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  #21  
Old 12.05.2010, 21:12
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Re: Raw Milk

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You're obviously free to do as you see fit, but I think it bears pointing out that, according to the article I cited above, it's not so much a matter of adding the lactase enzyme to the human being, but that raw milk simply comes with its own lactase enzyme:

"Raw milk contains harmless bacteria which produce lactase which, in turn, enables the human body to break down and absorb lactose. Pasteurized milk has had all of these bacteria killed off and is therefore lactase-free, but still contains lactose, causing problems for many people who try to drink it."
Thanks once again. I never realised that. So cheeses etc from un-pasteurised contain the enzyme and are good to go ?
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Old 12.05.2010, 21:19
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Re: Raw Milk

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Hey guys...
just wondering what the law is for raw milk here in Switzerland and also if there is legal or possible to buy local raw milk here. If so, where and usually how much does it cost?
LG Jennifer
In the 50ies, the milkmen made their rounds each morning with fresh raw milk. People had their Milchbüechli (milk-booklet) into which they wrote their orders. And then once-weekly paid the purchased milk in the shop. You however had to use the milk up during the day, as it would not have survived into the next day. Then came the pasteurized milk which was ok for two to three days, but for sure not more. Now the best option is the UHT milk which lasts for a considerable time.



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Do you heat it to 70? Also is the milk separated/homogenised, or do you get those little cream lumps?
In real raw milk, you inevitably have needle. So that it is normal to use sieves when you pour the milk into the cup(s).

Last edited by Wollishofener; 12.05.2010 at 21:41.
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  #23  
Old 12.05.2010, 21:22
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Re: Raw Milk

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Thanks once again. I never realised that. So cheeses etc from un-pasteurised contain the enzyme and are good to go ?
That seems to be the case. I've known folks to introduce raw milk products to their diets in small, but increasing, increments with few (if any) adverse effects. Since you already know the worst that can happen, it might be worth a try, even if just once.

Edit: FWIW, my understanding is that most hard Swiss-made cheeses (Emmentaler, Gruyère, Appenzeller...) are made from raw milk. Not sure about in CH, but in the US, the ingredient is specified as "milk" (meaning raw) or "pasteurized milk" according to the labeling requirements.
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Old 12.05.2010, 21:27
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Re: Raw Milk

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You however had to use the milk up during the day, as it would not have survived into the next day. Then came the pasteurized milk which was ok for two to three days, but for sure not more. Now the best option is the UHT milk which lasts for a considerable time.
UHT tastes weird though, so best is arguable. And if you keep the milk in a cold place then raw one easily last more than a few days - this is all we drank when I was a kid and we certainly did not get it every day.
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Old 12.05.2010, 21:41
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Re: Raw Milk

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UHT tastes weird though, so best is arguable. And if you keep the milk in a cold place then raw one easily last more than a few days - this is all we drank when I was a kid and we certainly did not get it every day.
And even when it starts to turn, unlike "dead" milk, raw milk can still be made into stuff like yogurt. It goes from fresh to "cultured" to bad, whereas "dead" milk goes straight from "fresh" to bad.
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Old 12.05.2010, 21:48
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Re: Raw Milk

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OK sold. I live in central Zurich. Please google map me my nearest raw milk dispenser. I will bring a plastic cup and some lindt drinking chocolate flakes
Zürich Seebach, as shown under
www.riedenholzhof.ch/Tierhaltung.htm
- milk purchasing times
Milchverkauf während des Melkens:
Morgens von 05.45 - 06.15 Uhr
Abends von 16.45 - 17.15 Uhr


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Old 12.05.2010, 22:01
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Re: Raw Milk

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UHT tastes weird though, so best is arguable. And if you keep the milk in a cold place then raw one easily last more than a few days - this is all we drank when I was a kid and we certainly did not get it every day.
I do not think that UHT tastes weird in any way. Past-Milk was alright, but had a strange taste. The raw milk may have been good, but the pesky needle was the plague, and in the City of Zurich, the stuff "died" 24 hours later. That really fresh raw milk in the countryside lasted/lasts a few days is clear, but already in a town like Schaffhausen its life-expectency was below 48hours.
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Old 12.05.2010, 22:13
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Re: Raw Milk

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In real raw milk, you inevitably have needle. So that it is normal to use sieves when you pour the milk into the cup(s).
By us, anything like that has already been filtered out, as the farmers bottle it themselves just before pick up or delivery.

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That really fresh raw milk in the countryside lasted/lasts a few days is clear, but already in a town like Schaffhausen its life-expectency was below 48hours.
FWIW, we get 7.5 liters once per week, and — kept cold — it almost always lasts the full 7 days.
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  #29  
Old 12.05.2010, 22:26
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Re: Raw Milk

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By us, anything like that has already been filtered out, as the farmers bottle it themselves just before pick up or delivery.

