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Old 17.09.2015, 17:53
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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Hi all

I wanted to give my baby BCG vaccination as per the rules in india. But here doctor said they are not allowed to give. Few of them are here exception like rotavirus vaccination, bcg vaccination and some others. Do you people know why so much of variation from one country to other?
I was given the choice of BCG or not since it is obligatory at home as well, I just brought my kid's home vax calendar to justify and that was it. Your pediatrician can certainly offer it to you, order and administer. It is easy. At the end I didn't have my kid vaxed since he ordered at a manufacturer who at that time had a big problem in Europe with serious secondary side-effects. You can still have your kid vaxed later.

Last edited by MusicChick; 17.09.2015 at 22:59.
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  #362  
Old 15.12.2015, 14:59
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

Ho-hum...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a6772501.html

Feel sorry for the kids of such parents...

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Australian school welcoming of anti-vaccination parents suffers major chickenpox epidemic
80 pupils at the primary school in Melbourne have been hit by the infectious disease after staff asked parents to be 'tolerate' of those who did not want to vaccinate their children
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  #363  
Old 16.12.2015, 13:05
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

This page is German http://www.impfen-nein-danke.de/

and this woman has some information in English

http://www.alabasterliving.com/apps/search?q=vaccinate

Hope this helps and I don't get somebody hammering back
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  #364  
Old 16.12.2015, 13:08
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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This page is German http://www.impfen-nein-danke.de/

and this woman has some information in English

http://www.alabasterliving.com/apps/search?q=vaccinate

Hope this helps and I don't get somebody hammering back
Jeez. Those lunatic fringe links help nobody. You've got absolutely no chance of avoiding a hammering.

Assuming your links represent your personal views, do you have any evidence to back up your idea that vaccination is damaging?
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  #365  
Old 31.08.2017, 11:50
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

Great news. "World's #1 anti-vaxxer", described as "dangerous", is denied entry to Australia.
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  #366  
Old 09.10.2018, 12:39
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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False. Vaccines are proven to save millions of lives.

If you have evidence of the contrary, show it, but it must be peer-reviewed scientific studies, not a random page on the internet.
Vaccines have killed before peer-reviewed scientific studies even existed. Vaccines themselves were produced in a time before any science could prove anything like the existence of a microorganism, however this never stopped the Church of Science from forcing millions to get vaccinated against their will with a Smallpox vaccine often contaminated.

Just check the International Classification of Death ICD coding system, that since 1900 has recognized and acknowledge deaths following vaccination:

ICD-1 / 1900
04 Death by Cow-pox and other effects of vaccination

ICD-2 / 1929
44(1) Vaccinia
44(2) Other sequelae of vaccination

And this article collects articles/publications up until 1930s, written by scholars and scientists on the dangers of vaccination:
[advertising element removed]

Can you site the article that proves that vaccines save millions of lives? Other than some random estimation by the WHO or CDC who use mathematical models to estimate health outcomes?

Medical libraries and national archives are full of medical articles highlighting the dangers of vaccination and diseases actually spread by vaccination. This is where I get my info, not some random page on the internet.

Last edited by mirfield; 09.10.2018 at 13:01. Reason: Advertising element removed
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  #367  
Old 09.10.2018, 12:43
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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Vaccines have killed before peer-reviewed scientific studies even existed. Vaccines themselves were produced in a time before any science could prove anything like the existence of a microorganism, however this never stopped the Church of Science from forcing millions to get vaccinated against their will with a Smallpox vaccine often contaminated.

Just check the International Classification of Death ICD coding system, that since 1900 has recognized and acknowledge deaths following vaccination:

ICD-1 / 1900
04 Death by Cow-pox and other effects of vaccination

ICD-2 / 1929
44(1) Vaccinia
44(2) Other sequelae of vaccination

And this article collects articles/publications up until 1930s, written by scholars and scientists on the dangers of vaccination:
[advertising element removed]

Can you site the article that proves that vaccines save millions of lives? Other than some random estimation by the WHO or CDC who use mathematical models to estimate health outcomes?

Medical libraries and national archives are full of medical articles highlighting the dangers of vaccination and diseases actually spread by vaccination. This is where I get my info, not some random page on the internet.
Yup. I get all my medical advice from designers and copywriters.

Thank you for the tips.

