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  #121  
Old 29.03.2018, 09:29
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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Looking to buy bitcoins (or litecoins).
Anyone here interested in selling can contact me via PM.
Sure. I have both.

CHF 20,000 per Bitcoin. Only CHF 800 per Litecoin. Hurry, at these give-away prices they won't last long!
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  #122  
Old 29.03.2018, 09:37
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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Well BTC (bitcoin) is not doing so great, and yes, if you take the "percent" fall since a few months then there was the possibility to lose quite a lot of the initial investment.

Going backward in time there was also a massive increase in % for the lucky/brave/visionary ones who invested early.

The problem with actual BTC (bitcoin) are that it's already limited due to the high transaction fee, the relative network slowness, the fact that in practice there is some centralisation and that mining is mostly done by farms in cheaper countries.

Numerous other crypto are improving on that, such as the LTC (cheaper and faster transaction fees).

As example, if one bought LTC when it was 130USD a few days ago (when it was all red, showing a big loss in value), it raised back to 170USD within 24h. A very sweet +25% increase for the lucky ones!

Seems that getting the timing right is the key.

From my observation, somehow it does appear that the mathematical/financial things about bull/bear and whatever animals are actually indicating a trend and provide some level of accuracy/truth which can be use to make a decision... Seems that simply observing the increase/decrease is not sufficient!

(professionals must laugh at my beginner's post, they are already enjoying some of my money )
The problem is that those technical analyses indicate a downward trend for quite while.
It looks a hell lot like a slow bleed-out. I believe right now only a mass adoption due to technical improvements (scaling, speed, transaction costs, energy use) will be able to bring back those December price levels. Until then I am HODLing

Last edited by EPMike; 29.03.2018 at 10:41.
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  #123  
Old 29.03.2018, 09:56
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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Well BTC (bitcoin) is not doing so great, and yes, if you take the "percent" fall since a few months then there was the possibility to lose quite a lot of the initial investment.

Going backward in time there was also a massive increase in % for the lucky/brave/visionary ones who invested early.

The problem with actual BTC (bitcoin) are that it's already limited due to the high transaction fee, the relative network slowness, the fact that in practice there is some centralisation and that mining is mostly done by farms in cheaper countries.

Numerous other crypto are improving on that, such as the LTC (cheaper and faster transaction fees).

As example, if one bought LTC when it was 130USD a few days ago (when it was all red, showing a big loss in value), it raised back to 170USD within 24h. A very sweet +25% increase for the lucky ones!

Seems that getting the timing right is the key.

From my observation, somehow it does appear that the mathematical/financial things about bull/bear and whatever animals are actually indicating a trend and provide some level of accuracy/truth which can be use to make a decision... Seems that simply observing the increase/decrease is not sufficient!

(professionals must laugh at my beginner's post, they are already enjoying some of my money )
I'd suggest there are no professionals at crypto-currencies, which is why no bank has crypto dealing desk or any crypto products.

There is no model, unless you use (probably) "tulip mania".
The difference is with BTC you get nothing, not even the tulip

Idiots jumped in relying on the bigger fool theory. Now there is no bigger fool, and they are stuck with it.

And their greed/get-rich-quick mentality failed to use limit orders to cash in at a 10 or 20 or 30% rise.
Instead they hung on.

Personally, I started before the big BTC rise with 500 EUR I was prepared to lose.
I missed the irrational huge rise (a limit order, shot right through it) but I took 1500 out (cash) and am still in for around 300 with some transferred into ICOs.
My current limit orders may not be hit any time soon, but I'm happy if not a millionaire.
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  #124  
Old 29.03.2018, 10:08
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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I'd suggest there are no professionals at crypto-currencies, which is why no bank has crypto dealing desk or any crypto products.

There is no model, unless you use (probably) "tulip mania".
The difference is with BTC you get nothing, not even the tulip

Idiots jumped in relying on the bigger fool theory. Now there is no bigger fool, and they are stuck with it.

