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  #21  
Old 12.07.2011, 13:46
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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I did find an English speaking church in Basel (30 minutes from my house by train). If I were to attend that church then what?
You would pay the church taxes where you live. They don't care where, or if, you go to church.

Tom
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Old 12.07.2011, 13:46
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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Private opinion vs law.... which one do you think wins in a democracy ?
You are in Switzerland, locals do not have to care about your mother tongue at all. Nothing is due to you in English. Enjoy what you can get in English because English is the global language and deal with the rest like a person who can place countries on a map.

Frankly, seen with local eyes, you are a diva. I am not saying you are, but this is the image you let other perceve of you. Shame really.
I think you're getting the wrong end of the stick here. sflorida_sweetie2 is not complaining that there is no English language church in her village. She is complaining that she is being asked to pay for a service which she does not receive.

When I moved to my new flat in Glarus, I ticked 'none' in the religion box. That's because I knew that I wouldn't attend a church in the village. If I decide, at a later date, to join one of the local churches, then I shall go back to the town hall, tick the appropriate box and pay my tax.

This has nothing to do with perceived linguistic chauvinism.
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  #23  
Old 12.07.2011, 13:47
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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I haven't found any Theravada temples in Switzerland whatsoever.
If you are seriouy about Theravada buddhism, go there:


Buddhistisches Kloster Dhammapala - Am Waldrand - 3718 Kandersteg - Tel. 033/675 21 00 Fax. 033/675 22 41 Ven. Ajahn Tiradhammo.
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Old 12.07.2011, 13:47
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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However, if you have kids (I do) and want them to do church things, baptism, etc. (I don't), you will have a problem if you declare 'NONE'.
... or continue attending the church to which we do make contributions (which isn't in our village).
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Old 12.07.2011, 13:47
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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Perhaps it's because I come from the US, where the separation of church and state is 'sacred',
yes, sure.

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Old 12.07.2011, 13:50
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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... or continue attending the church to which we do make contributions (which isn't in our village).
Not sure if it works that way, though.

Have you asked?

Tom
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  #27  
Old 12.07.2011, 13:51
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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yes, sure.

ah yes, but which god?
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Old 12.07.2011, 13:53
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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Not sure if it works that way, though.

Have you asked?

Tom
Yes, as our church is not a state sponsored church, so even if we went to a local 'branch' of the church, we'd still be exempt from the tax.

Non-conformism has its benefits...
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Old 12.07.2011, 13:54
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

Be happy, you dont live in Graubünden then.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirchen..._%28Schweiz%29

"Die Steuer beträgt in reformierten Kirchen aus der Ausgleichssteuer von 3,5 % der einfachen Kantonssteuer. Zusätzlich kommt die Steuer der örtlichen Kirchengemeinde dazu, die je nach Gemeinde zwischen 8 % und 17 % betragen kann."

Add the tax of the local church, which depending on gemeinde can be an additional 8 to 17%

Doc.
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  #30  
Old 12.07.2011, 13:54
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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. She is complaining that she is being asked to pay for a service which she does not receive.
She DOES receive the religious service, the way it is NORMAL to get it here, in the local language. The language issue is on her side. Switzerland does not have to catter for people's lack of knowledge of national languages at all. They do in many aspects, just enjoy that and accept the fact that life is not English based here. It IS a language issue and the only responsible one is the one without knowledge of the national language of the place one lives in.
I don't mind desagreeing with you, but I am warning all English speakers about the way they are perceved by us. And don't shoot the messager, I am here writing in English.
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  #31  
Old 12.07.2011, 13:57
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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Be happy, you dont live in Graubünden then.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirchen..._%28Schweiz%29

"Die Steuer beträgt in reformierten Kirchen aus der Ausgleichssteuer von 3,5 % der einfachen Kantonssteuer. Zusätzlich kommt die Steuer der örtlichen Kirchengemeinde dazu, die je nach Gemeinde zwischen 8 % und 17 % betragen kann."Add the tax of the local church, which depending on gemeinde can be an additional 8 to 17%

Doc.
Yes, but of the base cantonal tax, NOT your net income!

