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-   -   Fund management entity structures: Is this legal? (https://www.englishforum.ch/finance-banking-taxation/136496-fund-management-entity-structures-legal.html)

Reb77Br 19.01.2012 11:57

Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
Anyone know whether this is legal?


(1) The owner of a Swiss-based international financial advisory company is a partner in two Swiss fund management companies whose funds are promoted to clients of the financial advisory company.Financial advisory company promotes fund management company 1: here, here, here, here, etc.
Financial advisory company promotes fund management company 2: here, here, here, here, etc.

(2) Trust company mentioned here, here and here, trustee for a pension plan promoted to clients by the above financial advisory company and whose parent company was co-founded by the above financial advisory company (see previous links), shares a manager with the same financial advisory company.

swans1984 19.01.2012 15:26

Re: Is this legal?
 
The guy who owns all them also owns, Trafalgar in Switzerland and owns 2 Trustee companies in guernsey which Qrops are pushed through.
In South Africa he has been selling his own funds for years I.E the VAM fund.

Not legal but cant stop it as against his human rights. HE WON A CASE ON THAT.

NotAllThere 19.01.2012 15:57

Re: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by swans1984 (Post 1462921)
...Not legal but cant stop it as against his human rights. ....

So it is legal then.

Reb77Br 19.01.2012 15:59

Re: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by swans1984 (Post 1462921)
The guy who owns all them also owns, Trafalgar in Switzerland and owns 2 Trustee companies in guernsey which Qrops are pushed through.
In South Africa he has been selling his own funds for years I.E the VAM fund.

Not legal but cant stop it as against his human rights. HE WON A CASE ON THAT.

Do you know the names of the Guernsey trusts and where he won that case?

VAM apparently stands for Valais Asset Management. The Swiss-registered company is called Valais Investment Management, but its site says "This important information relates to Valais Asset Management SarL, and its products." Presumably the same company, then.

swans1984 19.01.2012 17:42

Re: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NotAllThere (Post 1462979)
So it is legal then.

Well he lost the first case in a normal court then appealed on Human Rights grounds.

So letter of law says ilegal but the it changed ruling due to human rights , was due to rite to work

swans1984 19.01.2012 17:51

Re: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Reb77Br (Post 1462989)
Do you know the names of the Guernsey trusts and where he won that case?

VAM apparently stands for Valais Asset Management. The Swiss-registered company is called Valais Investment Management, but its site says "This important information relates to Valais Asset Management SarL, and its products." Presumably the same company, then.


I will get back to you in next few days on this will find out the relivant information then advice it could have been Souverign one of them im sure

Verbier 19.01.2012 17:51

Re: Is this legal?
 
Valais Asset Management Srl and a second one with the same address.

Link: http://vs.powernet.ch/webservices/in...=&lang=4&sort=

Link: http://vs.powernet.ch/webservices/in...&lang=2&sort=0

Reb77Br 19.01.2012 18:13

Re: Is this legal?
 
Yes, these are the fund management companies linked in the original post. Interesting about the address, as there are other financial companies at that address, like this1, this2, this3, this4, this5, this6, this7 and this8 all involving people listed in the entry for the Valais company.

Verbier 19.01.2012 18:16

Re: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Reb77Br (Post 1463172)
Yes, these are the fund management companies linked in the original post.

Sorry. Did not click on all the links of the original post. Picked up the story lower down in the postings.

Reb77Br 20.01.2012 10:47

Re: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Reb77Br (Post 1463172)
Yes, these are the fund management companies linked in the original post. Interesting about the address, as there are other financial companies at that address, like this1, this2, this3, this4, this5, this6, this7 and this8 all involving people listed in the entry for the Valais company.

More companies at the same address and involving the same people (except possibly the owner of the financial advisory company, though companies registered in the likes of Mauritius, Seychelles, etc. are involved):
No 9
No 10

17clarence 20.01.2012 11:49

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
How on earth do you expect them to be able to fleece people without a complicated structure like this in the background?

There must be thousands of people in Switzerland getting taken to the cleaners.

As yet, no-one has come on here, not legit anyway, and actually said they have profited from any of these companies.
I think they think that they are
a) smarter than the rest of us and have a brilliant advisors
b) hoping it'll all come good in the end
c) realise they've been fleeced and won't fess up

If anyone has done well and actually got some cash/profit out of any of these dubious investment companies, please stand up and be counted and let us know.