And their greed/get-rich-quick mentality failed to use limit orders to cash in at a 10 or 20 or 30% rise.
Instead they hung on.

Personally, I started before the big BTC rise with 500 EUR I was prepared to lose.
I missed the irrational huge rise (a limit order, shot right through it) but I took 1500 out (cash) and am still in for around 300 with some transferred into ICOs.
My current limit orders may not be hit any time soon, but I'm happy if not a millionaire.
idiots might be little harsh, greedy fits better. Indeed most people FOMOd in quite late in fear to miss a great opportunity. I am personally in crypto with about a month' income for the sole reason that I don't want to be sorry in a decade that I missed a big chance.

Often people say don't gamble (any crypto is still a gamble) with money you are not willing to lose. I would rephrase that a little: Am I willing to lose a month' income? No! But can I afford to lose it? Yes.

So I would say: don't gamble what you can not afford to lose. That is without ANY effect on your way of life or your overall savings plan.

IMHO if losing 1 month' wage would have a serious impact on your life, then you've got anyway a problem with your finances.
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  #125  
Old 29.03.2018, 10:29
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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Why can't you buy them on a trading platform?
No reason, because I can!
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  #126  
Old 29.03.2018, 10:39
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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The problem is that those technical analyses indicate a downward trend for quite while.
It looks a hell lot like a slow bleed-out. I believe right now only a mass adoption due to technical improvements (scaling, speed, transaction costs, energy use) will be able to bring back those December price levels. Until then I am a siting duck.
"sitting duck" LOL That has a meaning different to what you intended.
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  #127  
Old 05.04.2018, 16:00
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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Idiots jumped in relying on the bigger fool theory. Now there is no bigger fool, and they are stuck with it..
While I agree about these idiots, I am also an idiot (a brave one!) for other reasons. It's not only about greed of scamming others, it's also part of doing something for a great new technology (dare I say revolutionnary?) which is supposed to (or bringing) many advantages to the masses.

I'm also stuck with my crypto (I'm learning the hard way ). Since I invested all I could afford (which equals or "used to equal to" a few thousands euros), I am now in a witness situation. I believe the term is "bull trapped", since I bought when I though it would recover but it did not.

Nonetheless, it's not only about idiots and fools, there is also variables like government crack downs, hacking... and the high volatility.

Looking at the bigger picture than current apparently negative outcome (LTC jumped from +20% in a few hours!! before to drop again...), I actually believe there is a future. For some.

Now clearly, we are only talking about the serious crypto and the crack downs are a required pain. Not to protect the fools or ignorants or optimists, but to act against the professional (or semi pro) who were actually implementing a crypto solely to scam people. It's actually not even technically challenging and rather easy to make your own "ICO" (Initial Coin Offering).

These are the bad seeds which contributed to a negative reputation for cryptos and numerous serious projects.

After a few crypto and the riddance of a few crypto currencies, the stronger should attract the capital of others and regain value.

I keep reading news and I understand most of these technologies and the few popular are here to stay. I know it does not equals or adequate to "higher market value", I still suspect once the weed would have been cleared, the good plants will grow better.

Looking at adoption of LTC, XRP, etc... they keep getting bigger and bigger and more recognised in the market. Think of the real advantages of these virtual assets once they will be less volatile and more implemented in real life! That's when their value should raise.

Unfortunately, some of the project leaders like for LTC are idiots who communicate badly and seems to keep doing mistakes (while they have pocketed millions in the process). That does not help.

While I read numerous fantasy news about 2018 prices predictions, I do believe the most popular crypto will get better in a few months. As for the others, some are already getting +60% in 24h sometimes. Will they last? Depends, some projects are good, a lot of them aren't.

For me holding is the only option I have. I somehow have lost already and rather lose all than regretting later. That's my own decision.

If I still could invest, I would buy LTC, ETH, XRP, now and one or two "highly volatile one" (after checking their project carefully and how it's accepted and communicated).


