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  #41  
Old 21.07.2011, 19:25
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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I did check, and I missed out because I never received the letters from the taxman questioning my tax return as they were sent to my old UK address where my ex-wife binned them. Because of this I didn't appeal in time and now there is nothing they can do etc etc...because of this I overpaid for 2 years and can't get anything back.
Strange, I overpaid for 4 years (was taxed at source when I should have filled a tax return), and when found out was able to sort the matter with the people of the tax office in Vaud.
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  #42  
Old 21.07.2011, 22:16
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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Not disapppeared, just waiting for something useful to be said, and it has. Thank you all.

For all those who say we should have checked the tax laws before we married - enjoy those romantic evenings you must share whilst filing in your tax returns

My wife and I though got married for love, not a tax return.

From this I can take 3 things to the tribunal:-
1. I'm not paying (which we already knew).
2. My wife was not resident in Geneve as of 31st December 2009
3. Although I worked in Geneve, I've never been resident in Geneve.

So like pelicans, they can stick their bill up their @rse!

cheers again everyone.
Well if you intend hanging around here I suggest you get yourself sorted out fairly quickly and perhaps in a slightly more eloquent tone. There are two groups of people that are fairly merciless when it comes to getting money from reluctant payers: the tax people and the social security people.

So, if you think you have been wronged, get some professional help to get it sorted. Failing that you will likely end up spending more and bearing a slightly more pained grin as they stick their bill up your @rse....
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  #43  
Old 21.07.2011, 22:28
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

Some friends of mine had a similar 'surprise' as they moved from one Canton to another. They refused to pay and took the tax people on. Two years later they had to sell their house and ended up living in a mobile home on a campsite. So do as Snoopy says - get professional advice quick and make absolutely sure you've got a case, or pay up and put it behind you asap. Bonne chance.
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  #44  
Old 21.07.2011, 22:36
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

We live just over the border in France. My partner works in Basel. Im not working. If our tax bill was CHF7000 id be delighted. Its over 10,000 euro!!! Im also starting a job soon where i will earn the same as him. I am DREADING our new tax bill.
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  #45  
Old 22.07.2011, 08:38
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

What about the other end of this...if you are a male getting married now where as a double earner your tax at the source will go down....do you get a refund on all the extra tax you paid throughout the year?
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  #46  
Old 22.07.2011, 09:16
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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What about the other end of this...if you are a male getting married now where as a double earner your tax at the source will go down....do you get a refund on all the extra tax you paid throughout the year?
no.
As I said a few times if you are "a la source" the tax rate is not based from 1st January but the month after...
(At least in VAUD).

Therefore in their view you've not paid anything extra.
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  #47  
Old 22.07.2011, 09:51
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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2. My wife was not resident in Geneve as of 31st December 2009
I think the answer hinges on where both of you were 'registered' on 31 Dec.2009, ie. was lease on apt. in GVA still valid and did she fail to de-register after the marriage. If so, I think the tax man is correct.

My very astute commune tried to register my spouse, in my apt., after marriage, but I quickly de-registered as we had already bought a house in another Commune. This was a GVA-Vaud thing as well, and had insurance, tax, and other consequences, so indeed de-register immediately after the event.
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  #48  
Old 22.07.2011, 14:12
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

I got a feeling this is going to run and run

My wife has the 'Formulaire d'announce de départ' dated 31st December 2009 as date of departure from canton Geneve. This we have confirmed with the tax office of Geneve.

So, the revised bill must be for me as they had me registered as living in a hotel in Geneve (for over 3.5 years?) when we inquired why we never received the original, only the reminder, to our Lausanne address.

I paid my taxes with my salary in Geneve and as stated, lived in Lausanne. I did all the necessary announce of arrival etc for Lausanne and have been here since October 2007. I'm now beginning to think the company I worked for registered me in canton Geneve when they brought me over from the UK and never deregistered me (and hence the tax bill)?

I never deregistered myself in Geneve because I never registered myself in Geneve. I was there for less than a month in a hotel before I moved to Lausanne. My work place at the time told me they had handled everything with regards to tax etc because they were paying my salary.

I approached a tax consultant in Nyon October 2009 to submit tax returns, after being told of the canton differences by a colleague. This tax expert took over a year to register me with Lausanne due to one mistake or another with the application (he never made it clear to me why) that he submitted on my behalf (and at cost). This delay consequently invalidated any claim I could have had for 2007 and 2008 as deadline for those submissions had passed.

We have since submitted tax returns to Lausanne for 2008 (with a letter and evidence stating the delay wasn't our fault etc), 2009 and 2010 (which they were chasing us for) which we completed online ourselfs (free) due to our complete lack of trust in consultants.

With the comments on this forum from those kind enough to offer something constructive, we are now expecting a huge tax bill from canton vaud for unpaid taxes for me/us for this entire period rather than any kind of refund we were expecting.

