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  #161  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:29
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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I find all these references to "A-Listers" and "High-rollers" a bit depressing.

None of us is more important than anyone else. It doesn't matter whether a member has made 20 000 posts or 3 posts - we're all equal members of a forum spread across the whole of Switzerland and beyond.

So what if one or two prolific posters decide to leave? They will be replaced. None of us is expendible. None of us is that special.

This was the point I was trying to make in the Drinks thread yesterday, which I obviously struggled to express properly. The forum belongs to all of us, whether we live in Zurich or Geneva, whether we joined in 2005 or 2011, whether we have organised 100 events or none, whether we have 100 rep points or none, whether we post every day or once every two years.

Let's not elevate some members to a status they don't really deserve, and let's not belittle the contribution of the quieter members either.

The EF will continue as it always has. That there are alternatives for those who seek them doesn't make any difference to that.
My thoughts exactly, but I could never express it so eloquently.

One thing that continuously upsets me on the EF are personal attacks and aggression directed at some members. We split hairs discussing the nuances of “offensive” items of vocabulary, but we accept that it is OK for some members to abuse others. There are so many hurtful posts I would like to see deleted, but they are tolerated.
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  #162  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:32
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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One thing that does strike me as strange though, is how you can't name another forum on here. It all seems very "high school", no?
"If you even mention their name, I won't be your friend any more!"
True, it does seem a bit petty, but I shouldn't imagine Migros would be very happy if a small grocery store started handing out flyers in their car park, would they?

Commerce is commerce, and the EF is a commercial forum.
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  #163  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:41
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

Phew, I am exhausted from all this, I will take a little break then come.

I found "the other forum" that nearly killed me.
  #164  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:44
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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True, it does seem a bit petty, but I shouldn't imagine Migros would be very happy if a small grocery store started handing out flyers in their car park, would they?

Commerce is commerce, and the EF is a commercial forum.
Fair point, & I see exactly what you mean, don't get me wrong. I'm not sure if many people are aware of "Gloria Jeans Coffees"? It's kinda like the starbucks of Australia, but has been very successfully spreading throughout the rest of the world... Anyway, I was in a meeting where the owner was a guest speaker, & he said what he tells all of his franchisees is:
"It doesn't matter if competition opens up directly in front of your store, you keep your focus on your job, and your store. Continually improve your store, and you will have the customers to show it. Focus on the competition, and the customers will see that and do the same."

I guess what I'm saying to EF is, who cares what the others are doing, or if people are talking about it. You're doing a great job here! Keep doing that great job, and people will keep giving you business (or stay...you know what I mean).

I think it's the fact that there has been SO much secrecy about this other forum that has in return made so many people search for it, & are interested in knowing what it's all about.

Again, just my thoughts.
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  #165  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:48
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

I dunno I go away for a week and nations ecconomies crumble, England are out of the RWC, Scotland are out of the Euros' (hardly noteworthy or rare), my cars worth 5k less than it was before I went away... and Ecco's gone from here.... It's like Emmerdale with fondue!
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  #166  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:50
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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Hit #5, Mimi, you're heading rapidly towards those 15 minutes of fame ...
Feel free to edit it if you think it's sailing too close to the wind. I think it is no more obvious than the mention of cheesy forums

Maybe that holiday I considered for myself will now be imposed....
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  #167  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:52
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

Woah. This all so deja-vu.

We'll be seeing a film about all this in 5 years time...
  #168  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:53
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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Woah. This all so deja-vu.

We'll be seeing a film about all this in 5 years time...
Was thinking the same thing lol
  #169  
Old 13.10.2011, 15:59
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Re: Forum promotions / Expansion of the moderation team

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I consider Economisto my friend , and believe I am privvy to information that EB does not have. In this respect, the issues raised by EB above appear to me to be nothing more than a cynical bitter attack on Economisto. Unjustified and wholly unprofessional. It is a shameful attempt at character assassination, legally dubious and a betrayal.
Quite frankly, from what I know of Economisto - and although I've not met him, we have exchanged emails - he'll have already shrugged it off. He's got a tough skin.
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  #170  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:08
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Re: Forum promotions / Expansion of the moderation team

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Quite frankly, from what I know of Economisto - and although I've not met him, we have exchanged emails - he'll have already shrugged it off. He's got a tough skin.

  #171  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:13
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

This forum has survived far worse than this. Most of you have not been here long enough to see several generations of users come and go. With growth comes change.

There was a time when this forum nearly imploded, properly. It has gone on and grown and changed and grown some more. It will remain that way. It has a business model behind it that, like it or not will put its chances of survival far ahead of any other casual forum.

The biggest loss to this forum is that the quality was allowed to become drowned out on account of the page impressions that mindless drivel generates given that this forum is now monetised with advertising.

The real question of ownership of content means nothing to your mindless drivel or photo albums or cries for rep or free beer, instead it is about who owns the valuable information. If there is one contributor who should rightly ask as to the ownership of his contributions, it's someone like Richard, but I imagine that he's got better things to do. The real information is becoming outdated and already there are more focussed places on the internet to find it. This forum started because it was hard to find the information needed to move and settle into Switzerland, this is no longer the case. So, there is room for change here and it's more community based.

