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  #81  
Old 10.11.2020, 15:15
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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Absolutely nothing in life will give you that guarantee, even less in finance.
And besides, the OP has told us already he's invested in crypto.

So is that risk on or risk off in the current environment?
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  #82  
Old 10.11.2020, 15:16
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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And besides, the OP has told us already he's invested in crypto.

So is that risk on or risk off in the current environment?
I think you mean "current millisecond"...
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  #83  
Old 10.11.2020, 15:21
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

Say all your assets are worth CHF1 million, how much of that would you be willing to invest with the possible risk of losing it all?

I think I might risk 5̶0̶,̶0̶0̶0̶ ̶o̶n̶l̶y̶ no maybe 25k only. Does it make me a super bad investor?
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  #84  
Old 10.11.2020, 15:37
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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Say all your assets are worth CHF1 million, how much of that would you be willing to invest with the possible risk of losing it all?

I think I might risk 5̶0̶,̶0̶0̶0̶ ̶o̶n̶l̶y̶ no maybe 25k only. Does it make me a super bad investor?
It depends what you mean by "risk".

If you mean 50% risk in the next minute, i.e. betting on a coin toss, the my risk appetite would be very low, I'd not put 25k on it!

If you mean normal investment risk, your 25k of 1M is 2.5% - major indexes and currencies can lose more than that in a day (and gain it back the next), so I'd be pretty comfortable with that during a long-term investment.
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  #85  
Old 10.11.2020, 15:39
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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Say all your assets are worth CHF1 million, how much of that would you be willing to invest with the possible risk of losing it all?

I think I might risk 5̶0̶,̶0̶0̶0̶ ̶o̶n̶l̶y̶ no maybe 25k only. Does it make me a super bad investor?
Buying a basket of stocks, you would never lose it all, unlike buying a home with 5 times gearing in CH or possibly 20 times getting in the UK. Property bought with a mortgage is a high risk investment. Jim will remind us of all the Irish that had multiple BTL's when the music stopped.
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  #86  
Old 10.11.2020, 15:45
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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Buying a basket of stocks, you would never lose it all, unlike buying a home with 5 times gearing in CH or possibly 20 times getting in the UK. Property bought with a mortgage is a high risk investment. Jim will remind us of all the Irish that had multiple BTL's when the music stopped.
I agree with this if your gearing is too high, on the other hand it is also a very cheap source of leverage, so pros and cons.

For me, our family home is an OK investment financially and a great investment personally since I like having the freedom to do what I like with it.

Our previous home in the UK is let out, so financially it's also OK but I'll probably sell it once Brexit is out of the way and assuming the market doesn't collapse.
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  #87  
Old 10.11.2020, 15:53
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

What if you use 400k from the 1 mill to buy a property outright, no mortgage. What is the harm in that?
Ok tax, repairs etc anything else?
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  #88  
Old 10.11.2020, 15:58
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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What if you use 400k from the 1 mill to buy a property outright, no mortgage. What is the harm in that?
Ok tax, repairs etc anything else?
For me this is the worst option. You're investing in a market with pretty average growth and without any leverage.

Put 200k down, take a 200k mortage @ < 1% and invest the spare 200k.

Risk is still low, any growth on the property is 2x leveraged, and your 200k investment should easily beat the mortgage rate.

(and obviously multiple all numbers up to a realistic Swiss property price!)
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  #89  
Old 10.11.2020, 16:15
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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I agree with this if your gearing is too high, on the other hand it is also a very cheap source of leverage, so pros and cons.
It's currently very cheap, if rates were to increase the value will fall, double whammy.
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  #90  
Old 10.11.2020, 17:10
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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It's currently very cheap, if rates were to increase the value will fall, double whammy.
True but with a ten year fixed rate, that's a relatively safe period. After ten years I'd expect loan-to-value to be significantly improved, or at least no worse.

For example, if you take the 2008 crash in the UK, the index came back in about eight years.
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  #91  
Old 10.11.2020, 17:40
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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Say all your assets are worth CHF1 million, how much of that would you be willing to invest with the possible risk of losing it all?