But regardless...

I stand by my original point and will not bend in the slightest on it. We were not married for the period they are trying to make us pay tax for. I've paid (and overpaid it would seem) my taxes and I will continue to pay anything I rightfully owe as I am, and always have been, an honest person.

I arrived in the country October 2007 and as far as I am aware, I wasn't back dated tax to January 2007 because I was not here (if I was, we have another issue). I was married November 2009 and I will not pay any back dated tax to January 2009 because I was not married.

One thing I am not is a passive citizen (just ask Silhouette) and I will not submit to unfair and unjust laws just because everyone else has/does. I have the power to act and I will. If that means fighting it (which thanks to everyones comments I now know to be a waste of both time and money) or just leaving the country (with a clean conscience), I will.



Anything you say I am when I am not, is not right regardless of what laws exist to back up your justification. Its black and white and I will not live in a society painted grey.
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  #49  
Old 22.07.2011, 14:16
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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Strange, I overpaid for 4 years (was taxed at source when I should have filled a tax return), and when found out was able to sort the matter with the people of the tax office in Vaud.
The problem was that I incorrectly put the management company I was working through as the people to contact in case of questions. The tax office sent the letters and they were received - but not by me, but I still had officially received the letters.

My wife is Swiss and she rang different people in the tax office and some tax specialists but we didn't have a case.
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  #50  
Old 22.07.2011, 14:44
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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I got a feeling this is going to run and run

My wife has the 'Formulaire d'announce de départ' dated 31st December 2009 as date of departure from canton Geneve. This we have confirmed with the tax office of Geneve.

So, the revised bill must be for me as they had me registered as living in a hotel in Geneve (for over 3.5 years?) when we inquired why we never received the original, only the reminder, to our Lausanne address.

I paid my taxes with my salary in Geneve and as stated, lived in Lausanne. I did all the necessary announce of arrival etc for Lausanne and have been here since October 2007. I'm now beginning to think the company I worked for registered me in canton Geneve when they brought me over from the UK and never deregistered me (and hence the tax bill)?

I never deregistered myself in Geneve because I never registered myself in Geneve. I was there for less than a month in a hotel before I moved to Lausanne. My work place at the time told me they had handled everything with regards to tax etc because they were paying my salary.

I approached a tax consultant in Nyon October 2009 to submit tax returns, after being told of the canton differences by a colleague. This tax expert took over a year to register me with Lausanne due to one mistake or another with the application (he never made it clear to me why) that he submitted on my behalf (and at cost). This delay consequently invalidated any claim I could have had for 2007 and 2008 as deadline for those submissions had passed.

We have since submitted tax returns to Lausanne for 2008 (with a letter and evidence stating the delay wasn't our fault etc), 2009 and 2010 (which they were chasing us for) which we completed online ourselfs (free) due to our complete lack of trust in consultants.

With the comments on this forum from those kind enough to offer something constructive, we are now expecting a huge tax bill from canton vaud for unpaid taxes for me/us for this entire period rather than any kind of refund we were expecting.

But regardless...

I stand by my original point and will not bend in the slightest on it. We were not married for the period they are trying to make us pay tax for. I've paid (and overpaid it would seem) my taxes and I will continue to pay anything I rightfully owe as I am, and always have been, an honest person.

I arrived in the country October 2007 and as far as I am aware, I wasn't back dated tax to January 2007 because I was not here (if I was, we have another issue). I was married November 2009 and I will not pay any back dated tax to January 2009 because I was not married.

One thing I am not is a passive citizen (just ask Silhouette) and I will not submit to unfair and unjust laws just because everyone else has/does. I have the power to act and I will. If that means fighting it (which thanks to everyones comments I now know to be a waste of both time and money) or just leaving the country (with a clean conscience), I will.



Anything you say I am when I am not, is not right regardless of what laws exist to back up your justification. Its black and white and I will not live in a society painted grey.
I would find out rather than "beginning to think" what registration if any your company provided on your behalf. Ok so you admit to breaking the law on not registering within 8-14 days of your arrival at the hotel in GE.
This is unless you had a permit to stay and work in Switzerland for 120 dys a year without registering.

You also admit to breaking the law in not de-regsitering when leaving the hotel in GE and registering in VD. Did you register in VD with your GE hotel address or your UK address? If the UK you have broken the law again for not declaring your temporary residence in GE whether registered in GE by you or the company or not.

You are responsible for your registration, not the company.

On some registration or other basis the GE tax authorities have a claim on your salary. You need to determine this from them. A lot of companies screw up paying local cantonal taxes at source when you are in fact registered in another. However it is up to you to manage this.

As you weren't registered in VD for a month, of course the company might have imposed tax at source based on GE laws/rates as you were residing in a hotel in GE when you started work.

So be prepared for a fine for your registration incompliance, even if you win at the tax tribunal.

