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  #101  
Old 23.10.2014, 11:49
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

I opened one. The interest rate is crap everywhere.

If you are going to have it for many years, like I expect to, choose one where you can invest the capital in some indexed fund or something.

That may be suboptimal if you are going to return to employment in Switzerland in a few years, as I think you are forced to cash out the funds and put them back into 2nd pillar if you do (and you may be forced to sell funds at a bad timing).
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  #102  
Old 23.10.2014, 12:09
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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I opened one. The interest rate is crap everywhere.

If you are going to have it for many years, like I expect to, choose one where you can invest the capital in some indexed fund or something.

That may be suboptimal if you are going to return to employment in Switzerland in a few years, as I think you are forced to cash out the funds and put them back into 2nd pillar if you do (and you may be forced to sell funds at a bad timing).
Well, I am looking for one only for a short-period of time. So I prefer something with guaranteed interests (although peanuts)....and more importantly perhaps the cost of opening/closing/transferring...
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  #103  
Old 23.10.2014, 12:15
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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I opened one. The interest rate is crap everywhere.

If you are going to have it for many years, like I expect to, choose one where you can invest the capital in some indexed fund or something.

That may be suboptimal if you are going to return to employment in Switzerland in a few years, as I think you are forced to cash out the funds and put them back into 2nd pillar if you do (and you may be forced to sell funds at a bad timing).
Well I have a Freizügigkeitskonto from employment upto 9 years ago. I also have a Pensionkasse , not yet told them I have left CH, your supposed to reinvest your Freizuegigkeitskonto but I chose to not mention it, nobody asked either.
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  #104  
Old 23.10.2014, 12:18
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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Well I have a Freizügigkeitskonto from employment upto 9 years ago. I also have a Pensionkasse , not yet told them I have left CH, your supposed to reinvest your Freizuegigkeitskonto but I chose to not mention it, nobody asked either.
You meant when you moved back into emplyoment (in CH), it was not necessary to transfer all your freizügigkeitskonto into the pensionskasse?
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  #105  
Old 23.10.2014, 12:22
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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You meant when you moved back into emplyoment (in CH), it was not necessary to transfer all your freizügigkeitskonto into the pensionskasse?
I just did not do it, absolutely nothing happened.
Due to Swiss privacy laws nobody will ever know what accounts you have in CH, unless you tell someone it will remains a secret.
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  #106  
Old 23.10.2014, 12:26
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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I just did not do it, absolutely nothing happened.
Due to Swiss privacy laws nobody will ever know what accounts you have in CH, unless you tell someone it will remains a secret.
Well, true. Just I think if the interest at the pensionskasse is higher than the one for Freizügigkeitskonto then it makes sense to transfer. I heard one can split the money in pensionskasse into 2 freizügigkeitskonto too....?

Another difference is also with Freizügigkeitskonto you can determine the investment fund portion while for pensionskasse you can't (as it depends on the company), am I right? So there could be a risk of gain or loss with FK.
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  #107  
Old 23.10.2014, 12:51
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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Well, true. Just I think if the interest at the pensionskasse is higher than the one for Freizügigkeitskonto then it makes sense to transfer. I heard one can split the money in pensionskasse into 2 freizügigkeitskonto too....?

Another difference is also with Freizügigkeitskonto you can determine the investment fund portion while for pensionskasse you can't (as it depends on the company), am I right? So there could be a risk of gain or loss with FK.
I wish to invest in equities, not looking for a safe 2% return so leaving it in a Freizuegigkeitskonto will be better over time. I am not interested in day to day fluctuations, BTW last weeks financial crash is over..... so the market is actually very robust. Jo Public is not investing in equities today, they will when the market rises another 50%-100%, like with houses, they always want to pay top price & are comforted by recent price rises.
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  #108  
Old 18.11.2014, 22:55
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Re: BVG - non Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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In reply to MUZE7 and OMMTHREE

The company I will use is Pensfree in Kanton Schwyz to invest my BVG
http://www.pens-expert.ch/en/free/

After months of researching it's the best solution I can find for my personal circumstances regarding fees, fund cost ratios, performance and taxes. I can invest it how I want (no Freizuegigkeitskonto) - up to 50% in equities is allowed for BVG. Or I can also choose one of their BVG funds.

Good luck
I've also had great experience with Pensfree. English speaking and very helpful.
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  #109  
Old 11.02.2015, 23:43
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

I am resurrecting this tread to see if something changed.

Basically, I am moving to the USA and I want to put my Pillar 2 money in a vested benefit account. Given all the FATCA issues, does anybody have a recommendation for a bank that would not make problems with people living in the USA?
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  #110  
Old 27.03.2015, 15:24
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

I read through this thread but couldn't understand the convenience of not opening a vested benefit account at Stiftung Auffangeinrichtung BVG (s. also here) with higher interest rate over accounts from PensExpert, Liberty, PostFinance, UBS, CS, etc — other than investing with these crooks.

