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  #21  
Old 24.08.2020, 09:37
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

I recently witnessed my in-laws (who have more than enough money) struggle to find a home and country for their retirement. Nothing seems to be good enough for them and I don't know if there will ever be a place. (This place has earthquakes and that place has hurricanes etc. etc.) They are stuck in their big family home with no destination in sight.

I think we will cash out our pension and move around from place to place renting until we find a spot where we may want to stay. Why commit? Let's hope we have the energies to live adventurously at that age...
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  #22  
Old 24.08.2020, 09:41
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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So you only rely on the funds your pension(s) will provide you?
How about setting up some savings and a private investment plan?
It is never too late (yesterday would have been better though).
Thought about that, just need the money to do it with.
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  #23  
Old 24.08.2020, 09:43
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

Life is too short to be worrying about needless things like that. Live for the moment, chances are the planet will have disappeared by the time retirement comes around.
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  #24  
Old 24.08.2020, 10:07
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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Given my kids are still quite young, can't wait to be a Grandad and have even more children laugh and make fun of me as we all get older. Don't want to miss all those wonderful Birthdays and Christmas times spent with the clan right here.
This is the number one reason why we won't stay in Switzerland - we have no family here.

In that sense I have increasingly come to feel that I have 'wasted' 22 years in Switzerland, missing too many of those wonderful birthdays and Christmas times as the family young'uns were growing up. Switzerland is lovely, sure - but as I grow older it becomes ever more clear to me that pretty scenery is not a substitute for family, friends, connection and rootedness.

I want to spend my last years with the people I love.

Seems I might have done at least something right, though. Maybe the summers the kiddiwinks spent over here had some influence, as the younger generation, now adulting in far-ranging interesting places, have all recently added canines to their busy lives.

Auntie Meloncollie, traveling dog sitter.

That's my retirement sorted.
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  #25  
Old 24.08.2020, 10:25
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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This is the number one reason why we won't stay in Switzerland - we have no family here.

In that sense I have increasingly come to feel that I have 'wasted' 22 years in Switzerland, missing too many of those wonderful birthdays and Christmas times as the family young'uns were growing up. Switzerland is lovely, sure - but as I grow older it becomes ever more clear to me that pretty scenery is not a substitute for family, friends, connection and rootedness.

I want to spend my last years with the people I love.

Seems I might have done at least something right, though. Maybe the summers the kiddiwinks spent over here had some influence, as the younger generation, now adulting in far-ranging interesting places, have all recently added canines to their busy lives.

Auntie Meloncollie, traveling dog sitter.

That's my retirement sorted.
Sorry to hear that it took a whopping 22 years to make you realise you important missed family milestones. Why did you miss Christmas times?
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  #26  
Old 24.08.2020, 10:37
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

From what I understand the max state pension in best case scenario is 2350 CHF/month?
What about worse case scenario? If someone say contributes the absolute minimum AHV for 40 years? How much will they get paid per month?
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  #27  
Old 24.08.2020, 10:42
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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From what I understand the max state pension in best case scenario is 2350 CHF/month?
What about worse case scenario? If someone say contributes the absolute minimum AHV for 40 years? How much will they get paid per month?
Use the pension calculator. https://www.ch.ch/en/retirement-benefits/
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  #28  
Old 24.08.2020, 10:47
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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This is the number one reason why we won't stay in Switzerland - we have no family here.
I understand your point of view and that it is important for you and most people maybe. I on the other hand am more of a hermit type. I am happiest the further I am away from relatives. I have no kids as far as I know nor do I want any. I enjoy solitude more than family drama.
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  #29  
Old 24.08.2020, 10:56
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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Use the pension calculator. https://www.ch.ch/en/retirement-benefits/

Ok to test, I input-

- Income to CHF0 for 40 years

- AHV contribution to minimum for 40 years

It said someone like that would get CHF960 state pension. Which is actually not bad if true.
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  #30  
Old 24.08.2020, 10:57
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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Life is too short to be worrying about needless things like that. Live for the moment, chances are the planet will have disappeared by the time retirement comes around.
That's exactly what we said in the 1960s - and we're still here.

Live now and don't get paid later is very likely going to lead to a mean, sad and generally miserable retirement.

I retired here 6 years ago. One tip is to keep your outgoings as low as possible. One of the biggest costs in Switzerland is accommodation. The British idea of paying off the mortgage at 65 doesn't exist here.

So in retirement, you are going to be paying what you are now for rent, unless you move to the sticks. Or paying the interest on a mortgage for ever - but at 1% or less it's not too painful...
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  #31  
Old 24.08.2020, 11:02
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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Sorry to hear that it took a whopping 22 years to make you realise you important missed family milestones. Why did you miss Christmas times?
Try hiring a (responsible and reliable) dog sitter over Christmas holidays.

The few able and willing to care for my mutts also had clients with children; as we were the only clients not tied to school holidays we agreed to limit our travel to off times.

---

It wasn't all bad though - we always went home for 6 December, combining the clan gathering for my father's birthday with St Nicholas Day, and brought a bit of Swiss tradition to the kiddies.

Just one of the many compromises one has to make when one moves overseas.

We were back home a lot, 4-6 trips per year, and during the peak eldercare years once or twice a month. We were fortunate to be able travel so much, but it's still not the same as living close by, sharing the casual times together.

When you are young living and working all over the globe seems like a great adventure, an opportunity not to be missed. As you grow older, though, you see the true cost of that adventure - time lost away from the people you care about - and perhaps start to wonder if it was really worth it.

So for us, the key factors in the 'where to retire' question are family and roots.


ETA: The pandemic has focused much of my thinking. Pre-Covid, I had always assumed that I could jump on a plane at a moment's notice, making distance less of an issue.

