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-   -   Person to person loans (https://www.englishforum.ch/finance-banking-taxation/261751-person-person-loans.html)

josquius 29.10.2016 13:26

Person to person loans
 
Not something I am actually planning on doing any time soon but I've come to wonder about the issue of person to person loans.
Does anyone know, in Switzerland is there a system in place for doing this?
i.e. if I want to loan my friend 2,000 chf for a month or two (no interest), some document we could sign so it's all official? - I'd trust the person not to run away with my money but given the large amounts involved it would probably be best to keep it all recorded just in case they turn out to be the sort of evil person who would sacrifice friendship over a modest sum or they get hit by a truck

Or am I completely imagining that this sort of thing would exist in any country?

JagWaugh 29.10.2016 13:34

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by josquius (Post 2681427)
Not something I am actually planning on doing any time soon but I've come to wonder about the issue of person to person loans.
Does anyone know, in Switzerland is there a system in place for doing this?
i.e. if I want to loan my friend 2,000 chf for a month or two (no interest), some document we could sign so it's all official? - I'd trust the person not to run away with my money but given the large amounts involved it would probably be best to keep it all recorded just in case they turn out to be the sort of evil person who would sacrifice friendship over a modest sum or they get hit by a truck

Or am I completely imagining that this sort of thing would exist in any country?

Write a contract. For German, google "vertrag für persönliche darlehn" I'm not sure what you would call it in French.

Urs Max 29.10.2016 17:47

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by josquius (Post 2681427)
Not something I am actually planning on doing any time soon but I've come to wonder about the issue of person to person loans.
Does anyone know, in Switzerland is there a system in place for doing this?
i.e. if I want to loan my friend 2,000 chf for a month or two (no interest), some document we could sign so it's all official? - I'd trust the person not to run away with my money but given the large amounts involved it would probably be best to keep it all recorded just in case they turn out to be the sort of evil person who would sacrifice friendship over a modest sum or they get hit by a truck

Or am I completely imagining that this sort of thing would exist in any country?

There's nothing official about a personal loan, but having a contract is clearly a good idea. See for instance this template.

With that said, in my experience personal loans have a high probability of turning at least partially sour so if you're not willing to write it off you need to be ready to sue. In the latter case, if the debtor lacks the means you not only have to write off the original loan but also the cost sue'ing brings.

Medea Fleecestealer 29.10.2016 18:09

Re: Person to person loans
 
Would be a good idea to have the document signed by both parties in front of a public notary who can also sign the document. Would make it more official and probably give you better grounds for taking the other party to court if they do default on the repayment.

fatmanfilms 29.10.2016 18:12

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 2681586)
Would be a good idea to have the document signed by both parties in front of a public notary who can also sign the document. Would make it more official and probably give you better grounds for taking the other party to court if they do default on the repayment.

It's really not going to make any difference, a contract is a contract.
I doubt a notary would sign the contract as he is not a party to it.

ivank 29.10.2016 18:15

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 2681586)
Would be a good idea to have the document signed by both parties in front of a public notary who can also sign the document. Would make it more official and probably give you better grounds for taking the other party to court if they do default on the repayment.

That will only add to the costs but won't really matter. At best, the notary would check your IDs and certify that you're dealing with who you think you're dealing with. But if you're willing to give the loan, you know that already, right? For the court you merely need to provide proofs of the debt, that's all. So make a written contract, pay by bank transfer, keep receipts. Especially bank transfer would be a strong argument in the court.

JagWaugh 29.10.2016 18:22

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fatmanfilms (Post 2681588)
It's really not going to make any difference, a contract is a contract.
I doubt a notary would sign the contract as he is not a party to it.

I think that the notary will sign it to attest that it was signed by both parties.

The contract is only really of use in three ways:

1) It sets down in text the amount lent, and the terms of repayment (eliminating misunderstandings afterward).

2) It documents the loan formally, so that in the event of one party passing on the other has something in hand when dealing with whoever is handling the estate.

3) If the other party decides to default a contract will probably make filling out a Betreibung easier.

If the other party decides to skip town and leave Switzerland the contract probably won't help much in recovering the full amount, but it certainly wouldn't hurt.

Guest 29.10.2016 18:26

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 2681586)
Would be a good idea to have the document signed by both parties in front of a public notary who can also sign the document. Would make it more official and probably give you better grounds for taking the other party to court if they do default on the repayment.


.....for Chf 2k ?????

If the guy isn't going to pay back, then no amount of contracts will resolve this, only a lengthy judicial process which will cost more than Chf 2k may getr the $$ back.

Either you are comfortable with it and go ahead or you are not and don't go ahead in situations like this.

Slaphead 29.10.2016 19:02

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

.....for Chf 2k ?????

If the guy isn't going to pay back, then no amount of contracts will resolve this, only a lengthy judicial process which will cost more than Chf 2k may getr the $$ back.

Either you are comfortable with it and go ahead or you are not and don't go ahead in situations like this.
I tend to agree. Never lend an amount that you can't afford to write off.

Ask yourself this - if the guy runs off with the 2k and you never see him again, was it worth the 2k to ensure you never see him again?

NotAllThere 29.10.2016 20:20

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fatmanfilms (Post 2681588)
It's really not going to make any difference, a contract is a contract.
I doubt a notary would sign the contract as he is not a party to it.

A notary signed our house purchase contract. He's an official witness to the contract.

fatmanfilms 29.10.2016 20:24

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NotAllThere (Post 2681684)
A notary signed our house purchase contractor. He's an official witness to the contract.

Thats because he has to in CH......... as you can't buy / sell property without the services of a notary, he has to confirm that everybody understands what they are signing.

In the UK there is no requirement to use a solicitor for house purchase, the land registry was set up over a 100 years ago to make it easy :D

Guest 29.10.2016 20:40

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NotAllThere (Post 2681684)
A notary signed our house purchase contractor. He's an official witness to the contract.

Whee do you buy houses for Chf 2k in Switzerland ?

I'll take 50 please.

NotAllThere 29.10.2016 21:00

Re: Person to person loans
 
FMF said that a notary wouldn't sign a contract as he wouldn't be party to. This, in my opinion, isn't correct. My example shows that being party to the contract isn't an issue. In my case or that mooted in this thread, the notary would sign as an official witness.

Of course, he may well charge you >2K for the privilege! :D

josquius 30.10.2016 11:36

Re: Person to person loans
 
So if I'm getting this right such things exist but practically only for BIG money agreements?

fatmanfilms 30.10.2016 11:45

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by josquius (Post 2681949)
So if I'm getting this right such things exist but practically only for BIG money agreements?

Only for the transfer of land or buildings, where its a legal requirement in CH to do so.

JagWaugh 30.10.2016 12:11

Re: Person to person loans
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fatmanfilms (Post 2681953)
Only for the transfer of land or buildings, where its a legal requirement in CH to do so.

Notariat don't just do real estate or expensive stuff. Some of the stuff you submit of marriage or aufenthalt permits needs to be notarized.

I would guess a signature would be something in the order of 200 CHF, possibly less.


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