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Old 05.06.2021, 08:28
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

Would be more worried about salad especially from a local garden where the foxes roam.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Echino...multilocularis

Also a good reason for Brexit: https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/63...-controls-dogs
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  #22  
Old 05.06.2021, 09:10
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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I was also told by my doctor to not drink or eat unpasteurized milk products while I was pregnant (I also do not eat or drink them while NOT pregnant).

"Pregnant women run a serious risk of becoming ill from the bacteria Listeria, which is often found in raw milk and can cause miscarriage, or illness, or death of the newborn baby."

Source:
The Dangers of Raw Milk: Unpasteurized Milk Can Pose a Serious Health Risk
https://www.fda.gov/food/buy-store-s...us-health-risk

Regarding chocolate, I guess that had never occurred to me, but I don't recall ever being told by my doctor to NOT eat it while pregnant, and so I'm sure I probably ate plenty of it.

After doing a quick Google search, I did find this:

"Chocolate is perfectly safe for most pregnant women – in moderation. In fact, there's some evidence that eating chocolate during pregnancy could lower your risk of preeclampsia and gestational hypertension.

One study found that eating a small amount of dark chocolate every day starting in the first trimester improved blood flow to the fetus. Expecting moms in that study ate about one ounce of dark chocolate per day – that's about a quarter of a bar of chocolate, or 54 chocolate chips."

Is it safe to eat a lot of chocolate during pregnancy?
https://www.babycenter.com/pregnancy...gnancy_1245156
Indeed. My doctor even recommended dark chocolate to me for my low iron (she also recommended fortified maize based serial, despite the iron being added to counteract the iron absorption inhibition properties of maize, so I’m pretty sure that, in terms of iron, she did not know what she was talking about, but I took her up on the chocolate anyway).
Because of the additional processing, chocolate is safe.


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If ice cream use real milk and not powder (which I guess takes high temperatures), so homemade ice cream and those in good ice cream parlours then it's heated up to I think 70 or 72 deg C and kept there for some minutes, and pasteurization temperature starts at 60.



In short, ice cream should be perfectly safe as well.

Of course, as someone mentioned, contamination can happen anytime later in the process, but I don't know if you can protect yourself against that except for relying on brands that make checks vs buying from random lady in the market.
My home-made ice-cream involves a raw egg and no cooking, so it might be good just to check.

Also, please think about cheese, many cheeses are made from unpasteurised milk, I am pretty sure with hard cheeses it will be fine because during the long maturation process the good bacteria will have out-competed the bad bacteria (or the cheese would have blown out or otherwise not pass quality control), but with soft or blue cheeses it is better to check the label.

Congratulations and good luck with the pregnancy. Don’t let the meanies on here wind you up. There are a few people who get a kick out of it for some childish reason I will never understand. They forget that there are real people with real concerns on here and just assume everyone is a wind-up merchant like them.

Have a chocolate filled and peaceful weekend.
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  #23  
Old 05.06.2021, 09:57
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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And yes, thank you for another condescending post. I do understand the difference between cooked and uncooked, but I don't know the details of the chocolate-making process.

Honestly, it was a simple question. I really don't understand why people need to be so unpleasant. You could just have said, "No need to consider it, as the process for making it treats it the same way as the pasteurisation process." The snide remarks are really unnecessary but thank you all the same.
They're not snide remarks at all, simply answering your question, which you still seem determined to ignore. Cooking milk products removes the bacteria that cause listeria, chocolate is cooked, so safe, yoghurt is not, so not so safe.
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  #24  
Old 05.06.2021, 10:01
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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My home-made ice-cream involves a raw egg and no cooking.
Likewise.

Tom
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Old 05.06.2021, 10:39
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

yup definitely with raw milk. i pm'd my address so you can send all the excess chocolate to me to avoid waste.
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Old 05.06.2021, 13:55
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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They're not snide remarks at all, simply answering your question, which you still seem determined to ignore. Cooking milk products removes the bacteria that cause listeria, chocolate is cooked, so safe, yoghurt is not, so not so safe.
Actually, the recipes I use for yogurt require heating to 90C.

Tom
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  #27  
Old 05.06.2021, 17:20
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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I'm not overreacting, nor am I panicking.
To be fair, before you wrote the bit above, you wrote the bit I quote below:
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...now I am really paranoid...
It's totally normal to want to have a healthy pregnancy. It's normal to consider what you should and shouldn't consume. Now that you know cooked products are fine but raw might not be, work from there. Try not to overthink things. Too much stress isn't healthy either.

Congratulations on your pregnancy and all the best.

