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-   -   Credit suisse & PostFinance - W9 form and waiver forms (https://www.englishforum.ch/finance-banking-taxation/189183-credit-suisse-postfinance-w9-form-waiver-forms.html)

dathrilla 04.10.2013 15:10

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 1989237)
No, the US government/IRS does if any or all accounts reach the $10,000 aggregate figure. And that applies even if you don't need to file a tax return.

I've just renounced earlier this year and have no income to file. However, the joint accounts I share with my OH required back filing of FBAR's and I will need to file a partial FBAR next year, along with my 8854 form. I managed to renounce just before UBS sent me the W-9 form.

The point is, whether you need to file any tax forms of any kind for the IRS/US government or not, to get/keep a bank account here as a US citizen you either have to sign a W-9 or renounce. It's that simple. Utterly stupid, crazy, mad, but that's the choice. Nothing else is possible if you want a Swiss bank account.

Thank you for your reply. Excuse me if I sound a bit confused, but I would presume the primary function of the W-9 form is intrinsically related to the IRS and the US Government for FISCAL reasons, correct??

Essentially, they want to verify if you're not BSing on your tax forms!

Medea Fleecestealer 04.10.2013 15:54

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dathrilla (Post 1989242)
Thank you for your reply. Excuse me if I sound a bit confused, but I would presume the primary function of the W-9 form is intrinsically related to the IRS and the US Government for FISCAL reasons, correct??

Essentially, they want to verify if you're not BSing on your tax forms!

Yes. That's what FATCA is all about. The requirement to sign a W-9 makes sure the banks meet their obligations to provide the necessary info for the IRS to track down all US tax cheats. Which seems to mean anyone who doesn't live/work within US borders.

Guest 04.10.2013 16:11

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
This is funny because my Swiss passport has my birthplace in Fischenthal. I have NEVER been asked about any W9 or anything to do with the US when banking. However, I have to "volunteer" the information which makes one feel like they are "admitting to a crime they haven't committed!" :eek: I haven't renounced yet. I'm waiting until certain people in my care are older. However, from what I have read, the amount of people renouncing their US citizenship is quickly climbing. I never use my US passport anyways except when I travel to the US. It would be an honor to burn it in the fire! :p

st2lemans 04.10.2013 16:49

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

This is funny because my Swiss passport has my birthplace in Fischenthal.
Umm, Swiss passports don not show your birthplace, but rather your heimatort/attinenza/lieu d'origine, which is usually NOT the same as your birthplace.

Tom

Guest 04.10.2013 17:32

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by st2lemans (Post 1989323)
Umm, Swiss passports don not show your birthplace, but rather your heimatort/attinenza/lieu d'origine, which is usually NOT the same as your birthplace.

Tom

I translated it as "birthplace." Which is Geburtsort, my error. Mine has the same heimatort/lieu d'origine/luogo di attinenza/lieu d'origin/place of origin. Do you want me to send my passport number as well?...LOL

Olstand 04.10.2013 18:30

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

It would be an honor to burn it in the fire!
Omg, you can't imagine how many times I've dreamed about doing this ever since I found out about FACTA! Surely, there must be something wrong with a country if its citizens want to set their passports on fire.

Incidentally, why haven't there been any mass protests here in Switzerland? I would have thought there would be enough incensed "US-Persons" to warrant it.

Medea Fleecestealer 04.10.2013 18:52

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
They have been, by renouncing/relinquishing their citizenship by the hundreds. Can't make a more definite protest than that.

Olstand 04.10.2013 19:36

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Well, I meant a more vocal or physical protest that would garner some really negative publicity for the US and more awareness in Switzerland of what is happening in their own country. Most Swiss people I've spoken to have vaguely heard about what's going on but haven't really paid much attention.

To be honest, if I hadn't been affected by this, I would never have known about it. And I certainly wouldn't have heard about people relinquishing their citizenship, as it is such a 'quiet' act.

