Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Finance/banking/taxation  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #441  
Old 18.02.2021, 09:37
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: Basel
Posts: 410
Groaned at 24 Times in 13 Posts
Thanked 661 Times in 265 Posts
Polymath has a reputation beyond reputePolymath has a reputation beyond reputePolymath has a reputation beyond reputePolymath has a reputation beyond reputePolymath has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
Perhaps helpful to point out the returns you quote are in GBP. The price return on Fundsmith GBP I Acc was approximately 28.5% in CHF terms in 2019 and 11.5% in 2020. Annualized return 19.7% in CHF over the 2 years. Smithson price return 28.3% annualized in CHF over the same time period

Thanks for starting this great thread Polymath. I have 80% of my stock market investments in Fundsmith and Smithson. Itís reassuring to have some support for my investment decisions from the discussion. No one in the real world wants to listen to meÖ
Thanks for the additional info. I agree it's important to consider returns in base currency too.

Would you mind sharing what the remaining 20% of your equity investments are?
Reply With Quote
  #442  
Old 18.02.2021, 11:31
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
You bought netflix in 2007 - that's exactly the type of thing they do. I imagine netflix wasn't profitable then, but look at it now. Up 200 times since then.
Netflix was first profitable in 2003 $6.5 million, blockbuster turned down buying Netflix for $50 million in 2000. Amazingly it was only created after being pissed off with late fees from returning a video late!

This is an interesting timeline, it was a very lucky purchase in 2007 https://www.topaccountingdegrees.org...s-blockbuster/

I notice it was on a PE of 25 when I bought in 2007, makes looking buying SMT at a PE of say 10 times to that look foolish. Most of my sales were at PE's above 400 in 2013 & 2015.

Last edited by fatmanfilms; 18.02.2021 at 12:28. Reason: adding about PE in 2007
Reply With Quote
  #443  
Old 18.02.2021, 15:32
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 2,876
Groaned at 63 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 4,070 Times in 1,901 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
Netflix was first profitable in 2003 $6.5 million, blockbuster turned down buying Netflix for $50 million in 2000. Amazingly it was only created after being pissed off with late fees from returning a video late!

This is an interesting timeline, it was a very lucky purchase in 2007 https://www.topaccountingdegrees.org...s-blockbuster/

I notice it was on a PE of 25 when I bought in 2007, makes looking buying SMT at a PE of say 10 times to that look foolish. Most of my sales were at PE's above 400 in 2013 & 2015.
TBH had blockbuster bought it it probably wouldn't be what it is today. I'm amazed it was around that early. I was still in primary school in the first half of 2000.
Reply With Quote
  #444  
Old 18.02.2021, 15:41
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 2,876
Groaned at 63 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 4,070 Times in 1,901 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
Netflix was first profitable in 2003 $6.5 million, blockbuster turned down buying Netflix for $50 million in 2000. Amazingly it was only created after being pissed off with late fees from returning a video late!

This is an interesting timeline, it was a very lucky purchase in 2007 https://www.topaccountingdegrees.org...s-blockbuster/

I notice it was on a PE of 25 when I bought in 2007, makes looking buying SMT at a PE of say 10 times to that look foolish. Most of my sales were at PE's above 400 in 2013 & 2015.
Terry says to look at growth more than price!

Clearly buying SMT now is not as good as buying Netflix in 2007 - but very little is as good as that.
Reply With Quote
  #445  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:05
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
TBH had blockbuster bought it it probably wouldn't be what it is today. I'm amazed it was around that early. I was still in primary school in the first half of 2000.
It was pretty much a mail order DVD rental company, just growing revenues attracted me.
Quote:
View Post
Terry says to look at growth more than price!

Clearly buying SMT now is not as good as buying Netflix in 2007 - but very little is as good as that.
Growth in Free Cash Flow & definitely not EPS!

