I disagree. The scars from physical violence will fade, but the scars from emotional abuse tend to only get worse over time.

They are equally horrific.
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Old 08.07.2009, 08:04
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

You have obviously been through a lot and I really admire your strength. I hope you have a good network of supportive friends, it seems the support you've had so far has been second to none.

One of the advantages to living in CH, is that there is a lot of help available for women who have been abandoned with their kids, at least from a practical point of view.

As for the emotional side, that will take much longer of course. Are you getting emotional support? Therapy?

If I can help in any way, feel free to pm me. I can relate somewhat to your situation.
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Old 08.07.2009, 08:44
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

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I disagree. The scars from physical violence will fade, but the scars from emotional abuse tend to only get worse over time.

They are equally horrific.
They are horrific but I disagree that they stay forever. With help and courage and therapy things can change. That is a vey negative statement and will keep one in a negative vicious circle.
One needs to snap out of it. But sometimes it requires a lot of help to see how.

I lived in the UK, in Spain, now here have known people from all over the world. Emotional abuse is a thriving social hobby these days. I don't think it is limited to just CH. Spain has a high rate of it and even worse as when the woman finally manages to leave the husband finds her and kills her. The media is reporting it a lot but it's all ways too late.

From emotionally abusive parents to partners to work colleagues to schoolmates... Welcome to the jungle called planet earth. Thank Got for Therapy and for the fact that despite this there are still caring and loving and honest people around. It's not you, it's them.
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Old 08.07.2009, 09:26
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

How I loath this expression.
Al, dear, I'm glad that you have never been emotionally scared, but you're wrong.
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They are horrific but I disagree that they stay forever. With help and courage and therapy things can change. That is a vey negative statement and will keep one in a negative vicious circle.
One needs to snap out of it. But sometimes it requires a lot of help to see how.

I lived in the UK, in Spain, now here have known people from all over the world. Emotional abuse is a thriving social hobby these days. I don't think it is limited to just CH. Spain has a high rate of it and even worse as when the woman finally manages to leave the husband finds her and kills her. The media is reporting it a lot but it's all ways too late.

From emotionally abusive parents to partners to work colleagues to schoolmates... Welcome to the jungle called planet earth. Thank Got for Therapy and for the fact that despite this there are still caring and loving and honest people around. It's not you, it's them.

Last edited by i-b-deborah; 08.07.2009 at 10:20. Reason: punc and splelling
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Old 08.07.2009, 09:29
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

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How I loath this expression.
Al, dear, I'm glad that you have never been emotionally scared, but your wrong.
Took the words out of my fingers.
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Old 08.07.2009, 09:35
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

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How I loath this expression.
Al, dear, I'm glad that you have never been emotionally scared, but your wrong.

Deborah...

What would you know...?? I think 13 years of it is long enough?? You keep thinking the person will change. You love them and they love you and that is all that matters.... Yes, I was talking from my own experience. So don't please. Therapy does help. And I am getting on with my life and happy. Emotional scard do go with help and time. Just like everything else.

If you want to know how bad it was and how bad it got, I can take you out for a coffee and tell you all about. Though I don't think you would cope withe hearing it. Don't be too hasty next time to write silly comments like that. I was trying to be positive and encouraging.

What is it with this forum that there are some very rightgous and condemning people all the time. They are waiting there to bite your head off.

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Old 08.07.2009, 09:42
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

That person who told you, "you need to snap out of it", was wrong.
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Deborah...

What would you know...?? I think 13 years of it is long enough?? You keep thinking the person will change. You love them and they love you and that is all that matters.... Yes, I was talking from my own experience. So don't please. Therapy does help. And I am getting on with my life and happy. Emotional scard do go with help and time. Just like everything else.

If you want to know how bad it was and how bad it got, I can take you out for a coffee and tell you all about. Though I don't think you would cope withe hearing it. Don't be too hasty next time to write silly comments like that. I was trying to be positive and encouraging.

What is it with this forum that there are some very rightgous and condemning people all the time. They are waiting there to bite your head off.

THANKS
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Old 08.07.2009, 10:19
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

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That person who told you, "you need to snap out of it", was wrong.

Yes, that phrase is rather unfortunate, but I think AlZurich has her heart in the right place in the rest of her post. An emotionally abused person needs to decide at some point that she/he's not going to take it anymore and take steps to regain freedom and peace of mind. That decision sometimes is very difficult to arrive at as the abuser, most of the time, has his/her good points as well. In our moments of low self-worth, we rationalise, "I myself am not perfect, so how can I expect him/her to be perfect?"

Sometimes we push the boundary between acceptable behaviour and unacceptable behaviour, and when 'unacceptable behaviour' occurs frequently enough to warrant a decision to depart.

Last edited by argus; 08.07.2009 at 11:00.
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Old 08.07.2009, 10:41
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

Al, when I read your post, I knew straight away when you had written *snap out of it* you meant to get out of it with help as opposed to meaning the victim in question needs to *cop themselves on and snap out of it*. I think language and how we use it is often interpreted and used differently by many of us. Yesterday on another thread what someone had written was interpreted as an attack on parenting skills whereas I saw it as good advice not seeing it at all as a criticism.

I think this thread is about healing and the OP is to be congratulated on her success in getting to where she is today. You too have gone through a rough time and have come out of it as have many. Please don't take an objective comment about a phrase as a personal attack on you as that phrase is often used in a negative way and, as a result, may have bad connotations for someone else.

I'm looking forward to seeing you next week btw
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Old 08.07.2009, 10:55
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

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I moved to CH from the UK almost 3 years ago with my Swiss husband and children. We had marriage problems: my husband was suffering from stress and drinking a lot and I naively thought that CH would cure all of this. I certainly never expected that the children and I would end up staying in a women’s shelter.