Guest 04.10.2013 19:50

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Olstand (Post 1989421)
Omg, you can't imagine how many times I've dreamed about doing this ever since I found out about FACTA! Surely, there must be something wrong with a country if its citizens want to set their passports on fire.

Incidentally, why haven't there been any mass protests here in Switzerland? I would have thought there would be enough incensed "US-Persons" to warrant it.

The US passport is a pain in the A$$...Unfortunately, the real work for change has to be on the US end. I would advise anyone who does not have any ties that would prevent them from renouncing right now and they have a second passport, doesn't have to be a Swiss passport, and they are fed-up with US foolishness to renounce as soon as possible. It's going to get worse. However, I understand when people have certain responsibilities, as myself, and doing so is not possible right now. I think it would be wrong to renounce and leave minors without any type of legal representation of one of their citizenship's. We are all duel except one. When they are old enough they can make up their own mind. I checked with the US and this is what they said concerning minors and renunciation:

RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDREN/INCOMPETENTS Citizenship is a status that is personal to the U.S. citizen. Therefore, parents may not renounce the citizenship of their minor children. Similarly, parents/legal guardians may not renounce the citizenship of individuals who are mentally incompetent. Minors seeking to renounce their U.S. citizenship must demonstrate to a consular officer that they are acting voluntarily and that they fully understand the implications/consequences attendant to the renunciation of U.S. citizenship.



I don't think an 8, 10, or 13 year old understands the "full" implications of renouncing their citizenship, well most don't. When they are older they can weigh the pros and cons for themselves. Here is an article about US citizens showing the "blue book" the door.

Lammhaxe 04.10.2013 20:04

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dathrilla (Post 1988481)
Hi,

As an American student (Dual national) in CH, I have a student account with CS and have never worked in CH. They asked me to fill out the forms and send it ;otherwise, my account will be closed.

What does Congress want from a broke student that has 50 CHF in his account??

Unbelievable.

Your lucky you're getting an account opened.
Implementing FATCA is actually forcing the swiss banks to shut small accounts starting the million, and only work with the really rich

Medea Fleecestealer 04.10.2013 20:16

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Olstand, There are efforts to get the bill repealed. Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky has been doing his best to stop this monster and there is also a petition site here:

http://www.republicansabroadeurope.org/fatca_petition

ProsperityJoy, there is also a strong argument that your children may not be American unless they claim that right:

http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2013/06/...ecision-as-an/

This blog came about because one of the IBS members has a mentally challenged son. She cannot renounce on his behalf, but you can also very strongly argue that there's no way he can claim his American birthright because he has no understanding of the concept of citizenship.

There is also this:

http://travel.state.gov/law/citizens...ship_5199.html

Guest 04.10.2013 21:10

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 1989470)
Olstand, There are efforts to get the bill repealed. Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky has been doing his best to stop this monster and there is also a petition site here:

http://www.republicansabroadeurope.org/fatca_petition

ProsperityJoy, there is also a strong argument that your children may not be American unless they claim that right:

http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2013/06/...ecision-as-an/

This blog came about because one of the IBS members has a mentally challenged son. She cannot renounce on his behalf, but you can also very strongly argue that there's no way he can claim his American birthright because he has no understanding of the concept of citizenship.

There is also this:

http://travel.state.gov/law/citizens...ship_5199.html

Thanks for the info! Unfortunately, US passports have already been issued. I am concerned about later on though about how FATCA will impact the future of young duel citizenship children with US passports. However, I would still feel wrong "renouncing on a child's behalf" because it is such a personal decision. Maybe they want to live in the US later on. :confused: It's a Catch-22 situation for sure. Hopefully things will change within the next few years.