Still dropped 60% shortly after I tripped my exposure! It's also dropped about 60% on 2 further occasions!
Reply With Quote
  #446  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:18
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 2,876
Groaned at 63 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 4,070 Times in 1,901 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
It was pretty much a mail order DVD rental company, just growing revenues attracted me.


Growth in Free Cash Flow & definitely not EPS!

Still dropped 60% shortly after I tripped my exposure! It's also dropped about 60% on 2 further occasions!
I imagine if you had kept those netflix shares until now they'd be worth a very serious amount.
Reply With Quote
  #447  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:24
Pachyderm's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 1,549
Groaned at 76 Times in 55 Posts
Thanked 3,384 Times in 1,156 Posts
Pachyderm has a reputation beyond reputePachyderm has a reputation beyond reputePachyderm has a reputation beyond reputePachyderm has a reputation beyond reputePachyderm has a reputation beyond reputePachyderm has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
It is partly down to stomach though. There were people telling me not to buy BG funds at not much more than 50% of their current valuation. People who were overly concerned with valuation have missed out big time. That's a lesson that's been repeated over and over again over the last decade. On a pretty modest portfolio size I've earned well more than income from employment in 2020.

I certainly wouldn't exit completely. Even if there's a crash you should recover in a few years. If you need to dial down your risk by all means buy some SSON and FS. I think it depends not only on your age, but also on your wealth. If you have a small pot then perhaps you need to be conservative, but if you are sitting on 5-10m I'd be going hell for leather still.

I'm going to continue adding into BG but also into SSON and FEET. But then im 32. I think the main FS fund is a bit of a grandpa fund. Excellent at delivering above market returns at low risk - but younger people should probably be dialling up the risk somewhat.
Wow, is there nothing in between "a small pot" and "5-10m"? I don't like to mention exact figures on a public forum but I will say that the investment part of our wealth, in UKP, is in the very high six-figures area which is a pretty substantial sum for us. And I suspect, most people. It's increased by about 200K UKP in the last 12 months alone, by far the biggest increase since I started investing >20 years ago. I think this is why I'm feeling more nervous at the moment. It feels like a bubble, so when I see investment grandees like Grantham using the same words it adds to my uncertainty.

I've been invested in FS for some years, after first reading FMF talk about it, but it's been a bit stodgy over the past few months so I've suspended new investment for the moment. Interesting about FEET and SSON. Last time I looked (quite a long time back) they were really struggling but I see that they've started to well outperform the main FS over the past year or so. That could be one way to go. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #448  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:27
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 2,876
Groaned at 63 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 4,070 Times in 1,901 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
Wow, is there nothing in between "a small pot" and "5-10m"? I don't like to mention exact figures on a public forum but I will say that the investment part of our wealth, in UKP, is in the very high six-figures area which is a pretty substantial sum for us. And I suspect, most people. It's increased by about 200K UKP in the last 12 months alone, by far the biggest increase since I started investing >20 years ago. I think this is why I'm feeling more nervous at the moment. It feels like a bubble, so when I see investment grandees like Grantham using the same words it adds to my uncertainty.

I've been invested in FS for some years, after first reading FMF talk about it, but it's been a bit stodgy over the past few months so I've suspended new investment for the moment. Interesting about FEET and SSON. Last time I looked (quite a long time back) they were really struggling but I see that they've started to well outperform the main FS over the past year or so. That could be one way to go. Thanks.
Well i'd call that a medium size pot and personally would probably dial down the risk a bit at you age, but keep some BG.

