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Old 20.07.2011, 18:13
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Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

They have to measure it again...


(I tend to agree with the Chinese though...)
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Old 20.07.2011, 18:22
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

I think you should skip the content of your post and just keep the thread title.
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  #3  
Old 20.07.2011, 18:28
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

Now I am confused: did the US GPS survey measure 8'850 meters using laser technology, i.e. snow height, or RADAR i.e. rock height?
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Old 20.07.2011, 18:42
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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Now I am confused: did the US GPS survey measure 8'850 meters using laser technology, i.e. snow height, or RADAR i.e. rock height?
Assuming GPS was placed at the top of the Mountain, so I would say snow height. I don't think GPS encompasses either Radar or Laser, rather trilateration based on position of the observer and known satellites. Something or someone would have to be on top of the mountain...on top of the snow...
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Old 20.07.2011, 18:47
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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Assuming GPS was placed at the top of the Mountain, so I would say snow height. I don't think GPS encompasses either Radar or Laser, rather trilateration based on position of the observer and known satellites. Something or someone would have to be on top of the mountain...on top of the snow...
Yeah...trilateration with 4 satellites so....um...quadlateration
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Old 20.07.2011, 18:49
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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Yeah...trilateration with 4 satellites so....um...quadlateration
You use the 3 strongest signals from an array of 12 Satellites methinks... ?
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Old 20.07.2011, 19:01
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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You use the 3 strongest signals from an array of 12 Satellites methinks... ?
Geometry's not yer strong suit, is it?
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Old 20.07.2011, 19:23
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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Geometry's not yer strong suit, is it?
That's a leading question...

I feel a lesson coming on here...

I *thought* you measured the distance from 3 (or more) Satellites and plotted them on the surface using intersections...Obviously time comes into play when measuring your actual distance (height on Everest) from the Satellite but... Am I digging a hole here ?
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Old 21.07.2011, 00:57
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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Am I digging a hole here ?
Yes. Very much so.
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Old 21.07.2011, 09:31
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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Yes. Very much so.
*Puts head back in the stocks*

Enlighten me
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Old 21.07.2011, 09:41
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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*Puts head back in the stocks*

Enlighten me
the mathematics of GPS is actually quite interesting as it relies not only on basic trigonometry, but also general relativity and special relativity.

http://www.astronomy.ohio-state.edu/...Unit5/gps.html
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Old 21.07.2011, 09:43
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

So my TomTom is actually a time travelling machine ?
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Old 21.07.2011, 12:26
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

A "normal" GPS system is based on a constellation of SVs, of which a minimum of 4 visible and functional is required for a unique fix (less than 4 such is a service outage for that place/time, and more than 4 allows the receiver to pick the relatively best-placed satellites that give the most accurate solution; signal strength plays very little part in this, the signal is either useable or it isn't).

GPS also uses an idealised/simplified model of the shape of the earth called a geoid (an example geoid is line 5 in the picture, where real life refuses to play along with it along line 4):

Attachment 29898

So it's pretttttty obvious from thisthat you can't just bang your TomTom down on top of Everest and read off the altitude.

So how are they going to go it? By establishing a series of reference points (think of them as the equivalent of triangulation points as in traditional surveying) and using a Phase Shift Differential technique that will be accurate enough to make the whole exercise worthwhile (or at least worthwhile to them, if not to the rest of us ).

Effectively, it's close to going back to good old-fashioned surveying (albeit using a 21stC space-based equivalent of theodolites), but still requiring a helluvalot of grunt-work on the ground, hence the two-year timescale to do a meaningful measurement.

Last edited by weejeem; 14.10.2011 at 15:03.
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Old 21.07.2011, 12:32
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

so wait, they are going to risk people's life just to settle a 4m difference?
Really?
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Old 21.07.2011, 12:45
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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I think you should skip the content of your post and just keep the thread title.
exactly what I thought just now too ...

STOP misleading us like that UTH.
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Old 21.07.2011, 13:13
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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I think you should skip the content of your post and just keep the thread title.
exactly what I thought just now too ...
Of course, the cold might very well make it smaller
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Old 21.07.2011, 13:19
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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They have to measure it again...


(I tend to agree with the Chinese though...)
Mountain height is geological. Snow height is meteorological. How do you measure snow and say it is the mountain? Silly Nepalese.
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Old 21.07.2011, 13:27
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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Mountain height is geological. Snow height is meteorological. How do you measure snow and say it is the mountain? Silly Nepalese.

Far more simpler to the Nepalese...Stand on top of the mountain and measure how high your feet are above sea level.

(Interesting off topic question, How deep is an ocean, do you measure at the peek or the trough of a wave to the ocean bed?)
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Old 21.07.2011, 13:44
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

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(Interesting off topic question, How deep is an ocean, do you measure at the peek or the trough of a wave to the ocean bed?)
Neither. From Chart Datum, which for enlightened peoples is LAT (Lowest Astronomical Tide), and for americans is MLLW (Mean Lower Low Water).

HTH
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Old 21.07.2011, 13:49
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Re: Blimey darling, just when you thought it couldn't get any bigger...

weejem????

NSFW
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