Last edited by mirfield; 09.10.2018 at 13:01. Reason: Advertising element removed from quoted text
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  #368  
Old 09.10.2018, 12:45
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

Bottom line is how many lives have vaccinations saved? All this shrieky bullshit about vaccinations being harmful is just counterproductive and the reasons that previously rare diseases needlessly pop up again.

Try telling some poor mother in the developing world that it's a good job the child she just lost to some horrendous painful and undignified but easily preventable disease didn't get harmed by vaccinations. If you do, I'd advise you to run and run fast.
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  #369  
Old 09.10.2018, 12:56
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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Bottom line is how many lives have vaccinations saved? All this shrieky bullshit about vaccinations being harmful is just counterproductive and the reasons that previously rare diseases needlessly pop up again.

Try telling some poor mother in the developing world that it's a good job the child she just lost to some horrendous painful and undignified but easily preventable disease didn't get harmed by vaccinations. If you do, I'd advise you to run and run fast.
Try telling some poor mother in the developing world that her child died because instead of providing clean water, sanitation and good nutrition, we spend billions on vaccines (that shouldn't be given to immunocompromised people). Also we use these developing countries as testing grounds for experiments that would never be allowed in developed nations.

Speaking of rare diseases, in Switzerland we now have 6% of the population, or 500'000 people (mainly children) suffering from around 7000-8000 different orphan diseases. Meanwhile we continue to vaccinate pregnant women and even premature babies!

You may call this "shrieky bullshit", but it is real. Medical dangers of vaccination exist and are largely unknown as our understanding of the body is still incomplete! Scientists seems to forget that point. We still do not understand many biological mechanisms of body, which is by far more sophisticated than anything else on the planet.

Discrimination against people who question vaccination must stop and name-calling will get us nowhere. It just highlights the immaturity of people who are fear-mongered into believing people who don't vaccinate are dangers to society, when actually it could be the other way around....
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  #370  
Old 09.10.2018, 12:59
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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Medical dangers of vaccination exist and are largely unknown as our understanding of the body is still incomplete!
Nobody denies that. I still think that avoiding becoming lame from having polio, infertile from mumps is a "risk" a parent should take for their children.

For similar reasons you should then avoid blood transfusions as well
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  #371  
Old 09.10.2018, 13:08
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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Nobody denies that. I still think that avoiding becoming lame from having polio, infertile from mumps is a "risk" a parent should take for their children.

For similar reasons you should then avoid blood transfusions as well
You have to be able to discern what is the real "risk" of diseases, and here in Switzerland the risk of becoming infertile from mumps is low to non-existent and polio....well we could debate for hours on polio; what it is and what causes it; but we do know that the oral polio given in developing nations can cause polio. As for the inactivated polio vaccine given in Switzerland, if you believe it will protect you from polio, then take it.

Choice of the individual is paramount. Transparent medical information as well, and sadly too much advice with regards to vaccination is simply: if you don't do it, your child with die from an infectious disease.

We understand blood transfusions enough to know that it is essential to screen it beforehand and to give the same blood type or O- to an unknown blood group. Also we only give blood transfusions in a medical emergency.

This is quite different from the medical intervention of vaccination given to healthy people indiscriminately, which aggresses the immune system with potential for neurological or other physiological damage (that again we have little understanding of).
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  #372  
Old 09.10.2018, 13:13
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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You have to be able to discern what is the real "risk" of diseases, and here in Switzerland the risk of becoming infertile from mumps is low to non-existent and polio....well we could debate for hours on polio; what it is and what causes it; but we do know that the oral polio given in developing nations can cause polio. As for the inactivated polio vaccine given in Switzerland, if you believe it will protect you from polio, then take it.

Choice of the individual is paramount. Transparent medical information as well, and sadly too much advice with regards to vaccination is simply: if you don't do it, your child with die from an infectious disease.

We understand blood transfusions enough to know that it is essential to screen it beforehand and to give the same blood type or O- to an unknown blood group. Also we only give blood transfusions in a medical emergency.

This is quite different from the medical intervention of vaccination given to healthy people indiscriminately, which aggresses the immune system with potential for neurological or other physiological damage (that again we have little understanding of).
Absolutely right - we should go back to the tradition way of doing things! I grew up in a country with zero vaccinations, and life expectancy was a pretty impressive 32-years for males and less for females.

After all, as you say, the risk of mumps or polio is low in Switzerland - surely that's not because most European countries had these vaccines deployed en-masse a generation or two ago.

