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Old 08.01.2011, 02:28
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Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

I'll start by saying that yes, I have searched here, as well as the rest of the internet. However, I can't find what I am after, and I'm hoping someone can point me in the right direction.

I'm looking for the business and personal tax rates, at federal, cantonal and municipal levels. Corporation tax, income tax, dividend tax, capital gains tax, etc. All the taxes that pertain to running, owning and being paid by an IT consultancy that is a Limited Liability Corporation. Also the social security, mandatory pension plans, the Three Pillars that are compulsory.

I need to know the different levels the rates kick in at, so hopefully a table exists somewhere. Calculators won't really help because I am trying to structure a salary/share dividend split, as I have done in the UK. I need raw data.

My understanding is there should be a single table for each tax at the federal level, then 26 tables at the cantonal level, and 2,596 tables at the municipal level.

I have tried the estv.admin.ch, but it isn't really navigable unless you speak French or German. None of the information I am after seems to be in English. I found this page here but the tables are simplified and out of date.

With this I hope to create a spreadsheet or database that will calculate the best salary/dividend split for a given contract rate, as well as advise on which canton/municipality would be best to set up the business. I will of course post it here if anyone else would find it useful.

Since my German is nonexistent, and my French is sub-par, anyone who can translate estv.admin.ch data to English would be appreciated.
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Old 08.01.2011, 03:12
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

as your first post this is quite impressive!

sorry, i'm leaving.
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Old 08.01.2011, 04:30
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

You have got to be joking. This is a joke right?
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Old 08.01.2011, 04:43
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

look some more and fit the pieces to the puzzle.
people are not gonna give that info in general cause then you would know how much we earn........and thats a big secret here in Switzerland.


for your questions, go see a tax adviser and be done with it instead of relying of general believes and experiences. It will Always be different
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Old 08.01.2011, 10:01
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

How much are you paying?
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Old 08.01.2011, 13:56
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

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look some more and fit the pieces to the puzzle.
people are not gonna give that info in general cause then you would know how much we earn........and thats a big secret here in Switzerland.


for your questions, go see a tax adviser and be done with it instead of relying of general believes and experiences. It will Always be different

I'm looking for tax rate tables, not your salary. What gave you the impression that I was.
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Old 08.01.2011, 14:29
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

See, I know that there are some tables are on estv.admin.ch (somewhere). I have seen other threads that post previous years tables.

What I need are this year's rates. I have tried translating the site through Google, but the documents themselves are still in French or German.

Using the UK as an example, Income tax rates are like this:

Income Tax rates and taxable bands Rate2009-102010-112011-12Starting rate for savings: 10%*£0-£2,440£0-£2,440£0- £2,560Basic rate: 20%£0-£37,400£0-£37,400£0- £35,000Higher rate: 40%Over £37,400£37,401-£150,000£35,001-£150,000Additional rate: 50%Not applicableOver £150,000Over £150,000Income Tax rates and taxable bands Rate2009-102010-112011-12Starting rate for savings: 10%*£0-£2,440£0-£2,440£0- £2,560Basic rate: 20%£0-£37,400£0-£37,400£0- £35,000Higher rate: 40%Over £37,400£37,401-£150,000£35,001-£150,000Additional rate: 50%Not applicableOver £150,000Over £150,000
£0-£37,400 = 20% (Basic rate)
£37,401-£150,000 = 40% (Higher rate)
£150,001+ = 50% (Additional rate)

So surely there is a table similar to this for the Federal rates?
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Old 08.01.2011, 14:31
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

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See, I know that there are some tables are on estv.admin.ch (somewhere). I have seen other threads that post previous years tables.

What I need are this year's rates. I have tried translating the site through Google, but the documents themselves are still in French or German.

Using the UK as an example, Income tax rates are like this:

£0-£37,400 = 20% (Basic rate)
£37,401-£150,000 = 40% (Higher rate)
£150,001+ = 50% (Additional rate)

So surely there is a table similar to this for the Federal rates?
Sorry, copy/paste is a little strange here.
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Old 08.01.2011, 15:08
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

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With this I hope to create a spreadsheet or database that will calculate the best salary/dividend split for a given contract rate, as well as advise on which canton/municipality would be best to set up the business. I will of course post it here if anyone else would find it useful.
okay so i'll bite again.

so you have a business idea in which you would like to advise new/existing companies on where to locate. i assume yours is not a charitable organisation. for you to be able to offer that advice you wish one of us to do the research and translations for your model/idea for free!

a model which i believe is flawed. As far as I know when you create a company in CH the two most important (only?) numbers that matter from the company point of view is corporation tax and maybe VAT. What do personal/individual income, municipal, federal taxes matter for incorporating a company? dividend/split you mention and purely personal/individual not company related and are taxed on the individual and where the individual is resident. that has nothing to do with where the company is incorporated. if the dividend/split is held in the company name then it is corporation tax that matters, as these would be assets/profits held by the company.

i'm obviously missing the point ....
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Old 08.01.2011, 17:31
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

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okay so i'll bite again.

so you have a business idea in which you would like to advise new/existing companies on where to locate. i assume yours is not a charitable organisation. for you to be able to offer that advice you wish one of us to do the research and translations for your model/idea for free!
i'm obviously missing the point ....

Nope.

It's free.

I am an IT contractor. In the UK I run a limited company where I am the Director and sole employee. I take a small salary and the rest as share dividends. The size of the salary depends on where the tax brackets are that year.

The UK has just one rate, wherever you are located. Corporation tax is the same in Manchester and London. Income tax for the employee is the same wherever they work or live.

In Switzerland where company is registered makes a difference to the taxes. Where the employee lives/works makes a difference.

I want to build a model showing what the costs to the company AND the employee would be depending on where they are based. It will be either a spreadsheet or database depending on how complex a structure it is.