Last edited by 3Wishes; 06.06.2021 at 19:57. Reason: Edited quotes. Misread and misquoted one, so removed it
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  #28  
Old 05.06.2021, 17:27
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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Läderach
I also love Läderach.
Their exact formula is kept in secret (they wish ), but even according to this video from Läderach, it looks like there is no milk or cream in their milk chocolate base, only the milk powder. They put whole milk powder though, unlike many others, who uses predominantly skim milk powder and more vegetable oils. Some of FrischSchoggi Milk and Blond pieces has cream and butter added, and those are certainly pasteurized. No raw or even whole milk as far as I could find (because there is no need to add water into a chocolate mix, it only complicates the emulsification and makes the process longer).
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Old 05.06.2021, 17:35
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

Unless I am completely mistaken, that particular yogurt contains live active cultures but is made with pasteurized milk. Like taking a probiotic pill.

Chocolate is indeed cooked and usually made with processed milk products, not with raw milk (either milk powders or butter etc).
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  #30  
Old 05.06.2021, 17:59
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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I also love Läderach.
Their exact formula is kept in secret (they wish ), but even according to this video from Läderach, it looks like there is no milk or cream in their milk chocolate base, only the milk powder. They put whole milk powder though, unlike many others, who uses predominantly skim milk powder and more vegetable oils. Some of FrischSchoggi Milk and Blond pieces has cream and butter added, and those are certainly pasteurized. No raw or even whole milk as far as I could find (because there is no need to add water into a chocolate mix, it only complicates the emulsification and makes the process longer).
You talked about (and I quoted) "real milk". Läderach uses cream and butter - which is from milk and they do declare that behind both products. (Open "Zutateninformationen"). They use milkpowder too but - as far as I'm informed they are the only ones who add real milk-products in Switzerland.
Of course it is pasteurized - repeat, the subject was milk in general - and even if not, by the time the mixture is chocolate it would definitely be.

Of course one should consider, that a foetus growing on Läderach chocolate might not settle for anything cheaper later, so it should be well thought through.
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  #31  
Old 05.06.2021, 18:03
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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..a foetus growing on Läderach..
Superpowers.
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  #32  
Old 05.06.2021, 18:05
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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I also love Läderach.
Their exact formula is kept in secret.....
You wish, big, industrial producers are always saying how they have "secret" recipes, as if they would fill their lack of authenticity with "secrets" Just think of Coca Cola and KFC. Real masters are not afraid of showing the word their recipes, because they know you firstly need a lot of dedication and hard work to do it.
Whatever goes through factory is dead so no fear to consume it. And pasteurization can happen at much lower temperature than we think, you can pasteurize eggs and you still have them raw and runny. And everything is done with ingredients that can be harmonized and used with similar process in the way that nothing could spoil.
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  #33  
Old 05.06.2021, 19:55
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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If ice cream use real milk and not powder (which I guess takes high temperatures), so homemade ice cream and those in good ice cream parlours then it's heated up to I think 70 or 72 deg C and kept there for some minutes.
Ten minutes at 72°C is probably against potential salmonella from the egg.
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My home-made ice-cream involves a raw egg and no cooking, so it might be good just to check.
The egg has a protective layer inside the shell that blocks pretty much every bacteria for the first ten days, the experts strongly recommend to only use eggs for uncooked products that are less old.

It won't hurt to assume that the outside of the shell is contaminated and act accordingly, for instance don't scrape out any remaining eggwhite with your finger and protect the other stuff you're using by washing your hands often. Salmonella can't reproduce below ~8°C, the fridge should be below that while you store the ice cream, tiramisu, and home-made mayonnaise.
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Old 05.06.2021, 21:51
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

there are different temps and times, it can be as low as:
...57°C in water bath for at least 1 hour and 15 minutes which keeps the egg practically "raw", as in a cooking form.
I actually find it wrong when alarming information is spreading and than are people, because of unfounded fears.
This guy here had collected a lot of info, and put it nicelly together
A practical guide to.....
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  #35  
Old 05.06.2021, 21:53
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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So this might sound like a stupid question, but the day I found out I was pregnant was also the day that I realised, totally unbeknown to me, that I had been eating unpasteurised yoghurt. I had no idea that it was possible to buy raw milk products in supermarkets, even though I've lived here for years. I knew about cheese, but yoghurt and milk never crossed my mind.

So now I am really paranoid. I am pregnant, and I was checking the chocolate and ice-cream packets (so desperate for a weekend treat), but it doesn't say pasteurised. Does this mean that there is the possibility that it has been made with raw milk products?
No, it doesn't sound like a stupid question. Many pregnant women beat themselves up over the slightest "mistakes" during pregnancy. Why didn't I check the labels, why did I eat this or that!! OMG!!!

Rest assured, nothing bad will happen. It's good to avoid certain things though. I do not think chocolate and ice-cream is among them. Indulge yourself if your blood sugar levels are OK.