I think I might risk 5̶0̶,̶0̶0̶0̶ ̶o̶n̶l̶y̶ no maybe 25k only. Does it make me a super bad investor?
CHF1m of liquid assets (excluding real estate) and you invest only 25k yes you are not even an investor. You need to invest 25% at least. 25-75% would be the range I recommend. That doesn't mean that you invest everything at once. it may take years to be fully invested.
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  #92  
Old 10.11.2020, 18:49
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

I never diversify. I position trade, if I get caught I stay in the trade until it recovers and average down the cost by buying more on the way down.
The stocks I bought at IPO or near IPO time are:
UPS
Tesla
Goldman
Priceline
MC
Visa
Baba

The stocks I bought when they were down:

Facebook right after IPO when it opened at 40 and went down to 20 anyone could have figured that one.
Netflix when they raised their subscription for the first time from 7USD and every analyst was saying the company would be abandoned by the customers. (morons)
United Healthcare, after working for them for 5 years and seeing what a tightfisted crooks run that company. Tight fisted crook = Stock market gain guaranteed.

I am sure I am forgetting many. The point of my post is all investments that I have listed were from no-brainer category available and obvious to anyone . They did not require any reading of investment journals (what a waste) or diversification. The only regrets I have are selling some of the stocks too early. Needless to say I learned my lessons and now hold things for long time.
My latest investment is Palantir. Will see that sucker to 100/share
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  #93  
Old 10.11.2020, 21:04
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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I never diversify. I position trade, if I get caught I stay in the trade until it recovers and average down the cost by buying more on the way down.
The stocks I bought at IPO or near IPO time are:
UPS
Tesla
Goldman
Priceline
MC
Visa
Baba

The stocks I bought when they were down:

Facebook right after IPO when it opened at 40 and went down to 20 anyone could have figured that one.
Netflix when they raised their subscription for the first time from 7USD and every analyst was saying the company would be abandoned by the customers. (morons)
United Healthcare, after working for them for 5 years and seeing what a tightfisted crooks run that company. Tight fisted crook = Stock market gain guaranteed.

I am sure I am forgetting many. The point of my post is all investments that I have listed were from no-brainer category available and obvious to anyone . They did not require any reading of investment journals (what a waste) or diversification. The only regrets I have are selling some of the stocks too early. Needless to say I learned my lessons and now hold things for long time.
My latest investment is Palantir. Will see that sucker to 100/share
Not bad but someday stocks will go down by 90%.
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  #94  
Old 10.11.2020, 21:08
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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Not bad but someday stocks will go down by 90%.
That is what trailing stops are for.
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  #95  
Old 10.11.2020, 21:42
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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That is what trailing stops are for.
Doesn't help on a gap down.
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Old 10.11.2020, 22:23
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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Not bad but someday stocks will go down by 90%.
And I can claim that some day they'll go up 100% in a day.

Neither is likely or has any evidence or history behind it.
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Old 10.11.2020, 22:25
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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And I can claim that some day they'll go up 100% in a day.

Neither is likely or has any evidence or history behind it.
And house prices could collapse or skyrocket. It's all a big whirly wheel.
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Old 10.11.2020, 22:32
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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And I can claim that some day they'll go up 100% in a day.

Neither is likely or has any evidence or history behind it.
Really? Most top stocks of the 70s or 80s or 90s have disappeared. IBM, Kodak, Xerox, Nortel etc etc.
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Old 11.11.2020, 00:07
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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Really? Most top stocks of the 70s or 80s or 90s have disappeared. IBM, Kodak, Xerox, Nortel etc etc.
IBM is still kicking around...
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Old 11.11.2020, 08:07
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Re: Should I buy a home or invest? I just reached 200k in savings and they are sittin

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For me this is the worst option. You're investing in a market with pretty average growth and without any leverage.

Put 200k down, take a 200k mortage @ < 1% and invest the spare 200k.

Risk is still low, any growth on the property is 2x leveraged, and your 200k investment should easily beat the mortgage rate.
Imagine I buy a 400k property (200k cash and 200k mortgage) @ <1% interest, locked in for say 10 years.
If the interest rate climbs up drastically suddenly/gradually, what should my best course of action be after 10 years? Sell it? Pay the remaining 200k off?
The property is meant to be my future retirement place (in 15 years) and holiday destination now already (weekends).

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(and obviously multiple all numbers up to a realistic Swiss property price!)
Plenty of decent properties to be had for under 400k if your needs are humble (I am single, child free and a low maintenance person). Obviously not in hot spots but as I am a goat herder, I am looking for non-populated mountainous regions.
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