So, move on or HTFU. Your leaving or staying will be of no consequence. More of you will come, it has been built that way. Not by Editor Bob or Paul or Economisto or Dougal's Breakfast, but by Mark Fyvie and his original team of moderators who are ultimately to blame for getting this forum into the hands of The Local.

To think that you can run a forum with any significant impact in a casual manner and without a business model is naive.
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  #172  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:32
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

I'm not sure what the mandate is of EF or to what extent the direction given by the mods is from The Local. I hope at least some good will come out of the recent events and the chat with Paul will help to clarify the approach that EF is taking and then we can see whether we agree with that, or whether another forum has a better direction.

I guess there could be room for other forums, but it is crowded now: EF, StC, Economisto's forum and I guess maybe you can include Facebook too. StC has more of a chatty feel, I'm not sure what niche the new forum will take. I guess there could be room, but I think it will be hard for any forum to succeed against a large established forum like EF.
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  #173  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:40
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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I find all these references to "A-Listers" and "High-rollers" a bit depressing.
Agreed. But it's not nearly as bad as some mods on here constantly referring to members as "flouncers" or "divas". If EF is a commercial venture now, they need to stick to rule #1. Don't insult your customers.

I'll try out the non-commercial opportunity to talk in English and then report back.
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  #174  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:41
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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Agreed. But it's not nearly as bad as some mods on here constantly referring to members as "flouncers" or "divas". If EF is a commercial venture now, they need to stick to rule #1. Don't insult your customers.

I'll try out the non-commercial opportunity to talk in English and then report back.
You are not the customer. The advertisers are the customers. We are more like hamsters, fodder, consumers etc.
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  #175  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:43
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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Agreed. But it's not nearly as bad as some mods on here constantly referring to members as "flouncers" or "divas".
And "posters of noise that wouldn't have been acceptable back in the day".
  #176  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:46
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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The advertisers are the customers. We are more like hamsters, fodder, consumers etc.
Ah that's why
  #177  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:52
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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This forum has survived far worse than this. Most of you have not been here long enough to see several generations of users come and go. With growth comes change.

There was a time when this forum nearly imploded, properly. It has gone on and grown and changed and grown some more. It will remain that way. It has a business model behind it that, like it or not will put its chances of survival far ahead of any other casual forum.

The biggest loss to this forum is that the quality was allowed to become drowned out on account of the page impressions that mindless drivel generates given that this forum is now monetised with advertising.

The real question of ownership of content means nothing to your mindless drivel or photo albums or cries for rep or free beer, instead it is about who owns the valuable information. If there is one contributor who should rightly ask as to the ownership of his contributions, it's someone like Richard, but I imagine that he's got better things to do. The real information is becoming outdated and already there are more focussed places on the internet to find it. This forum started because it was hard to find the information needed to move and settle into Switzerland, this is no longer the case. So, there is room for change here and it's more community based.

So, move on or HTFU. Your leaving or staying will be of no consequence. More of you will come, it has been built that way. Not by Editor Bob or Paul or Economisto or Dougal's Breakfast, but by Mark Fyvie and his original team of moderators who are ultimately to blame for getting this forum into the hands of The Local.

To think that you can run a forum with any significant impact in a casual manner and without a business model is naive.
You're right. Although it seems like I have no life with the amount of time I spend on here, I actually spend/spent even more time on other forums

A community based forum doesn't really need a strong business model - just someone to pay the bills (which can easily be met by putting a few ads on it). One of the forums I was on was owned by a guy who fell to alcoholism and stopped paying the bills. We tried to help the guy how we could, but in the end, we contacted the outsourced forum provider and paid the hosting for him (he still took the ad revenue).

In the end, he did a deal and sold the domain name to another rival forum and that was the end of it.

But it did get me thinking about the different ways forums can be run. Having a for-profit owner is not necessarily a bad thing and in fact, I think that having one that is not involved in the day to day politics (bitching) can be a strength.
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  #178  
Old 13.10.2011, 16:55
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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But it did get me thinking about the different ways forums can be run. Having a for-profit owner is not necessarily a bad thing and in fact, I think that having one that is not involved in the day to day politics (bitching) can be a strength.
I also think it could be a strength, as long as his interface with the members is visible and approachable. Which is so far the complain of some here.
  #179  
Old 13.10.2011, 17:02
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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You are not the customer. The advertisers are the customers. We are more like hamsters, fodder, consumers etc.
Exactly. Be a member on your terms and be aware of it.

On the surface here, it seems there is a gap between EB and the mod team. But of course it might be that, in the background, they're working together well.

In the end, it's just a forum. You can stay and be part of it, you can leave and be a part of something else, you can do both. Up to you.
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  #180  
Old 13.10.2011, 17:20
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Re: Thread split following economisto's removal

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....... original team of moderators who are ultimately to blame for getting this forum into the hands of The Local.
That is absolute bollocks. We had no influence in the matter - it was a private transaction between the then owners and the new owners.
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