What's the saying again, “Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it.”?


Well it's surely not easy to invest in such a unique and fast evolving context, endangered by fears, media scaremonging and strong ennemies (bank, governments, scammers, idiots). Yet looking at the numbers, it's real and it can be rewarding (not only financially) at the cost of serious risk.


Anyway just for actually understanding I think numerous people should try, even with small amounts (hundred chfs). It's a great learning exercice to understand block chain, wallets, and what is certainly is going to be part of everyday life in a few years.
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  #128  
Old 07.04.2018, 12:53
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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It's not only about greed of scamming others, it's also part of doing something for a great new technology (dare I say revolutionary?) which is supposed to (or bringing) many advantages to the masses

-snip-

Well it's surely not easy to invest in such a unique and fast evolving context, endangered by fears, media scaremonging and strong enemies (bank, governments, scammers, idiots). Yet looking at the numbers, it's real and it can be rewarding (not only financially) at the cost of serious risk.
Very true! It's the 'revolutionary' aspect that inspired the crypto-punk movement in the first place.
The main goals were, and still are for many, to completely change the political landscape, to emancipate the peoples of this world from debt slavery, to destroy central banks (before they implode on their own?) and get rid of all government corruption in this world. Maybe a pipe dream and it's hard to guess what the chances of ultimate success will be. But who would have reckoned on the effect the invention the Gutenberg Press would have on humanity. Bitcoin is potentially even bigger!!
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  #129  
Old 07.04.2018, 18:17
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

I just tried to buy Bitcoin on coinbase using Mastercard. No-go. Visa and Mastercard both refuse payments for cryptocurrencies.

How can I buy Bitcoin now?
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  #130  
Old 08.04.2018, 09:09
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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I just tried to buy Bitcoin on coinbase using Mastercard. No-go. Visa and Mastercard both refuse payments for cryptocurrencies.

How can I buy Bitcoin now?
Look at where the nearest bitcoin ATM is to you.
https://coinatmradar.com/country/206...m-switzerland/
If you do visit one and need to travel phone first to make sure the ATM is working. Basel's one has been on the blink for over two weeks now.

PS If you want to be anonymous (recommended) use Swiss banknotes and not your card.
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  #131  
Old 08.04.2018, 10:36
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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I just tried to buy Bitcoin on coinbase using Mastercard. No-go. Visa and Mastercard both refuse payments for cryptocurrencies.

How can I buy Bitcoin now?
Some banks allegedely stopped allowing credit car to purchase transactions because there were a "high risk for their customers". The banks are protecting you. Flash news, that's why most credit cards have interest rate at 15-20%

Or they realised how the low transaction fee of crypto currencies represent a danger for them and they took actions. Thankfully for them, the media are spreading fear so they are not endangered too much, for now.

Anyway, it was never a good idea to purchase cryptocurrency on Coinbase due to the higher fee. Simply use a SEPA in euros, like most people, you already cut the purchasing cost from 3.99% to zero.
Europe
Standard Buy / Sell 1.49%
Instant Buys (Credit / Debit Card only) 3.99%
Bank transfers (SEPA) - in / out* Free / €0.15
Source:
https://support.coinbase.com/custome...-transfer-fees

And if you want to reduce the Standard Buy/sell fees from 1.49% to lower, you need to use GDAX, which is owned by Coinbase but is for intermediate users and also professional traders. I do not want to go into details now because it's the topic for "getting started". Overall you log in using your Coinbase account, import your assets and start trading. With a warning that it can be more complex (stop, limits, etc...) and can be more difficult.
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  #132  
Old 08.04.2018, 10:55
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

That really helpful information. SO why should I send you eth for info I can google? I can also copy paste to this forum and ask for bitcoins??? so you are basically saying something and asking for a return? incredible.
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  #133  
Old 08.04.2018, 11:00
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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Look at where the nearest bitcoin ATM is to you.
https://coinatmradar.com/country/206...m-switzerland/
If you do visit one and need to travel phone first to make sure the ATM is working. Basel's one has been on the blink for over two weeks now.