FEET struggled for ages. SSON has performed well pretty much since day 1. SSON is (expected to be) higher risk higher return than FS - so a bit less "stodgy" using your terminology.
Reply With Quote
  #449  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:29
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
I imagine if you had kept those netflix shares until now they'd be worth a very serious amount.
I bought a home in 2014 & paid for an additional floor to be built in 2017 with $7k total invested in Netflix & BIDU, still have some BIDU they were purchased on 31 March 06 exactly 14 months before Netflix, I was investing part of my salary every month, hence both bought at the very end of the month. 2 x 50 plus baggers in 2 years if only that would happen more often!
Reply With Quote
  #450  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:39
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 2,876
Groaned at 63 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 4,070 Times in 1,901 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
I bought a home in 2014 & paid for an additional floor to be built in 2017 with $7k total invested in Netflix & BIDU, still have some BIDU they were purchased on 31 March 06 exactly 14 months before Netflix, I was investing part of my salary every month, hence both bought at the very end of the month. 2 x 50 plus baggers in 2 years if only that would happen more often!
$7k in netflix invested in May 2007 now worth $1.3M
Reply With Quote
  #451  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:40
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post

I've been invested in FS for some years, after first reading FMF talk about it, but it's been a bit stodgy over the past few months so I've suspended new investment for the moment. Interesting about FEET and SSON. Last time I looked (quite a long time back) they were really struggling but I see that they've started to well outperform the main FS over the past year or so. That could be one way to go. Thanks.
FS has been booming recently, up 5.5% since 31 January at yesterdays price of 566.72, it's done even better in Euros up 6.67% since 31 January. Has beaten Smithson over the 2 weeks. Performance is not linear, far better to invest at a lower price.

FEET is out of favour, the forum lost faith totally in the summer when it hit 17% discount. Over time it ought to be a winner, investors are just buying trackers at the moment which is the issue.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #452  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:46
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 2,876
Groaned at 63 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 4,070 Times in 1,901 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
FS has been booming recently, up 5.5% since 31 January at yesterdays price of 566.72, it's done even better in Euros up 6.67% since 31 January. Has beaten Smithson over the 2 weeks. Performance is not linear, far better to invest at a lower price.

FEET is out of favour, the forum lost faith totally in the summer when it hit 17% discount. Over time it ought to be a winner, investors are just buying trackers at the moment which is the issue.
SSON had a horror January (not that it really matters) just after I said I thought it would do well in 2021.

Share price -4.7% vs +0.2% for the index.

Probably means its time to buy. I was going to buy in January but ended up buying KIT (now KPC) as I wanted to build a position in that new trust while it was still trading at a discount (which I knew wouldn't last). I still want to build up SSON this year.
Reply With Quote
  #453  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:52
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
$7k in netflix invested in May 2007 now worth $1.3M
2k was in BIDU. Unfortunately I sold 20% of my holding each time they recovered from 60% falls. Still cleared over $200,000 so not too shabby, the property has probably doubled v 225% increase in Fundsmith in Euros. That matches the other thread where you lose 100% of property investment over 7 years v opportunity cost in the Stockmarket.
Reply With Quote
  #454  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:53
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 2,876
Groaned at 63 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 4,070 Times in 1,901 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
2k was in BIDU. Unfortunately I sold 20% of my holding each time they recovered from 60% falls. Still cleared over $200,000 so not too shabby, the property has probably doubled v 225% increase in Fundsmith in Euros. That matches the other thread where you lose 100% of property investment over 7 years v opportunity cost in the Stockmarket.
You don't have a crystal ball. Its still a phenomenal investment
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank HickvonFrick for this useful post:
  #455  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:56
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 541
Groaned at 7 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 211 Times in 136 Posts
naza is considered knowledgeablenaza is considered knowledgeablenaza is considered knowledgeable
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
$7k in netflix invested in May 2007 now worth $1.3M
this is still possible with other asset classes... see I didn't mention the "banned" word
Reply With Quote
  #456  
Old 18.02.2021, 16:59
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
this is still possible with other asset classes... see I didn't mention the "banned" word
It's not an 'asset class' is the issue. I would have lost my password from 2007.....
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
  #457  
Old 18.02.2021, 17:02
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lausanne
Posts: 541
Groaned at 7 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 211 Times in 136 Posts
naza is considered knowledgeablenaza is considered knowledgeablenaza is considered knowledgeable
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
It's not an 'asset class' is the issue. I would have lost my password from 2007.....
I should've said "speculative" asset class
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank naza for this useful post:
  #458  
Old 18.02.2021, 18:04
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Frick, Aargau
Posts: 2,876
Groaned at 63 Times in 51 Posts
Thanked 4,070 Times in 1,901 Posts
HickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond reputeHickvonFrick has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
It's not an 'asset class' is the issue. I would have lost my password from 2007.....
Well it is an asset, just not an investment.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank HickvonFrick for this useful post:
  #459  
Old 19.02.2021, 00:44
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: no longer in the forum
Posts: 190
Groaned at 4 Times in 3 Posts
Thanked 173 Times in 90 Posts
jim1 has a reputation beyond reputejim1 has a reputation beyond reputejim1 has a reputation beyond reputejim1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
Thanks for the additional info. I agree it's important to consider returns in base currency too.