But now for the first time in all the years we have lived abroad I have not seen my family, most worryingly my elderly mother, in 7 months. With travel restrictions looking to extend into the next year, time for a re-think. Globe hopping might become a thing of the past, so the one-foot-here-one-foot-there model of retirement that once looked attractive might be a non-starter in the post-COVID world.

Last edited by meloncollie; 24.08.2020 at 11:17.
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  #32  
Old 24.08.2020, 11:11
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

One suggestion for a location: Bulgaria(more civilized) or Romania(less civilized)(my personal opinion would be more Transylvania).


One question: if the pension is lets say 2000CHF/month, how much would get in hand, canton of Bern?
Are there any taxes involved? What is the level-25%, 30%?



Thank you
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  #33  
Old 24.08.2020, 11:16
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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That's exactly what we said in the 1960s - and we're still here.

Live now and don't get paid later is very likely going to lead to a mean, sad and generally miserable retirement.
I agree. To plan for the future does not mean you can't enjoy now. I try to do both.

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I retired here 6 years ago. One tip is to keep your outgoings as low as possible. One of the biggest costs in Switzerland is accommodation.
My outgoings are extemelly low. My rent is only CHF1000 for 3 room flat in an area where people are paying CHF2000 (thanks to a very old contract). I still wonder if I should just buy property already and put that CHF1000 towards mortgage.

Then when I die the bank can reposses the property for all I care as I don't have any offsprings to pass it on to or worry about how to pay the loan fully off.
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  #34  
Old 24.08.2020, 11:18
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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Try hiring a (responsible and reliable) dog sitter over Christmas holidays.

The few able and willing to care for my mutts also had clients with children; as we were the only clients not tied to school holidays we agreed to limit our travel to off times.

---

It wasn't all bad though - we always went home for 6 December, combining the clan gathering for my father's birthday with St Nicholas Day, and brought a bit of Swiss tradition to the kiddies.

We were back home a lot, 4-6 trips per year, and during the peak eldercare years once or twice a month. We were fortunate to be able travel so much, but it's still not the same as living close by, sharing the casual times together..
Ok so in reality it's not nearly as bad as your post made it sound, which was like you hardly every saw the family or kids when in reality you did quite regularly for someone who lives abroad! You probably go back more than I do.
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  #35  
Old 24.08.2020, 11:33
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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I agree. To plan for the future does not mean you can't enjoy now. I try to do both.

My outgoings are extemelly low. My rent is only CHF1000 for 3 room flat in an area where people are paying CHF2000 (thanks to a very old contract). I still wonder if I should just buy property already and put that CHF1000 towards mortgage.

Then when I die the bank can reposses the property for all I care as I don't have any offsprings to pass it on to or worry about how to pay the loan fully off.
My reasoning is a bit different... if i would buy it would be cash, no mortgage. Live there and spend the rest. Then sell to rent something smaller, and use up money from the house. I am not assuming any income from 1st pillar, thatll just be extra. No offspring so want to spend it all.

I thought about CH pass (have 16yrs in the same town now) but I am Dutch to the core and dont want to loose that passport.

In 'preparation' for retirement and to enjoy more now Ive reduced my working to 2 weeks of 4 days with the 3rd week free (and repeat like that throughout the whole year).)

Something like this would be nice, unfortunately no garage and the mainland is far...
https://www.kyero.com/en/property/77...t=PropertyCard
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  #36  
Old 24.08.2020, 11:48
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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Use the pension calculator. https://www.ch.ch/en/retirement-benefits/
Thats amazing, by being anal & entering the exact salary for each year, aged 67 I will get a CHF 1077 Swiss pension & £761.81 UK pension per month.
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  #37  
Old 24.08.2020, 11:56
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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Ideally I would like to live in Switzerland for rest of my life but it seems it would be difficult financially. The only thing I can afford to buy here is a goat shed in the mountains.

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Assuming this is a legit channel, this US couple bought a house in Portugal for 190k. Look at all that land! I could become a bauer with that land.
Why the obsession with buying a property? In old age it will be a burden to maintain and in 10 or 15 years you could be in a nursing home or dead!

Just rent something that suits you, it’s a lot less of a financial commitment and you can always move on if it does not suit you.
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  #38  
Old 24.08.2020, 12:10
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

Interesting thread, especially to see so many expats here without kids.

My thinking is that we can always go back to E-Eu to my home country, buy an estate by the lake and just chill the next 20 years. Albeit, no infrastructure around, the healthcare system lacks everything and politics is nuts, but we could be building our bubble if needed.

But would I want to leave the kids behind after going through the stress of raising a family without any grandma-grandpa support? Probably not. Will my kids have any Hungarian identity? Very unlikely, maybe as a second, alternative heritage to their learnt Swissness. I definitely don't want to uproot them for my own purposes. So unless they start backpacking to Australia or somewhere far with no intention to return, we'll probably be here and support them (also so that they might support us later when we will be 80+, if at all).
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  #39  
Old 24.08.2020, 12:19
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

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From what I understand the max state pension in best case scenario is 2350 CHF/month?
What about worse case scenario? If someone say contributes the absolute minimum AHV for 40 years? How much will they get paid per month?
Better to look at pillar II, much more interesting
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  #40  
Old 24.08.2020, 12:24
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Re: Do you think about your future/retirement etc?

Jim, I am in my 40s and you want me to be dead in 10 years? Yes can happen anytime but....

The reasoning for buying a cheap property being that I will have a roof over my head and not have to worry about using my savings to pay rent. Your point makes sense too, unfortunately everyone's point here makes sense. Not an easy thing to decide, hence this thread.
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