I have also eaten unpasteurised yogurt and semi-raw meat, accidentally, and nothing happened. But perhaps whatever anyone will write here won't put your mind at rest. You'll continue to freak out, call it paranoia if you want, but I'd say you should just get used with the worries and "guilt" that come with being a mom. It's the beginning of a long story.
If it's your first, do try to rest as much as possible. You'll long for sleeping a whole night for many months to come! Try to worry less, enjoy this period more. Stay healthy. Good luck with everything.
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  #36  
Old 06.06.2021, 07:58
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

Talking eating and pregnancy I do think there is some millage in the studies that suggest you SHOULD eat nuts, especially peanuts.

I say that because my daughter is allergic to nuts, and because of it doesn't eat chocolate and a host of other snacks, many of which "might contain traces of nuts". Easter is particularly sad in Switzerland where raw peanuts are handed out to the kids at schools and Halloween is much better where sweets containing nuts are everywhere too.

The whole science of avoiding these things over the last 20 years has changed sides. Assuming your not one of the unlucky ones who has allergies then making an effort not to avoid looks like the way to go.

https://www.webmd.com/baby/features/peanuts-pregnant
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Old 06.06.2021, 08:03
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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Talking eating and pregnancy I do think there is some millage in the studies that suggest you SHOULD eat nuts, especially peanuts.

I say that because my daughter is allergic to nuts, and because of it doesn't eat chocolate and a host of other snacks, many of which "might contain traces of nuts". Easter is particularly sad in Switzerland where raw peanuts are handed out to the kids at schools and Halloween is much better where sweets containing nuts are everywhere too.

The whole science of avoiding these things over the last 20 years has changed sides. Assuming your not one of the unlucky ones who has allergies then making an effort not to avoid looks like the way to go.

https://www.webmd.com/baby/features/peanuts-pregnant
It was a matter of time until the science on complete elimination changed..Where I am from doctors believe in early exposure instead of elimination. It worked for us.
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Old 06.06.2021, 15:47
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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You talked about (and I quoted) "real milk". Läderach uses cream and butter - which is from milk and they do declare that behind both products. (Open "Zutateninformationen"). They use milkpowder too but - as far as I'm informed they are the only ones who add real milk-products in Switzerland.
Of course it is pasteurized - repeat, the subject was milk in general - and even if not, by the time the mixture is chocolate it would definitely be.

Of course one should consider, that a foetus growing on Läderach chocolate might not settle for anything cheaper later, so it should be well thought through.
Sorry...with the greatest respect the statement above re. Milk powder is not quite correct..
Felchlin in Ibach use ‘ real milk products ‘...all Swiss too in their white and milk chocolate couvertures.
Felchlin is not very well known , even among most Swiss but it is certainly one of ,if not the worlds leading chocolate manufacturer.
They are only b to b, not b to c hence the lack of awareness among the general public. They also supply along with many other customers worldwide Sprüngli and Läderach.
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Old 06.06.2021, 18:02
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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It was Gruyeres yoghurt, in Coop. I was really surprised, too, as I didn't think you'd be able to buy something unpasteurised in the Coop. But it does not say pasteurised on the tub, and all other yoghurts do. Then someone at work told me that it was unpasteurised and should be avoided during pregnancy.
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Well, if it was this one, it is clearly declared here that the milk used is pasteurized!

So if it was this yoghurt, yes it was worth starting this thread for you .... go have an other yoghurt and sleep at ease!
It wasn't that specific one, but it was a Gruyeres one. It definitely, definitely did not say pasteurised on it. It just said, "Lait entier" (I'm not an idiot - I can read! ).
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Old 06.06.2021, 18:16
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Re: Pregnancy and Chocolate - is it safe to eat here?

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To be fair, before you wrote the bit above, you wrote the bits I quote below:


It's totally normal to want to have a healthy pregnancy. It's normal to consider what you should and shouldn't consume. Now that you know cooked products are fine but raw might not be, work from there. Try not to overthink things. Too much stress isn't healthy either.

Congratulations on your pregnancy and all the best.
No, I said I was NOT anxious about my pregnancy (read it again). And being paranoid about what I am eating is not the same as being anxious. I just wanted some answers on chocolate, not the influx of advice (unasked for) from several people about all manner of things surrounding pregnancy, including some patronising comments and assumptions, like that this is my first child.

Anyway, thanks for the responses about the chocolate, but I'd like to point out that I am not an idiot and I know cooked products are fine. I just don't know how chocolate is made. Again, I find your comments about knowing that cooked products are fine fairly patronising, but thank you anyway for your input.

Last edited by Sileas; 06.06.2021 at 18:21. Reason: Error
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