FWIW, we get 7.5 liters once per week, and — kept cold — it almost always lasts the full 7 days.
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  #30  
Old 13.05.2010, 03:46
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Re: Raw Milk

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Yep. There's a farm right down the road from us with a dispenser, the milk is fantastic and I swear I feel better for days after drinking it. Worth seeking out a local source .
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You don't know milk until you've drunk raw milk.....
Really? I thought raw milk was not good for you because it has to be pasturized to kill any germs & bacteria. I've never had raw milk before so I can't imagine what it tastes like. It's got lumps in it?
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  #31  
Old 13.05.2010, 03:50
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Re: Raw Milk

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I do not think that UHT tastes weird in any way. Past-Milk was alright, but had a strange taste. The raw milk may have been good, but the pesky needle was the plague, and in the City of Zurich, the stuff "died" 24 hours later. That really fresh raw milk in the countryside lasted/lasts a few days is clear, but already in a town like Schaffhausen its life-expectency was below 48hours.
What kind of needles are in the raw milk?
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  #32  
Old 13.05.2010, 06:33
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Re: Raw Milk

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Really? I thought raw milk was not good for you because it has to be pasturized to kill any germs & bacteria. I've never had raw milk before so I can't imagine what it tastes like. It's got lumps in it?
Fresh raw milk has the full cream in it. Well cared for milk doesn't come with lumps, though over time, or if you freeze it, the fat (cream) can start to clump together. Vigorous shaking before pouring can usually remedy that.

For more self-education on the benefits, risks, and popular myths about raw milk, please study this and this.

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What kind of needles are in the raw milk?
My family has been drinking raw milk for years, and we've never come across a needle. The milking needles that can turn up in milk (not just raw) are used by the dairy operator during the milking process, to facilitate flow from the cow's udder. They can come loose and/or fall into the milk. Apparently it once was not uncommon for folks to find the needles in their milk, but I don't think this is very common any more.
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  #33  
Old 13.05.2010, 09:03
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Re: Raw Milk

Actually it's true that us, human and adult, should not drink milk at all.

It's food and nutriment for new born beings, with hormones and substances useful for them, not for us. Cow's milk is perhaps the last one we should drink, it's made for a veal that has to take a few 100 kilos.....

We are actually the only species that continue to drink milk once we've grown.

I stopped to drink milk (for two years some years ago and reduced my Cheese *habits*, I lost some kilos and I had more energy, but now, I LOVE milk and so I got back with raw milk.
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Old 13.05.2010, 15:16
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Re: Raw Milk

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Actually it's true that us, human and adult, should not drink milk at all.

It's food and nutriment for new born beings, with hormones and substances useful for them, not for us. Cow's milk is perhaps the last one we should drink, it's made for a veal that has to take a few 100 kilos.....

We are actually the only species that continue to drink milk once we've grown.

I stopped to drink milk (for two years some years ago and reduced my Cheese *habits*, I lost some kilos and I had more energy, but now, I LOVE milk and so I got back with raw milk.
Yeah I like to drink milk from time to time too and have it with cereal.

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  #35  
Old 01.11.2010, 18:59
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Re: Raw Milk

There is a farm at the Hönggerberg (near the ETH campus where I'm at!) that has a milk dispensing machine. I just went there with a colleague to get some! It's only 1.40CHF/liter, and you can buy as little or as much as you want. Just put in your coins and press a button. Closest bus stop is Hönggerberg with the 69 or 80, instead of walking into the campus grounds, take the side street along which the 69 bus runs, and you'll see a little farm on the side of the "hill".

Found this thread because I was wondering whether the milk they sell in these machines are pasteurized. I guess I ought to boil it first thing when I get back, but i want to try it fresh too! Just not sure if it's safe?

Edit: Sorry found this thread about the Milchautomats and they also mentioned the Honggerberg farm: Milchautomat
I guess I need to read the poster next to the machine more closely next time and I'll find out if it's raw or pasteurized.

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OK sold. I live in central Zurich. Please google map me my nearest raw milk dispenser. I will bring a plastic cup and some lindt drinking chocolate flakes
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  #36  
Old 01.11.2010, 19:04
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Re: Raw Milk

Not pasteurized - that's why they call it 'raw'.

And it's not only safe, it's delicious! YMMV.
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  #37  
Old 01.11.2010, 19:13
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Re: Raw Milk

And am I reading correctly that I can't buy this at a supemarket/shop but need to somehow treck out of Basil to find a farm which sells raw milk?

I'd like to try it, but I'm lazy. I don't know which will win out.
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  #38  
Old 01.11.2010, 20:14
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Re: Raw Milk

Raw milk, yum yum!

I don't know of any dispensaries in Basel itself, but there are quite a few just outside town. I know of ones in Aesch, Ettingen, Mariastein, and Schönenbuch but I've passed others while lost in the hills and didn't jot down the village names.

The principle is always the same. In goes your 1Fr, out comes a liter or so of fresh cool unpasteurized cow milk. YUM. Some places provide bottles, others don't.

The taste is remarkably different from the stuff you get at the supermarket. The milk taste is stronger, which makes it actually palatable to drink by itself, or for using in cooking (gratins!). It's not very good at all for putting in your coffee though.
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  #39  
Old 01.11.2010, 20:19
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Re: Raw Milk

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Yep. There's a farm right down the road from us with a dispenser, the milk is fantastic and I swear I feel better for days after drinking it. Worth seeking out a local source .
I'm curious ... do you (or any other RM drinkers) do anything with the milk, prior to drink, or is what you are drinking, straight from the udder ... no heating for example.

The information published here http://www.realrawmilkfacts.com/ makes interesting reading.

Only last week, my girlfriend and I were walking through a farm and noticed that you could buy R.Milk. I said what a great idea, but then my GF insisted that we heat it first ... as this is what granny always did.
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Old 01.11.2010, 20:37
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Re: Raw Milk

We've been drinking raw milk from an automat at a nearby farm for the past 5 years, never heated it, always drunk / used as it comes out of the machine. Not only does it taste so much better than shop bought milk, but we (family of 3) have never been ill from the milk, and our son who used to get migraines fropm dairy products seems to be able to drink it without any problems.
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