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Old 06.11.2013, 09:12
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"Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

Hi,
we are Polish citizens considering leaving Switzerland. The problem is our pension fund. We have collected there significant amount of money and according to the bilateral Polish-Swiss agreement we are not allowed to get this money back in cash while leaving Switzerland. They will be automatically moved to Polish pension fund what means they get lost as this mechanism is a huge black hole in my homeland. I’m considering a following scenario:
few months before leaving Switzerland we could buy a property here and use the money from the pension found for this. After leaving the country we could keep the property and rent it or sell it.
But to be honest I don’t think this will be as easy as I described above. As far as I know this country there are many regulations which I don’t know. I will for sure need to contact financial advisor but first I would like to know your opinion if it’s feasible. Is it possible to rent your Swiss property if you leave outside of Switzerland? Can you rent or sell it immediately after leaving the country or do you need to wait 5 years?
Regards
Adam
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Old 06.11.2013, 09:19
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

As far as I am aware, you cannot use your pillar 2 for an investment property.
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Old 06.11.2013, 09:22
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

Indeed, it can only be used for your primary residence.

If you leave, you have to pay back the pension fund in its entirety.

Tom
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Old 06.11.2013, 09:23
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

The Pliar 2 can stay in CH, no requirement to take it anywhere .
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Old 06.11.2013, 13:02
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

Also, you can not rent your property if you have B permis, you can only use it for primary residence...
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Old 06.11.2013, 14:04
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

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Also, you can not rent your property if you have B permis, you can only use it for primary residence...
Once the OP leaves ch they don't have a permit at all
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Old 06.11.2013, 15:34
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

You could look at morning the Swiss pension to a European pension.

You would still not be able to purchase a residential property but you would have greater control over your funds.
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Old 06.11.2013, 16:05
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

That's a very sad indictment of Poland... I thought it was a 'modern European country'
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Old 06.11.2013, 16:12
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

This is a private pillar 2 pension fund, right?

Are you sure you need to transfer it into a Polish fund?

Anyway it's clear property in Switzerland is not an option. Keep it in Switzerland and release for home ownership in Poland may be an option.....
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Old 06.11.2013, 16:35
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

The problem in Poland is, that, according to the Highest Court, our 1st and 2nd pillar savings are...not really ours. Only the 3rd one is. So if he leaves CH, even if there is a possibility to move CH 2nd pillar money to PL 2nd (instead of 1st) Pillar, he still loses control over his savings.

Therefore I would suggest to leave the money here in CH.
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Old 06.11.2013, 16:59
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

It looks to me that more and more 'modern European countries' are working like this
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Old 06.11.2013, 17:12
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

The other way to get money out of the pension fund is to start a company. There's a hint for you to investigate.

I can't remember which part of which pension you can take out for that. But they will let you access pension money to start a company.
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Old 06.11.2013, 17:14
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

Under these circumstances it is very important that you seek advice from a finance professional as the losses could be huge otherwise.
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Old 06.11.2013, 17:36
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

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Under these circumstances it is very important that you seek advice from a finance professional as the losses could be huge otherwise.
I hear it over and over again: "Du musst sich beraten lassen"
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Old 06.11.2013, 18:18
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

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The other way to get money out of the pension fund is to start a company. There's a hint for you to investigate.

I can't remember which part of which pension you can take out for that. But they will let you access pension money to start a company.
You have to become 100% self employed! provide a valid reason for needing the cash & do it within the first year of trading. It can't be taken at a later date.

However left in a Swiss pension could be used to buy a main residence in Poland, there maybe tax consequences in Poland.
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Old 06.11.2013, 19:13
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

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You have to become 100% self employed! provide a valid reason for needing the cash & do it within the first year of trading. It can't be taken at a later date.

However left in a Swiss pension could be used to buy a main residence in Poland, there maybe tax consequences in Poland.
Apparently an independent or "societe en nom collectif".

As difficult at that will be, it's probably more feasible option the buy real estate.

If leaving it in CH is an option, that's the one I'd take.
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Old 06.11.2013, 20:53
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

I was under the impression that the money can be used to buy a home in the EU? How about buying one in Poland?
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Old 06.11.2013, 21:10
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Re: "Buy to Let" inverstment before leaving Switzerland

You can use the 2nd pillar to buy your main residence property also outside Switzerland (within EU countries). It's clearly stated here on the BSV site.

"Die Finanzierung einer Zweitwohnung ist ausgeschlossen. Möglich ist Wohneigentum in der Schweiz oder im Ausland (beispielsweise bei einem Grenzgänger), es muss sich jedoch immer um den Hauptwohnsitz handeln (die Freizügigkeitsabkommen zwischen der Schweiz und der Europäischen Union schliessen den Erwerb von Wohneigentum mit Mitteln der 2. Säule nicht aus, vgl. Mitteilungen über die berufliche Vorsorge Nr. 96 S. 2)."

I would encourage to start asking and seeking for information on procedure and requirements.

Edit: the text even says you can have it in cash to BUY main property (FF 1999 5440, ch. 273.233.3 is clear)
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