PS If you want to be anonymous (recommended) use Swiss banknotes and not your card.
In fact it's an interesting point. Why being anonymous regarding to Cryptocurrencies?
Well, for now, in Switzerland there's no real need as it's not even taxed ("Switzerland does not tax capital gains only in cases where is not from professional trading").

The problems come in other countries, like Poland, who took actions against people dealing with crypto currencies. I know someone who had his bank account close simply because he received money from some Polish crypto trading website. Then ensued a annoying administrative process to get his bank account back (not even sure he did). The crackdown was aimed in fact at the actual trading company which appeared to be scamming, and banks took a wide reaction and punished their slaves/users too (you can hardly called them "customers" at that point).

And nothing protect the people acquiring crypto currencies from a future political reaction, say tomorrow some Swiss government decide it's illegal, it can cause troubles. Or if they decide it's so great that it has to be heavily taxed, again, new troubles.

Which is why it's important to protect your anonimity sometimes by necessity, sometimes to prevent possible issues and also simply because it's a right every world citizen should have*.

*Of course, we are not talking frauding the tax system, declarations can be honestly made.

Now anonomity will definitely not be achieved on Coinbase since you provide several id, bank accounts, and they keep each transactions. It is also not achieved in bitcoin, etc... because the blockchain keeps tracks of each transactions since the beginning, and it's visible by all and for all (which is also why it's revolutionnary for audits and should cut auditing costs considerably for legitimate businesses).

Even monero, which is supposed to be enhanced for privacy will not be anonymous if you get them through exchanges (which are keeping track of transactions).

There are ways to be anonymous, like keeping your own wallet and using cash transactions to purchase the crypto and moves them to your wallet. It has the risks linked to traditional purchases (like scam, no delivery...). And since you are your own bank, you need to protect your wallet and make decent backup.

My stance is that i'm a too little player to take actions regarding anonimity. I also uses official exchanges so everything is tracked. I do keep an eye on governments actions, I understand the technology and I know it won't be banned as crypto currencies are here to stay. I also do not want to risk feeding scammers to obtain anonimity, as let's be honest, it's the far west out there. I trust better the blockchain, private/public key than a clown in real life, allegedely transfering virtual assets against physical cash.

I think beginners should not worry about all that, since transactions of even a few thousands CHF are nothing in the world of finance, it's insignifiant.
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  #134  
Old 08.04.2018, 11:10
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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That really helpful information. SO why should I send you eth for info I can google? I can also copy paste to this forum and ask for bitcoins??? so you are basically saying something and asking for a return? incredible.
Unfortunately, I'm a sincere, direct person who speaking straight for decades as you can read on this forum.
Is that garbage you wrote addressed to me? Who is asking for ETH?
Who is copying/pasting from google, are you accusing me of plagiarism?
I am saying something?

I am managing a topic for "getting started trading crypto currencies", for free, and offering valuable feedback acquired after hundreds of hours of reading, watching tutorials, experience and financial losses. As for getting a return, I have never received a penny (or a .0001 BTC or ETH to be relevant). That's right, nobody ever gave me anything, not even the price of a coffee or a beer. Well, it won't be the first time in EnglishForum that people save lot of money thanks to my time and efforts and gives me nothing in return.

So thanks for your pathetic mistake and dumb accusations, now if you don't have anything valuable to say about getting started trading crypto currencies, I suggest you do not "contribute" any further to that topic.

Feel free to google and sort through the millions of crypto currency related garbage created every day.