EPMike 20.01.2012 14:14

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
A good friend of mine got into this scam of this "Advisory company" and signed up for a 25 year plan. Now he doesn't know how to get out with least amount of loss. I didn't know what to tell him either. Should he continue to make payments in the hope that at least he can get out his money by the funds producing enough to cover their excessive charges?

He has about 10K (EUR) in this "plan".

swans1984 20.01.2012 14:29

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EPMike (Post 1463952)
A good friend of mine got into this scam of this "Advisory company" and signed up for a 25 year plan. Now he doesn't know how to get out with least amount of loss. I didn't know what to tell him either. Should he continue to make payments in the hope that at least he can get out his money by the funds producing enough to cover their excessive charges?

He has about 10K (EUR) in this "plan".


Lets me guess the famous Generali Vision plan???

17clarence 20.01.2012 14:40

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by swans1984 (Post 1463974)
Lets me guess the famous Generali Vision plan???

Could be Skandia !

EPMike 20.01.2012 14:41

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by swans1984 (Post 1463974)
Lets me guess the famous Generali Vision plan???

I am not sure what it is called but LET'S not mention names otherwise the thread will get pulled.

17clarence 20.01.2012 14:58

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EPMike (Post 1463952)
A good friend of mine got into this scam of this "Advisory company" and signed up for a 25 year plan. Now he doesn't know how to get out with least amount of loss. I didn't know what to tell him either. Should he continue to make payments in the hope that at least he can get out his money by the funds producing enough to cover their excessive charges?

He has about 10K (EUR) in this "plan".

Eventually it will break even.
However the time it will take depends on the investment held in the 'magic wrapper'. If he gets lucky it will break even in under 8 years, as this seems to be the accepted time period it takes.

If he's unlucky, eg the funds take some hits, or he moves them around a bit incurring more charges, or much more likely the global resession creates a 10 year stagnant period, then it could take a whole while longer.

Lets not forget, the FTSE100 is (I believe) at a lower point now than it was in the year 1998.

All he can do is read the small print of the policy to see what the exit charges are and get the calculator out.
Shame he didn't do this before though.

swans1984 20.01.2012 15:08

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 17clarence (Post 1463994)
Could be Skandia !

Wont be them as they dont do regular savings plans.
Generali are the only real bad ones

NotAllThere 21.01.2012 08:37

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by swans1984 (Post 1463137)
Well he lost the first case in a normal court then appealed on Human Rights grounds.

So letter of law says ilegal but the it changed ruling due to human rights , was due to rite to work

So. A lower court ruled against. A higher court ruled in favour, because the lower court hadn't considered an important point: human rights. So the law is: it is legal. It cannot be the "letter of the law says illegal". In order for the verdict to be overturned by a higher court, the initial law must have had ambiguity.

It's also important to differentiate between something not being legal, and something actively being criminal. For example, the Home Secretary in the UK has occasional issued some decree which turns out not to be lawful. That doesn't make him a criminal (under law, at least!)

The reason why this is important, is that declaring someone broke the law, or they've done something criminal, when they haven't, is libel. Which is something you really don't want to commit.

But it is good that Reb77Br raised this important information, which may well have an effect on someone wishing to invest with his man's business. He may well be perfectly capable of acting with complete propriety even in the face of the apparent conflict of interest, but I wouldn't risk it. Reb77Br has shown that a little bit of investigation into perfectly public information can reveal some very interesting facts.

Reb77Br 23.01.2012 10:12

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NotAllThere (Post 1464678)
So. A lower court ruled against. A higher court ruled in favour, because the lower court hadn't considered an important point: human rights.

Until we know which courts were involved, if any, it's impossible to check whether this actually happened. For example, a search for the company name or owner's surname in Swiss/European Court of Human Rights case law(here) or European Court of Justice case law (here) does not produce relevant results.

Reb77Br 24.01.2012 15:09

Re: Fund management entity structures: Is this legal?
 
"I am pleased to announce that following such demand, we are now able to offer a QROPS based in Guernsey from [this company with which we share a manager] that is written with an offshore investment bond provided by [this company we helped to set up] that caters for small transfer values. It offers a very simple investment structure and low charges. Please contact your Consultant and ask for the Personal Pension Plan."
Source: Ask Nigel


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