Medea Fleecestealer 04.10.2013 21:23

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Thanks for the info! Unfortunately, US passports have already been issued. I am concerned about later on though about how FATCA will impact the future of young duel citizenship children with US passports. However, I would still feel wrong "renouncing on a child's behalf" because it is such a personal decision. Maybe they want to live in the US later on. :confused: It's a Catch-22 situation for sure. Hopefully things will change within the next few years.
I quite agree, hard though it may be. It is a personal decision and one that they should have the chance to make for themselves. We don't know what the future holds nor what plans they may make. However, for those who have children unable to decide for themselves I think it's very unfair that parents can't make such a decision for them, especially when they're American only by accident.

Guest 04.10.2013 21:38

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 1989513)
I quite agree, hard though it may be. It is a personal decision and one that they should have the chance to make for themselves. We don't know what the future holds nor what plans they may make. However, for those who have children unable to decide for themselves I think it's very unfair that parents can't make such a decision for them, especially when they're American only by accident.

I agree... if a child or an adult dependent on a person is mentally incapable, due to a mental illness for example, of making decisions on their own concerning their life, the person caring for them, or their guardian, should be able to do so, even for renouncing their citizenship.

st2lemans 04.10.2013 21:52

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 1989470)
This blog came about because one of the IBS members has a mentally challenged son. She cannot renounce on his behalf, but you can also very strongly argue that there's no way he can claim his American birthright because he has no understanding of the concept of citizenship.

Yes, a totally screwed up situation, read this some time ago.

As legal guardians, the US wants them to adhere to US laws, yet they can't dump the kids citizenship despite it being in his best interest! :msnmad:

I held mine until my youngest was 16, just in case (after 16, she could do her own passport renewals), but used my last passport (acquired before becoming Swiss) only twice in ten years, and was rather pissed about the idea of having to get a new one just in case I ever decided to go to the US.

So I dumped it (free of charge).

Tom

Sliced 04.10.2013 22:06

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
I'm a duel citizen and lived here for 16 years, have delt with the same Bank the whole time. I got a letter from the Pensionkasse that I now have to put the money in my own Retirement Account with a Bank here. I went to my Bank last month and they said ok they will open a Retirement account, but nothing happened this week I went it and they said it's a problem as I'm a duel citizen and today I got a call where they are refusing to allow me any new account now. Asked what I should do now and they had no idea as other Banks are also refusing any new U.S. conection... I got an extension from the Pensionkasse as it was suppose to be done by the end of Sept. Now I'm at a loss as I sure don't want the money in a personal account, but want to keep it as retirement. Am at a loss...

Guest 04.10.2013 22:22

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by st2lemans (Post 1989529)
Yes, a totally screwed up situation, read this some time ago.

As legal guardians, the US wants them to adhere to US laws, yet they can't dump the kids citizenship despite it being in his best interest! :msnmad:

I held mine until my youngest was 16, just in case (after 16, she could do her own passport renewals), but used my last passport (acquired before becoming Swiss) only twice in ten years, and was rather pissed about the idea of having to get a new one just in case I ever decided to go to the US.

So I dumped it (free of charge).

Tom

Is 16 the age when a person can renounce their US citizenship? If a child can renew their own passport I don't see any problem with the parent renouncing their citizenship. There is hope yet!...LOL

st2lemans 04.10.2013 22:28

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Is 16 the age when a person can renounce their US citizenship?
18, as far as I know, but 16 to get a passport.

Tom

st2lemans 04.10.2013 22:30

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sliced (Post 1989538)
they said it's a problem as I'm a duel citizen and today I got a call where they are refusing to allow me any new account now

My daughter had that problem when she went to rent an apartment, bank resolved it by telling her to use her existing account rather than create a new one. :confused:

Tom

dathrilla 05.10.2013 14:54

Re: Credit suisse - W9 form and waiver forms
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lammhaxe (Post 1989465)
Your lucky you're getting an account opened.
Implementing FATCA is actually forcing the swiss banks to shut small accounts starting the million, and only work with the really rich


I had this account since I started uni in 2007. Yes, I am sure you are right. Also, it is interesting to note that the letter was sent by CS's Private Banking division :confused: ...


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