Edit: Oh an hypocrite! How I am not surprised. Such accusations coming from someone who takes people's money to clean their place (something they can do themselves easily). It's actually interesting that you are the only one receiving money in that story, which makes you an decent hypocrite and an accusator in the wrong. Typical.
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  #135  
Old 08.04.2018, 15:32
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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As for getting a return, I have never received a penny (or a .0001 BTC or ETH to be relevant). That's right, nobody ever gave me anything, not even the price of a coffee or a beer.
-
I have no Etherium.
Post a Bitcoin or a Litecoin public address and you will get your coffee.
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  #136  
Old 12.04.2018, 08:05
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

One possible future use of Bitcoin.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/bitcoi...2_2341417.html

Scroll down to the video where Saifedean Ammous, a professor at Lebanese American University, explains why bitcoin is valuable, why it is so close to and in some respects even better than gold, and why it could usher in an era of sound money for the 21st century.
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  #137  
Old 20.04.2018, 19:01
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

Look at these:




Pretty sweet for a market which was allegedely dead...

Beside these fluctuations, what matters is how the technology is actually progressing behing. For LTC (LiteCoin) it has been a pretty interesting past weeks, including new adoption, payment systems "like paypal", etc...

In fact LTC only raised of 15.16% in 7days, it's most likely because the bulls are taking confidence that the cryptocurrencies are more and more accepted. It appears to have nothing to do with all the technologies changes and all the significant adopters like banks, payment systems, etc...


Also look at Ripple (XRP), more and more banks are accepting it as payment!


2018 looks great for Cryptos, holding was a wise decision (so far).
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  #138  
Old 07.05.2018, 08:54
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

Goldman Sachs making a move to include CryptoCurrencies in their portfolios:

Source:
http://fortune.com/2018/05/02/goldma...-trading-desk/

It's indeniable, (some) cryptocurrencies are here to stay long term.

By the way, the crypto I mentionned are doing rather well, looking only in the last 7 days:
ETH took +9%
LTC took +8.89%
XRP -3.3% (not really doing well)

And let's not forget that since the alleged crash/bubble (which was nothing but a panic reaction and can not be easily compared to traditional market crashes), these crypto raised up again significantly. LTC was 120USD on 29th March 2018 and is now +160USD in 07 May 2018.

What changed?
-Media stopped fear mongering, a little. Turns out stupid hollywood women and victims are selling more than cryptocurrency panics.

-Big financial players are officially communicating on their interest

-Governments have stopped scaring people and reduced their message of doom (in fact hopefully they are preparing regulations against the numerous bad crypto and the cheater/scammer/thief trading platforms).

-More and more projects are showing the revolutionnary impact some cryptos are bringing

-Some famous people are bringing their opinion like Sergey Brin who commented on the impact on computing of the crypto (directly helping significantly the computing industry) and on the revolutionnary impact for our societies.


Once again, clearly it's still the far west and numerous cryptocurrencies are clearly scams. A lot of trading marketplace are also not very reliable (including Coinbase!!!!). Yet there's growth and some cryptocurrencies are here to stay and become a regular form of payment in the entire world.

What are you waiting for to research a bit more on the topic?
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  #139  
Old 07.05.2018, 08:59
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

The volatility of cryptos is way beyond my risk appetite. If I had a crystal all maybe I would be more tempted to invest but I don't and am not willing to lose money on pure speculation. Tech stocks are imo much safer in comparison as t least you have a lot of information to hand such as constant earnings reports and can research future directions that the companies and tech are going.
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  #140  
Old 07.05.2018, 09:23
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Re: Get started trading crypto currencies

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The volatility of cryptos is way beyond my risk appetite. If I had a crystal all maybe I would be more tempted to invest but I don't and am not willing to lose money on pure speculation. Tech stocks are imo much safer in comparison as t least you have a lot of information to hand such as constant earnings reports and can research future directions that the companies and tech are going.
The thing is with Tech stocks, your research is not going to be very different to everyone else so it's reflected in the price.

To put research into perspective $10,000 invested in gold in 1942 it would be worth $400,000 today, buying the S&P500 index & reinvesting dividends would be worth $51,000,000.
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