More details here: http://www.justlanded.com/english/Sw...e-registration
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  #51  
Old 22.07.2011, 14:57
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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One thing I am not is a passive citizen (just ask Silhouette) and I will not submit to unfair and unjust laws just because everyone else has/does. I have the power to act and I will. If that means fighting it (which thanks to everyones comments I now know to be a waste of both time and money) or just leaving the country (with a clean conscience), I will.
I'm actually wondering how you've managed to live in Switzerland for nearly 4 years already.
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  #52  
Old 22.07.2011, 15:19
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

It's funny that, for someone who feels so strongly about something and who is willing to go the extra mile when current law is against your interpretation of it you didn't bother to investigate the tax implications of getting married. Anybody who has ever paid any taxes would know to look that up. Esp someone who has an accountant who could, without doubt, answer such questions in great detail. Maybe you should hit your accountant up for a refund. Let us know how that goes.
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  #53  
Old 22.07.2011, 15:37
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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I stand by my original point and will not bend in the slightest on it.
I wish you good luck, you will need it if you really do a runner. Just as I told you that you should have informed yourself about the consequences of marriage... I tell you now to thoroughly inform yourself what might happen if you dodge taxes here. Nobody honestly cares if you think the tax is just or not... show me a tax that actually IS fair. Maybe did running away from it work in the 1960s, but I seriously doubt that you would not run into any issue about that later in your life - I have a friend who is scared to go home to his parents for Christmas as he doesn't know if the cops will be waiting for him based on a tax bill... and even if Switzerland really would not find and legal way to charge you abroad - what if you make a good career back home and for whatever reason would need to come here on a business trip?

I believe that everyone should have the freedom to live his life to the own standards and that includes the freedom to do something I consider stupid - but at least don't be ignorant but know what the consequences of your decision would be.

If you feel so strongly about it, I fully support the option to go to court, but even there: Be aware what the costs are you might be facing in the end. Then make an informed decision.

Last edited by Treverus; 22.07.2011 at 16:02.
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  #54  
Old 22.07.2011, 15:39
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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Then make an informed decision.
I haven't seen much evidence of that yet....
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  #55  
Old 22.07.2011, 17:02
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

I was under the impression that marriage decreased the tax burden in CH, is this not so?

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As far as I’m concerned, this is just theft - pure and simple.

I got married on November 28th 2009 in Lausanne where I live. My wife and I worked at this time in Geneve.

We have just received a tax bill of over CHF7’000 from canton Geneve for the period January 1st to November 28th, recalculated using the married persons tax percentage they applied for the entire fiscal period of 2009.

Now I’m sorry, but there is no way on this earth I am paying this tax on the principle (and the fact) that we were not married during this recalculated period! This I have told them and they state that their decision stands and that I have to now go to a tribunal.

This is an unfair taxation on honest people designed for no other justifiable reason than to solely bleed more money from them. As far as I’m concerned, it must contravene an untold number of basic human rights, amongst them the right to decide when you marry (i.e. not based on a cantons tax period) and the right to live in peace and not in a place governed by thieves.

I’d rather go to jail on principle or be forced to leave the country I call home rather than pay this tax or watch them modify our tax codes to steal their unjust gains.
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  #56  
Old 22.07.2011, 17:16
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

I got sent a big tax bill for 2009 too and after 7 months of fighting, i got an apology letter saying i don't have to pay anything at all as i'm separated and taxed at source....Geneva taxation is just as crap as it can be, if you feel it's wrong, just fight back and keep insisting and sending them documents.

It took me 7 months, over 30 calls and 4 visits to convince them they did a mistake
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  #57  
Old 22.07.2011, 18:30
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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We live just over the border in France. My partner works in Basel. Im not working. If our tax bill was CHF7000 id be delighted. Its over 10,000 euro!!! Im also starting a job soon where i will earn the same as him. I am DREADING our new tax bill.

Note that this 7000 is the tax bill after they had been taxed at source . i.e they had already paid their taxes, this is the additional sum. If your husband lives in France, he is not taxed at source.
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  #58  
Old 01.11.2011, 13:56
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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Unless you live in Basel! If you moved from BS to BL, within the year, BS are now contesting the loss of income from tax. Basically, having to file twice for the same year, and meaning I have to pay a fair amount back.
Does any body have any experience of this? I am in Basel and considering moving out to Zurich before the end of the year. Will I anyway have to pay tax in Basel for the time that I have been in BS?

Thanks
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Old 02.11.2011, 23:47
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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I was under the impression that marriage decreased the tax burden in CH, is this not so?
no, not yet. parliament will be debating changes to the law approximately in summer 2012. but yes, the goal is to abolish the 'Heiratsstrafe' in future.
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  #60  
Old 02.11.2011, 23:51
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Re: WARNING: hit with a huge tax bill.

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I was under the impression that marriage decreased the tax burden in CH, is this not so?
It does if only one works.

Tom
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