AFAIK, if you were to leave to a non-EU country you could transfer the sum to a foundation in a low tax kanton, move and then make the transfer.

Also, I don't know if they're as secretive as a bank.

But other than the above I don't see any upside to going for the other options.

Any ideas?
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  #111  
Old 27.03.2015, 16:02
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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I read through this thread but couldn't understand the convenience of not opening a vested benefit account at Stiftung Auffangeinrichtung BVG (s. also here) with higher interest rate over accounts from PensExpert, Liberty, PostFinance, UBS, CS, etc — other than investing with these crooks.

AFAIK, if you were to leave to a non-EU country you could transfer the sum to a foundation in a low tax kanton, move and then make the transfer.

Also, I don't know if they're as secretive as a bank.

But other than the above I don't see any upside to going for the other options.

Any ideas?
Interesting question! I too have the impression that BVG fund is not good, but I never really know why it is not good compared to other bank. The general rule sorts of points out that if you give no instruction to your employer upon leaving your job about your pension fund, it will automatically be transferred to BVG after 6 months at YOUR COST.
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  #112  
Old 27.03.2015, 16:19
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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Interesting question! I too have the impression that BVG fund is not good, but I never really know why it is not good compared to other bank. The general rule sorts of points out that if you give no instruction to your employer upon leaving your job about your pension fund, it will automatically be transferred to BVG after 6 months at YOUR COST.
Let me rephrase it — I actually think that unless you want to play investor with your 2nd pillar, Stiftung Auffangeinrichtung BVG is quite good.
But maybe someone knowledgeable points the disadvantages out.
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  #113  
Old 27.03.2015, 21:31
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

This would be one reason:

The legal registered office of Stiftung Auffangeinrichtung BVG and our offices are in Zurich

This implies Zurich taxes when you withdraw the funds. Other organisations are registered in lower tax locations.
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  #114  
Old 27.03.2015, 21:43
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

I saw the interest at BVG is 0.75% currently, which is higher than most of the commercial banks. Do you know any better bank? I reckon if one does not intend to withdraw it in short-term, the interest reason is more important than the tax issue. Moreover we can actually change to other bank if we find better interest later...

Any thought?
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  #115  
Old 27.03.2015, 21:47
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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This would be one reason:

The legal registered office of Stiftung Auffangeinrichtung BVG and our offices are in Zurich

This implies Zurich taxes when you withdraw the funds. Other organisations are registered in lower tax locations.
As I said, nothing seems to hinder you to transfer the sum to a foundation in a lower tax canton before you move and withdraw funds. Check art. 6 of the regulations (German only).
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  #116  
Old 27.03.2015, 21:50
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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As I said, nothing seems to hinder you to transfer the sum to a foundation in a lower tax canton before you move and withdraw funds. Check art. 6 of the regulations (German only).
Very true. Just one word of caution though. For some banks, there might be some charges if you dissolve the account or dissolve without holding the account for certain period....that would be the catch I could think of....
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  #117  
Old 27.03.2015, 22:01
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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I saw the interest at BVG is 0.75% currently, which is higher than most of the commercial banks. Do you know any better bank? I reckon if one does not intend to withdraw it in short-term, the interest reason is more important than the tax issue. Moreover we can actually change to other bank if we find better interest later...

Any thought?
I linked to some banks in my first post, the Stiftung still offers the best rate. You can also open it online (I don't know what they refer to with Sammelzahlung and Einzelzahlung though ). Oh and they also provide advise in English. If you're in to that
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  #118  
Old 27.03.2015, 22:07
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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For some banks, there might be some charges if you dissolve the account or dissolve without holding the account for certain period....that would be the catch I could think of....
The Stiftung only costs seem to be for withdrawing money to buy housing for your own use (art 14 of the regulations linked above).
PostFinance says upfront (link in first post) no costs. The other banks are crooks with tricky fact sheets.
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  #119  
Old 27.03.2015, 23:30
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

By the way, I heard that splitting the account into two maybe a good strategy for tax reason. So transferring from your ex-employer pension fund would be a good opportunity to do so....So maybe the solution is one account at BVG, one at Postfinance?
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  #120  
Old 28.03.2015, 14:09
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Re: Freizuegigkeitskonto [vested benefit account]

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By the way, I heard that splitting the account into two maybe a good strategy for tax reason. So transferring from your ex-employer pension fund would be a good opportunity to do so....So maybe the solution is one account at BVG, one at Postfinance?
Splitting was mentioned in this thread AFAIR.

BVG+PF should be ok.

Don't know though — today retirement seems to me like the paradise of the monotheists
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