I will post a copy of it here when I am done, because I have read many posts from people in a similar situation as myself, and the advice is either to get a tax adviser (expensive) or to use an umbrella company. Umbrella companies will take a large chunk of your income, and for doing practically nothing.

All I need to get started are the taxes at the Federal level. I will worry about cantonal and municipal taxes later.
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Old 08.01.2011, 17:38
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

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Nope.

All I need to get started are the taxes at the Federal level. I will worry about cantonal and municipal taxes later.
What? Like this? (I put 'swiss federal tax calculator' in Google and it came out #1)...
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Old 08.01.2011, 18:50
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

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What? Like this? (I put 'swiss federal tax calculator' in Google and it came out #1)...
Close. But if you read the description it's only a calculator, not the rate tables. Also, the calculations are more general and "not binding or accurate". Finally, there is little information on what the rates mean. The Geneva 2010 calculator says that the Cantonal tax is 147.5%

I'm after the tables that show each banding for the tax.
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Old 08.01.2011, 19:15
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

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Close. But if you read the description it's only a calculator, not the rate tables. Also, the calculations are more general and "not binding or accurate". Finally, there is little information on what the rates mean. The Geneva 2010 calculator says that the Cantonal tax is 147.5%

I'm after the tables that show each banding for the tax.
...and I have to google these for you, do I??
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Old 08.01.2011, 19:35
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

Found this site:

Whilst it lumps the Federal, Cantonal and Municipal taxes into one percentage, it does have a Federal table on it.

I have one question about the table (aside from "is it up to date?")

The brackets are like this:

Band / Tax on Lower Amount / Tax on Excess

0-13,600 = 0 CHF :: 0%
13,601-29,800 = 0 CHF :: 0.77%
29,801-39,000 = 124.70 CHF :: 0.88%

Can someone sanity check my numbers? Earning 20,000 is the second band. 0 CHF lump sum, 49.27 CHF on excess (20,000 - 13,601 = 6,399. @ 0.77% = 49.27)

Earning 30,000 is the third bracket. 124.70 CHF lump sum, 1.75 CHF on excess (30,000 - 29,801 = 199. @ 0.88% = 1.75)

If that is right, then all I need are this years tables.

AbFab, if Google was the answer I wouldn't be here. But it seems that the official site, estv.admin.ch only publishes the figues in French and German. I speak neither, and Google site translation hasn't helped. The estv.admin.ch site provides English to only a very limited section, none of which concerns tax rates.

I am hoping that someone on here will either have this years tables, and be able to help me understand the French/German or have English copies. If you think Google is the answer, please provide me a link so I can get started. But as I said in my first post, I have tried that already, and gotten nowhere.
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Old 09.01.2011, 03:33
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

Can you really not see that what you asking is completely out of line? Why don't you hire a French or German speaking VA to help you with this. No one is going to go do this work for you for free:


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I'm looking for the business and personal tax rates, at federal, cantonal and municipal levels. Corporation tax, income tax, dividend tax, capital gains tax, etc. All the taxes that pertain to running, owning and being paid by an IT consultancy that is a Limited Liability Corporation. Also the social security, mandatory pension plans, the Three Pillars that are compulsory.


My understanding is there should be a single table for each tax at the federal level, then 26 tables at the cantonal level, and 2,596 tables at the municipal level.
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Old 09.01.2011, 10:17
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

At least the As(s) bit is right pedro. You seem to expect a general forum to answer your question, direction to a tax specialist is your best and most option for "binding and accurate" figures don't you think. I'm sure google or the better still Geneva tax office (perish the thought that an IT wallah would chose the personal option) would help find a specialist, or will that be your next question
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Old 09.01.2011, 21:32
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

http://genevalunch.com/files/2010/04...09-Fre-Ger.pdf

This.

This is what the whole point of my thread has been about.

All I am asking for is someone to point me to the download links for this years tables. They are on the official site, but the site does not provide the documents in English. It does not provide links to the foreign documents in English. It does not provide search results containing these documents in English. Google DOES NOT HELP. I need help from someone who can understand enough French or German to find these tables.

For an individual, all they would be concerned about is Income Tax and the Three Pillars, right? For a company, it would be Corporation Tax, Tax on Share Dividends and again the Three Pillars, yes?
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Old 09.01.2011, 21:39
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

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At least the As(s) bit is right pedro. You seem to expect a general forum to answer your question, direction to a tax specialist is your best and most option for "binding and accurate" figures don't you think. I'm sure google or the better still Geneva tax office (perish the thought that an IT wallah would chose the personal option) would help find a specialist, or will that be your next question
See post below for what I am after. As to why I expected help from the forum; I can't be the first person to ask for tax tables, can I? Surely others are curious as to how the calculations are done, if not in a similar position with regards to taking the Limited Company route for their contracting? Am I really the first contractor on the forums who wants to do the salary/dividend split as per the UK?

Yes, the Tax office would be (will be) my next port of call on Monday. However I thought that it might be quicker and more helpful on here. With an old thread providing a link to one of the very things I was after, it didn't seem much of a stretch to ask for the updated material, and similar work besides.
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Old 10.01.2011, 09:37
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

The tax tables are available on the cantonal tax websites. If I can use google to find them - so can you
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Old 10.01.2011, 10:25
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Re: Tax rates (yes, another one..wait come back!)

I believe this is what you were looking for (on federal level). http://www.admin.ch/ch/d/sr/642_11/a214.html

This is regulated in an act (Bundesgesetz über die direkten Bundessteuern (DBG), direkte Bundessteuern = direct federal taxes). But I agree with the others above: get a qualified answer by a professional if it's that important to you otherwise you just use a calculater and you enter different salaries and will see how the rates changes. It's no rocket sience after all!
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