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  #21  
Old 17.03.2011, 20:11
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

I remember almost getting my teeth knocked out by an American marine (big laddie).
We were in Canada on Detachment and there were a few USMC guys there and they were totally genuine and great company in the bar. I offered one guy a 'fag' and he got up to knock me out until one of his mates told him what I meant. Was ok though he bought the next few rounds
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  #22  
Old 17.03.2011, 22:14
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

So this thread did pick up?
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The implication of replacing jerk with either the word I object to OR the word you wish to use makes it as those things are bad and hence, the offensive nature of the substitution.

Better just to say jerk, no? (Personally, although gross, I prefer the term "douche" as it is similar to the sound effect my brother and his friends would make when miming hitting someone - sometimes exactly what I would love to do to jerks. )
I would rather not say jerk, as on principle i would not like to censor myself to not hurt the "sensibility" of others in the sea of internet. It's not hate speech and it is certainly not degrading anyone so I don't see what the guy got all butthurt about.

just to prove my point. my CoD clan tag is F4gs. and I am certainly not gay.

it is hilarious though, when people start yelling at us because of that. And it is even more hilarious (and awesomer) when we win the match and end up yelling back " fags on top, fags on top" oohhh it pissess people offf!!!!



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When written down, none of these clues exist. What may be intended as a harmless comment or an in-joke could easily cause offence among others, especially in a public forum.

.
Agreed, but you know, it IS the internet, and internet slang is part of it. so, get with the program. My original contention is that I should not cater to other people's biggotry.

exhibit A: Niggardly

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In canada, the Dire Straits hit "Money For Nothing" was banned recently because of "fagg0t". A 1985 hit banned in 2011! Only in canada.
I guess they don't want their MTV. cartoon network banned speedy gonzalez, as it was racially tainted and bias against mexicans. Interesting point is that most mexicans that grew up with it actually loved the little dude and petition to bring him back.

I don't mind with the wetback jokes and whatever, there is a slight difference between jokes and stigmatization AND hate speech. big one. as I said (and thanks mimi for claryfing) the constant used of the "no homo" seemed far worst to me than f4g
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Last edited by Ouchboy; 17.03.2011 at 22:38.
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  #23  
Old 17.03.2011, 22:31
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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Not long after I joined the forum, I reported a post (and have since actually complained within a thread) about people using the "t-word" - it was allowed to stand as in the UK (apparently) it is used to replace the term "jerk."

Instead of this, "That guy is such a jerk, who does he think he is, sticking his muddy feet on the tram seats?" instead would be "That guy is such a twat..." and among the gamer set would be "That guy is such a fag..." None of it is nice, why condone it at all?

The implication of replacing jerk with either the word I object to OR the word you wish to use makes it as those things are bad and hence, the offensive nature of the substitution.

Better just to say jerk, no? (Personally, although gross, I prefer the term "douche" as it is similar to the sound effect my brother and his friends would make when miming hitting someone - sometimes exactly what I would love to do to jerks. )
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I condone the use of the word 'Douche', 'Douchebag' and 'Douchebaggery' to best define such persons and their actions.
I prefer the words tw@t or t!t for jerks. Why does a word insult you so much? It's only a word. Why is the word Vagina ok to say but ©unt is somehow insulting? Get over it they are just words.

Anyone hear pinks latest song? Played on the radio every day... the lyrics.... "you're f-ucking perfect".

The word sh!t is used fairly regularly on Irish radio these days. Language evolves, new words get added, meanings change, but at the end of the day they are only words.