Emotional abuse, which I experienced, was so clever I hardly even knew it was happening and that was the reason that I allowed it to go on for so long. The abuse was never physical and started off very subtly. I wish sometimes that it had been physical as then I would have seen it for what it was and put a stop to it. Instead, and over the last five years, the control that my husband had over me become so strong that I was not even allowed to go and visit family in the UK. Things all came to a head for me and I knew I needed to escape but I didn’t know where to get help here in CH. I was also terified about what my husband would do if he knew. I contacted women’s aid in the UK and they gave me the confidence to get a lawyer and make an escape plan. Unfortunately because of the children, we are not allowed to leave CH to be around close family and friends in the UK. So I had no option but to go into a women’s refuge with my children. I was absolutely terrified, but the women who ran it were actually very helpful and supportive in helping me apply for sozialhilfe (money) and finding an appartment.

I am still trying to come to terms with what has happened to me. Not only is the abuse in the marriage hard to deal with but now my husband and his family have pulled ranks. They are all in denial that such a charming man could have possibly done this (it was all done behind closed doors.) I think that they have convinced themselves that I am crazy and to be completely disregarded. They have treated me quite disgracefully, isolating me emotionally and financially, to the point where many of you expats rallied round to gather bits of furniture, toys and clothes (real charity case) for us. The family are well off but through clever accountancy, they are claiming that my husband has no money to pay alimony to me.

In the UK emotional abuse is treated as seriously as physical or sexual abuse, however here in CH they seem not to have caught up yet with this concept. I hope that by sharing my very difficult story it will help other people out there because when I searched here for help, I didn’t really find any. I also would like to warn others about the legal trap of moving here and then being stuck!
My heart goes out to you. Unfortunately this happens a lot in Switzerland. It is well known that Swiss men go off to other countries to find a woman. They then start their bullying once back in Switzerland. Since I meet a lot of foreign women (married to Swiss) where I go to German classes and also "weiter bildung" I hear their stories all the time, and believe me, some very similar to what you mention. This is NOT ok, and should not be tolerated. I think these men know very well that no Swiss woman will tolerate this kind of noncense, and that is why they cannot find a lady here, and cross borders to find someone they know they can bully. Correct me if I am wrong, but this is the impression I get. My advice to all these women are, go back to school, learn and keep on learning. Find a good job, and be independent. Never allow a man to control you. But, it is not so easy when there are small children involved. Daycare is very expensive, and the controlling husband will then just make everything more difficult. But seek help, asap, there is always a way out. Wish you all the best, you seem to be a very strong woman, and it will all work out fine for you.
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Old 08.07.2009, 11:03
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

The thread here posted by mrscouragous is an all too common account of abuse and I wish her the very best for her future with her children. It must be very hard being away from her family and their support. Emotional abuse is in many ways a lot more difficult to deal with and to prove. It is often continual and usually calculated. I have a sister who is a relate councillor and a good friend (female) who is a psychiatrist and they both deal with such matters. Physical abuse is much more likely to be committed by men, but psychological abuse and or continual goading is just as likely to be committed by females. Stupid men who would be laughed at if they reported such abuse, often resort to violence, so we normally only see women as the victims of physical abuse. Psychological abuse is much more common, with victims and perpetrators from both sexes.
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Old 08.07.2009, 11:11
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

thank you so much for sharing, you are mrs. courageous indeed
i am not going to put my opinions here (i think we could take this to another thread about the ways to deal with abuse in general)
i hope you keep us updated as to your situation.I am pretty sure there are others on this forum going through what you are or have gone through.
sometimes EF may seem faceless & anonymous but you'd be suprised at the support you can get here. perhaps you could be of help to someone else - who knows?
you are not alone...know that
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Old 08.07.2009, 11:24
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

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you are quite a couregous women and good for you. the family of your x are surely in denial and who know if it is deeper seeded than just what he (your x) has done or others in the family as well. often people repeat what they know.

i had not thought too much of domestic violence in suisse- but strangely enough yesterday my man and i were having a drink at a cafe in montreux going to the festival when a suisse man just stood up- crazy- and started to try to punch his wife while she held their baby- 1 year or so. it was really wild, and even more strange was the people sitting with them at the cafe just got up and moved out of the way! they didn't wanna get involved but i was disgusted, really. my man, bravely , got in between them for a bit but then a security man for the festival just stood right next to them and watched him chase after her until finally we called the cops and they came only to "discuss" his behavior and find out what the problem was. never was this man taken away, and he struck his wife various times in front of everyone and tried () to pull the baby away from her by the arms/legs. i was so disgusted with both the people around and the police and us two were really shaken up.

i have seen someone try to hit their gf/wife before in nyc but honestly they themselves were beaten down so fast the police didn't have anything to do by the time they came. i am really shocked people seemed to be soooo complacent about domestic violence.

my heart goes out to you- all of the best of luck and stay strong!
This is shocking, really. I saw something similar in Zurich once, no one took notice, just ignored it. I thought, 'what is wrong with people?' I cannot stand violence, even yelling freaks me out. Why is it that the Swiss do not go to the rescue of others? Is it that they do not want to get involved with domestic issues, are they scared they will get hurt, or what is the problem?? I have to admit, in the US people will always help, espesially when a woman is in trouble. If I have a baseball bat with me, and I see a man punches his wife/friend, I will knock him out from behind. I swear I will. I know I said I hate violence, but in the instant of the moment I will take action, no man should beat a woman. Send them to jail, for a long time. If he beats her, one day he might just take her life.
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Old 08.07.2009, 11:27
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Re: Domestic abuse in CH

ever considered going back?

Im sorry to hear that and yes, Switzerland is difficult when it comes to any kind of abuse..
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