What I find most upsetting is that every. single. anti. vaxxer. has been discredited. Yet people still blindly follow, putting others at risk.

You're welcome to do what you want, but don't put others at risk.
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  #373  
Old 09.10.2018, 13:13
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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You have to be able to discern what is the real "risk" of diseases, and here in Switzerland the risk of becoming infertile from mumps is low to non-existent and polio....well we could debate for hours on polio; what it is and what causes it; but we do know that the oral polio given in developing nations can cause polio. As for the inactivated polio vaccine given in Switzerland, if you believe it will protect you from polio, then take it.

Choice of the individual is paramount. Transparent medical information as well, and sadly too much advice with regards to vaccination is simply: if you don't do it, your child with die from an infectious disease.

We understand blood transfusions enough to know that it is essential to screen it beforehand and to give the same blood type or O- to an unknown blood group. Also we only give blood transfusions in a medical emergency.

This is quite different from the medical intervention of vaccination given to healthy people indiscriminately, which aggresses the immune system with potential for neurological or other physiological damage (that again we have little understanding of).

I just hope that your kids will never infect an other child that could not have vaccinations (for example due to being immuno suppressed).
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  #374  
Old 09.10.2018, 13:15
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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I just hope that your kids will never infect an other child that could not have vaccinations (for example due to being immuno suppressed).
Or simply a newborn, which is normally protected because the kids around it are vaccinated and little to no risk.
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  #375  
Old 09.10.2018, 13:17
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Absolutely right - we should go back to the tradition way of doing things! I grew up in a country with zero vaccinations, and life expectancy was a pretty impressive 32-years for males and less for females.

After all, as you say, the risk of mumps or polio is low in Switzerland - surely that's not because most European countries had these vaccines deployed en-masse a generation or two ago.

What I find most upsetting is that every. single. anti. vaxxer. has been discredited. Yet people still blindly follow, putting others at risk.

You're welcome to do what you want, but don't put others at risk.
Which country was that?
Mumps vaccine actually caused mumps initially, so that vaccine was quietly taken off the market and replaced.
Vaccinees actually can put others at risk by shedding live virus as has been medically proven with the flu, polio and measles.

I can hear your fear and brainwashing.
Good luck with that!

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I just hope that your kids will never infect an other child that could not have vaccinations (for example due to being immuno suppressed).
You forget the vaccinated kids who can spread disease.
And don't worry, I do not want to procreate in a world filled with ignorance and fear.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 09.10.2018 at 21:18. Reason: merging consecutive replies
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Old 09.10.2018, 13:23
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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You forget the vaccinated kids who can spread disease.
And don't worry, I do not want to procreate in a world filled with ignorance and fear.
So you just joined a forum to rage against vaccinations for no particular reason?

Bit troll-oll-oll, no?
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Old 09.10.2018, 13:24
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

This thread indeed shows that the advances in medicine are a double-edged sword. They have allowed for individuals with extremely low IQ to somehow survive, get educated and even write bullshit on internet forums.
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Old 09.10.2018, 13:38
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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Can you site the article that proves that vaccines save millions of lives? Other than some random estimation by the WHO or CDC who use mathematical models to estimate health outcomes?
How else are you supposed to measure it? (PS, here's one such article, good journal, peer reviewed, but obviously relying on a model)
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29446090


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Just check the International Classification of Death ICD coding system, that since 1900 has recognized and acknowledge deaths following vaccination:
Developed by 'the WHO' and published by the CDC!
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Old 09.10.2018, 13:42
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

May I ask what qualifies you to debunk years and years of work by scientists that has been scrutinized and finally published?
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Old 09.10.2018, 13:47
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Re: Avoiding Vaccination?

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Which country was that?
Mumps vaccine actually caused mumps initially, so that vaccine was quietly taken off the market and replaced.
Vaccinees actually can put others at risk by shedding live virus as has been medically proven with the flu, polio and measles.

I can hear your fear and brainwashing.
Good luck with that!
The first mumps vaccine was a dead virus so certainly did not cause mumps. It also wasn't sufficiently effective, hence was discontinued.

Mumps causes 1 death per 10,000 infections and maybe 10 times that in infertility issues but I'd love to see you prove the vaccine even comes close to that level of risk.

Oh and it's basically BS about vaccinated people infecting others. Or at least stunningly exceptionally rare. Unvaccinated people causing infections otoh....
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