Thanks a lot, I really have to dig deeper on this subject, definitely before applying for it.


Of course . Certain things are really difficult to estimate, but hey the time won't come back, letting it go because of fear of the unexpected would be dumb. What matters in my life are simple things which usually comes for free: the nature, friendship, knowledge, etc. I couldn't care less about 80% of the modern world goodies. I only want to enjoy a first world medical service thus a considerable pot has to sit aside to cover for this in the future, however I won't go crazy about it, I'm in a good shape and if I do keep a healthy lifestyle I estimate 1 million CHF should be enough for this, perhaps 0.5 mln would also be fine.

A drive to Barcelona is almost three hours with traffic. Andorra is one of the most boring towns I have ever seen so what is the point of being rich if you end up living in a place like that?

Thats the same with Zug... you dont actually have to live there to save tax. If my goal was to retire in Spain I'd have a residence in Andorra and then a "holiday apartment" wherever I want to be. And the skiing is actually honestly good... so I'd spend some time in winter there.

This is a worry for me.

Due to citizenship, returning to the US is the only real option. So medical costs will be high, even with Medicare. (And who knows what the GQP will do to that once they retake congress and the senate...)

Most of the places I'd like to retire to are seriously 'auf dem Land'. Great for now, but later perhaps not so much. I'm drooling over a rural property on the market now, but a bit of research shows that the nearest doctor is more than an hour away, hospital four or five hours - and no EMT coverage. Heck, there isn't even a vet - so that throws a wrench in my dream of a broken collie farm.

I'm beginning to see that the 'healthcare desert' is a very real thing. That just might change my focus. And financial planning.

I was planning on retiring in CH. We kept our house and pensions there and are currently living in Sydney's northern beaches by the sea. Pretty sweet covid times with walks on the beach and going for an early morning swim.

We got a little shocked by the wealth taxes for a town house without a mortgage. It basically doubles our tax bill when all we were earning was rent, so with Eigenmietwert + Pension and no mortgage it doesn't make sense retiring there unless we keep some debt.

In Australia, your main home is exempt from capital gains taxes and not means tested for the pension (but income and other assets have to be so low to get that) but you pay taxes on your worldwide income.

Portugal is another option for us as there are tax deals for expats and eating out and living well is costs much less there.

The Portuguese deals are over-rated in IMO and being eroded. It only lasts for 10 years and there is no favourable rate on investment income. No wealth tax is a bonus and the food is both good and cheap.

I am far away from retirement and hence am not aware of all the possible concern but seaside Turkey close to a bigger city like Antalya or Izmir could be an option (depending on your liking of warmer weather).

I think you don't have wealth tax but more expensive apartments/houses are taxed which is a minus.

On up side: excellent healthcare, especially if you have a good private health insurance. You are likely to get much better care in top Turkish hospitals than i Switzerland imo. And you can easily afford those.

Much cheaper work force as one is more likely to need help around the house as one gets older.

I would expect you may get also other good deals in some other non-EU countries but don't know much about them. I know quite about Turkey even though I am not from Turkey that's why I mention it.

If you have an option of trying a country for a couple of months before retiring maybe it would be good to try it out and see if you like it.

You need to google "where are the blue zones in the world"...

These are 5-7 of them, unsure exactly the number... they are places where the majority of people live better, longer lives... simple as that. These places
official Blue Zone status: Ikaria, Greece; Okinawa, Japan; Ogliastra Region, Sardinia; Loma Linda, Calif.; and Nicoya Peninsula, Costa Rica

if you have 4m $ then you have more than enough if you live a modest life style, give yourself a budget of 100K a year, that is more than 30 years, should be enough.

Buy yourself a place, install solar power if it doesn't already exist [lifespan solar 30 years]. Get an electric car. I love the new Porsche Taycan 4S. Charge it from your solar, free travel. Try and conserve water, look into what sort of infrastructure you can put in to do just that.

Get a dog, hey get 2, ideally from a local rescue. Make your health and that of your loved ones your number one priority. Eat good food, drink the glass of wine [now and again, not every day]. Don't buy anything that doesn't have the label bio on it. Try and get it locally if you can, not only food in fact anything and everything. The less travelling it has to do, the better for the environment.

Make it your business to make other people's lives better [doing good has been proved to good for your health].

That is what I would do if I had 4m$, sadly i don't.

I believe 4m is not necessary, but I can't reassure you.


Interesting thought about the blue zones, thanks!

Am now wondering about a bordering country like Germany. How would assets there be taxed? Health insurance? etc?

I don't know about Germany, but when I checked Ireland, I'd have to pay Swiss health insurance if returned there to retire.

Typically the health benefits of those places accrue over a lifetime of living there, often combined with locally prevalent and advantageous genes. I don't think popping up when you're already of pension age cuts it.

Unless one has special reasons for preserving wealth - like to pass it on to your kids - I don't see that with a few million one should even worry about taxation.

With few million to invest, interest and profits on investments should easily pay your tax bills.

You are not going to take it with you, so why not spend and enjoy life?

You should prioritize
- somewhere with a first-class medical system
- somewhere where you speak the language - to an extent anyway
- somewhere where, or near where, your family and friends are
- somewhere safe and politically stable
- somewhere with a moderate climate and housing that keeps you warm through the winter

etc etc - and forget about what tax you will pay. There are no pockets in a shroud...

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any source for this?

Don't have the official source but there is an agreement in EU that you pay Health Insurance in the cointry that pays your pension - with some caveats and exceptions that need to be looked into. I suppose this is where this is coming from?

Mmmmm - and the UK and Switzerland both pay my state pensions about 50/50. What then??

There is no tax on assets in Germany(!). There is a tax on real estate and technically is the tax on cars also asset related but thats it. Health insurance is a lot cheaper, but has certain gaps you would definitely want to cover with an extra private cover... overall still cheaper mostly due to the simple fact that health services are a lot cheaper than here.

As mentioned there is specific rules and cases.

Here more information and one would need to look into.

https://www.kvg.org/en/pensioner-_co...--1--1041.html

The country that pays the majority of your pension, even if it is a minimal difference is responsible for your healthcare. This is at the point when your pension is initially awarded and does not take into account any later changes.

I have no idea how those rules have changed now as a result of BREXIT, but I guess like everything else the changes if any will only apply to people retiring after BREXIT.

The only thing I do know is that for NI, people identifying as Irish can opt to have the Irish government deal with their EU pension entitlements, health cards etc...

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