Tom
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  #32  
Old 12.07.2011, 14:01
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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She DOES receive the religious service, the way it is NORMAL to get it here, in the local language. The language issue is on her side. Switzerland does not have to catter for people's lack of knowledge of national languages at all. They do in many aspects, just enjoy that and accept the fact that life is not English based here. It IS a language issue and the only responsible one is the one without knowledge of the national language of the place one lives in.
I don't mind desagreeing with you, but I am warning all English speakers about the way they are perceved by us. And don't shoot the messager, I am here writing in English.
Nah, sorry, but that's nonsense.

Walk around any Swiss city (or British city, or French city, or whatever) and you'll see that church services are provided for speakers of English, Tagalog, Portuguese, French, German, Swedish, Russian, Greek and so on.

People like to receive their spiritual food in a language they understand. I believe that some German fellow by the name of Luther had something to say on that matter, so it has absolutely nothing to do with Anglo-Saxon linguistic chauvinism. If you're English speaking, it is absolutely natural and understandable that you want to attend an English speaking church, rather than the local alternative in a language you might know well enough to go shopping, but not well enough to ruminate upon the meaning of the pastor's sermon.

If sflorida_sweetie2 wants to enjoy services in her own language, why should she be obliged by the local government to pay for services in another language which she doesn't attend, just because there happens to be a church nearby?

Not only is that silly, it is also unnecessary. All she has to do is register herself as 'none' at the town hall, go to a non-government-sponsored church of her choice, and pay for the services she receives, rather than those received by the congregation of a church she never attends.
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Old 12.07.2011, 14:13
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

She is NOT obliged, she can choose the NONE option. That argument is out.

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If you're English speaking, it is absolutely natural and understandable that you want to attend an English speaking church.
When you're Croatian, it is absulutely natural and understandable that you want to attend a Croation speaking church.
Now discuss that with Swiss people around you. Good luck.

I have no problem disagreeing with you. But I have a huge problem when a poster does not want to follow the tax law only based on a personal private opinion that the parliament doesn't give a sh!t about. Sorry do disappoint you, but the linguistic wellbeing of speakers of other languages than the national languages is of no interest to the Gesetzgeber. Call me insensitive monster, but the "understandable" human level you are talking about is irrelevant.

You widely underestimate how sensitive locals have become about the linguistic choices of the so called expats. They may not tell you that as you are one of them. I am too, but not English speaker, the community people in Basel are the most pissed off with, and in the gay community, one speaks more openly.

But if somebody wants to fight the church tax, go for it!! I will be schadenfroh about the outcome. Sorry again for being insensitive.
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  #34  
Old 12.07.2011, 14:16
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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I have no problem disagreeing with you. But I have a huge problem when a poster does not want to follow the tax law only based on a personal private opinion that the parliament doesn't give a sh!t about.
The fact that one can opt out of the tax suggests that it is, in fact, open to personal private opinion. Try opting out of any other taxes...
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  #35  
Old 12.07.2011, 14:16
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

When I registered I wrote down Catholic and the tax was 1% in Basel Stadt, now in Basel Land I am Konfessionlos
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Old 12.07.2011, 14:17
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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You widely underestimate how sensitive locals have become about the linguistic choices of the so called expats.
Are you seriously suggesting that Swiss people are angry because English speaking people attend their own churches, just like Portuguese speaking people, Greek speaking people and Russian speaking people?

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Old 12.07.2011, 14:20
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

No, I'm not. I am obviously not C1 in English as somebody suggested.
I'm out of here. Enjoy your churches.

EDIT: The OP wanted to be Theravada buddhist, I gave the answer
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Old 12.07.2011, 14:22
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Enjoy your churches.

We do. As long as we don't pay for someone else's churches.
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  #39  
Old 12.07.2011, 14:24
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

Faltrad, maybe you could clarify who you think "does not want to follow tax law" in this thread.

The tax law is that if you belong to one of the established churches/religions (whichever they are in your canton) you pay church tax. If you belong to any other group, you don't.

However, so far as I am aware NONE of these established churches have an English-speaking franchise. If you attend an English-speaking church, then it is a non-established church and you are not obliged to pay church tax for it.

This is the law. Who do you think is trying to get round it and how?
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Old 12.07.2011, 14:29
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Re: Faith-based Disincentive (religious tax)

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However, so far as I am aware NONE of these established churches have an English-speaking franchise. If you attend an English-speaking church, then it is a non-established church and you are not obliged to pay church tax for it.
There is an english speaking catholic churh in zurich: http://www.englishmission.ch/
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