Would you mind sharing what the remaining 20% of your equity investments are?
My equity investments & cash:
72% Fundsmith
10% Smithson (bought more today at -6% from all time high)
3% SMT
Rest is in need of a spring clean:
5% US S&P 500 ETF (SPY)
2% US dividend aristocrat ETFs (NOBL, SDY) - on sell list
2% UBS high yield bond fund (not equity and on sell list)
1% TEM Templeton emerg. Markets
5% cash and misc small investment trusts and shares

Emboldened by this thread I am planning to increase my Smithson as a % of assets by making regular monthly investments of a fixed amount. Since I regret not buying more at 900 last March I also set myself a rule to buy larger amounts when the price decreases by 5%, 10%, etc

Reading this thread I started to wonder if I am being too conservative by investing in Fundsmith and if I should be chasing higher returns. FS is a 100% equity fund so it is not conservative by any means and it returned 11% in CHF in 2020 which is a fantastic result. Someone once said, to be fearful when others are greedy...
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank jim1 for this useful post:
  #460  
Old 19.02.2021, 09:48
fatmanfilms's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Verbier
Posts: 21,376
Groaned at 461 Times in 352 Posts
Thanked 23,091 Times in 11,824 Posts
fatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond reputefatmanfilms has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Equity Portfolio Advice

Quote:
View Post
My equity investments & cash:
72% Fundsmith
10% Smithson (bought more today at -6% from all time high)
3% SMT
Rest is in need of a spring clean:
5% US S&P 500 ETF (SPY)
2% US dividend aristocrat ETFs (NOBL, SDY) - on sell list
2% UBS high yield bond fund (not equity and on sell list)
1% TEM Templeton emerg. Markets
5% cash and misc small investment trusts and shares

Emboldened by this thread I am planning to increase my Smithson as a % of assets by making regular monthly investments of a fixed amount. Since I regret not buying more at 900 last March I also set myself a rule to buy larger amounts when the price decreases by 5%, 10%, etc

Reading this thread I started to wonder if I am being too conservative by investing in Fundsmith and if I should be chasing higher returns. FS is a 100% equity fund so it is not conservative by any means and it returned 11% in CHF in 2020 which is a fantastic result. Someone once said, to be fearful when others are greedy...
You would not have been able to buy much Smithson at 900, it was at that level for a very short period of time with a huge discount. Just for a very short period sellers outnumbered buyers & someone sold a lot of stock in an illiquid market.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank fatmanfilms for this useful post:
Reply

Tags
fundsmith, investing, smithson, stocks




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Equity Transfer of house sale in UK to CHF ballum Finance/banking/taxation 25 17.08.2018 00:17
Tax on equity earnings SarcasmXXL Finance/banking/taxation 23 31.10.2017 09:29
Anyone in Venture Capital or Private Equity? stamplover Business & entrepreneur 0 05.08.2015 20:43
Releasing equity in UK to buy an appartment in Switzerland Chester Housing in general 4 19.04.2007 20:03
Equity Investing - The DIY Route hbunny Finance/banking/taxation 3 10.12.2006 21:38


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:30.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0