Last edited by Eire; 17.03.2011 at 22:42.
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  #24  
Old 17.03.2011, 22:42
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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Not long after I joined the forum, I reported a post (and have since actually complained within a thread) about people using the "t-word" - it was allowed to stand as in the UK (apparently) it is used to replace the term "jerk."
Its not so much a 'replacement' but a word we use to mean what you mean by Jerk. Does that make sense? Jerk is not a word that is used in the UK. I always thought it came from a cross between twit and prat (prat being another word that gets used alot to mean an idiot. Tbh I may be a little naive but didn't realize it was an offensive word in other countries.
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  #25  
Old 17.03.2011, 22:54
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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Same can be said for the Mel Brooks films "Blazing Saddles", and "History of the world Part I". Or Even Monty Pythons "LIfe of Brian". In my opinion, all classic movies, but are very "politically incorrect".
I'm black, and I liked Blazzing Saddle, I also like the 1970's Blaxplotation film "Boss N----r", I often joke with my fiancee I will run for office on the SVP ticket (list) under the name "Chief N----r (German word)" with the statement..."Chief N----r says it's time for the Muslims to leave"... No I'm not Islamaphobic, our neigobors are from Tunisia and very cool, I just think it is funny that a black man, an obvious minority and a foreigner might be able to get away with making anti-Muslim statements a white Swiss person could not.

Seriously though...I think that it matters how it is used. I listen to Kanye West and Common, they both use the "n-word", Eminem uses the "F word" all the time, but is friends with Elton John!!

As the OP stated, if you are calling a homosexual a "filthy f----t", that is different then telling an idiot you are acting like a "f-word"...just like Kanye West using the word to talk about his friend Jay-Z is different then a Skinhead calling me a "n----r" on the street.

I don't know how the court of law is in much of continental Europe, but our system in the U.S. considers "intent" strongly. It gets tricky though because you have people using these words to be offensive, but pretend like they are not trying to be offensive...that is a fine line. So many people want to ban them completely. I guess I see both sides, but in general, I am for freedom of speech.

As a member of a visible minority, I have always felt as Malcolm X on this.

Malcolm X said: "I have more respect for a man who lets me know where he stands, even if he's wrong. Than the one who comes up like an angel and is nothing but a devil."
  • Oxford Union Debate (December 3, 1964)

So I seriously disagree with many laws in Europe that ban "Holocaust denial". I'm black and I would give skinheads a permit to march through my town, if I had to (if I was mayor) because I think they have this right, just like I have the right to counter-protest or find out who they are, publish their names in the paper and pictures. Freedom of speech should be an inalienable human right, not based on it's utility (what you will do with it).
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  #26  
Old 18.03.2011, 01:24
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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I remember almost getting my teeth knocked out by an American marine (big laddie).
We were in Canada on Detachment and there were a few USMC guys there and they were totally genuine and great company in the bar. I offered one guy a 'fag' and he got up to knock me out until one of his mates told him what I meant. Was ok though he bought the next few rounds
@breagh - Going off topic briefly. For some reason, up until reading this post and, yes, in spite of your avatar, I thought you were female.

Soooooo sorry about that dude.

Last edited by ximix; 18.03.2011 at 03:20. Reason: word fix
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  #27  
Old 18.03.2011, 06:45
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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...
exhibit A: Niggardly
...
Nitty-gritty is an other one.

Here's some more f@gg0ts.

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  #28  
Old 18.03.2011, 09:21
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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@breagh - Going off topic briefly. For some reason, up until reading this post and, yes, in spite of your avatar, I thought you were female.

Soooooo sorry about that dude.


Wooooooow, wait a minute! Am I too nice or something ? [must harden up more for the EF]
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  #29  
Old 18.03.2011, 10:21
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

We should make the term "EF'er" an insult
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  #30  
Old 18.03.2011, 10:29
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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Ok

In days of old when Knights were bold and maidens wore steel underpants, they tried to conduct a population census. In order to control the counting a little better (which initially took a few years to carry out) couples who were married had to apply to the royal court for a license to procreate. This if granted was displayed over the door of a couples house to inform the census takers that if there was suddenly a new baby around they would be able to add a number to their list.

This license being of royal decree carried the words Fornication Under Consent of the King.

Now you all are a smart bunch I have no reason to doubt that but in case you can't see it, take the first letters of the words in the license title and make an anagram.

There you are, a perfect explanation of a word which has changed over the years to become 'rude' and 'forbidden' to use. I blame the Victorian standard myself but they weren't as squeaky clean as they made out either but that's for another day.




Smart enough to spot an urban legend.

(I'm thinking this was a joke anyway)
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  #31  
Old 18.03.2011, 10:37
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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people using the "t-word" - it was allowed to stand as in the UK (apparently) it is used to replace the term "jerk."
I'd say "Twat" was deemed offensive in UK too. More so in the North. In the south it seems to be milder (they said it on Radio One once), like "twit".

I'd say the nearest English replacement would be "Wanker". Pretty much the same meaning too, if I understand the US word correctly.





Used to work with a lovely lady who called people "berk" without realising its meaning...
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  #32  
Old 18.03.2011, 11:24
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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I'd say "Twat" was deemed offensive in UK too. More so in the North. In the south it seems to be milder (they said it on Radio One once), like "twit".

I'd say the nearest English replacement would be "Wanker". Pretty much the same meaning too, if I understand the US word correctly.





Used to work with a lovely lady who called people "berk" without realising its meaning...
Best watch what I say when I'm up North then. Such a shame...tw*t is my favourite word.
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  #33  
Old 18.03.2011, 11:25
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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Best watch what I say when I'm up North then. Such a shame...tw*t is my favourite word.
My mother will wash out your mouth with soap and water.
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  #34  
Old 18.03.2011, 14:27
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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Wooooooow, wait a minute! Am I too nice or something ? [must harden up more for the EF]
You're fine just as you are dude.

Was just me having an avatar vs comments posted mental fuNk (). All sorted now with that US marine incident earlier post.
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  #35  
Old 19.03.2011, 13:54
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

I remember this add got a lot of flak because of the title...

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  #36  
Old 19.03.2011, 14:02
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

using "faggot" to replace "douchebag", or using "gay" to imply "stupid", and "No homo" which I'm still trying to figure out, all come from the same hateful source, which is to imply that the subject of such a label is somehow abnormal, by equating them to a homosexual.

I abhor these terms when used in such ways. Advocates call it "evolution of language" but that's simply a rouse. If the word was "nigger" or "jew" they'd say "but it doesn't mean that anymore!" It is still wrong.

The bottom line is that, though the use of these insults (playful as it were in South Park, or joking amongst friends) may not be hurtful to whom (person) or what (object, situation) it is applied, it can be deeply injurious to minorities who witness it.

Last edited by KeinFranzösisch; 19.03.2011 at 14:32. Reason: clarification
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  #37  
Old 19.03.2011, 14:08
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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The bottom line is that, though the use in these contexts may not be hurtful to whom or what it is applied, it is deeply injurious to those who have to witness it.
So you ARE advocating that you should cater to other people's ignorance and bias when speaking.

Like in said cases of niggardly, tar baby or watter buffalo. As it is "injurious" to the witnesses.
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  #38  
Old 19.03.2011, 14:33
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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So you ARE advocating that you should cater to other people's ignorance and bias when speaking.

Like in said cases of niggardly, tar baby or watter buffalo. As it is "injurious" to the witnesses.
I don't know how you got that from what I wrote, but I went back and made some clarifications.
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  #39  
Old 09.05.2011, 13:45
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

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  #40  
Old 09.05.2011, 14:00
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Re: the F word: hopefully a serious discussion will ensue...

Hey there Ouchboy, I disagree with the above cartoon, and although I'm the world's most super deluxe South Park fan, I do disagree with that episode.

Should we cater to the ignorance of others? Yeah. A bit, anyway. Also, there's a spot of logic to it (as if we really required any).

"Hey, don't call me a dirty Jew - that's anti Semitic!".

"Ha! That's where you're wrong. Language has evolved. Right now, it means anyone who's miserly, greedy and with a big nose. It has nothing to do with actual Jews, irrespective of their cleanliness."

Is he being anti-Semitic, even though he is insulting, in this case, an Irish Catholic? Yes, of course. He is using a term of racial hate to express the pejorative nature of something else. If anything, it becomes even more offensive.

What South Park is really saying is that we find homosexuals so disgusting that the pejorative word used to describe them has now evolved to become a pejorative word to describe a whole variety of things.

Now how offensive is that?
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