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  #21  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:18
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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So, as I am not expected to know which dogs are dangerous, and which aren't (I keep hearing on here that it's not the breeds but the owners), if any dog, off the leash, approaches one of my children and gets near their face, I'm going to assume that it's going to bite and act accordingly, and quickly.

How should I do that? A kick in the throat, or ribs, or something else?

The attack on the news presenter was extremely fast so telling the owner to control their dog is not a viable option.

I like dogs but I do not understand the thinking of some dog owners (especially some on here) when it's always someone else's fault.

I've been bitten here. My kids have been bitten. All in unprovoked attacks.
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If a stranger comes and sticks there face into yours in the pub (for instance) what you going to do??

All the warnings where there, the people involved didn't pick up on them, what's the dog to do??

It's not dog lovers defending the dog either, its people with dogs, who know dogs, just telling it like it is
Perhaps one of you who knows dogs can respond to my post then. I don't speak dog. I don't like being bitten. My children don't like being bitten either.
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  #22  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:19
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Yes, and it was humans who created it in the first place, and ensured that it was big and strong with huge teeth.
Yes - to fulfill their needs of getting an animal to help them hunt! Absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Besides helping humans retrieve bigger game, the Dogo Argentino is also trained for search and rescue, military and police work.

Will you be singing the same tune if a Dogo rescued a child out of the water, by using his big strong, and huge teeth?

Sadly, no one can look past the fact that he bit the woman. Why not ask "Why did the dog bite her?" rather than go along with the hysteria?

Last edited by summerrain; 10.02.2012 at 13:49. Reason: grammoor
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  #23  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:23
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Yes - to fulfill their needs of getting an animal to help them hunt! Absolutely nothing wrong with that.
No, not at all. But I don't think the dog in question was being used in that capacity, do you?

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Sadly, no one can look past the fact that he bit the woman. Why not ask "Why did the dog bite her?" rather than go along with the hysteria?
A perfectly valid question.

The point being made by the OP, however, was that many people seemed to be blaming the presenter, and generating some hysteria in that direction. Sadly it seems to have been echoed here to some extent too.
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  #24  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:24
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Perhaps one of you who knows dogs can respond to my post then. I don't speak dog. I don't like being bitten. My children don't like being bitten either.

sorry if its way off base, but you sound like you are scared of dogs, and you have passed that onto your kids, if a dog picks up on that and thinks you are weak and it can dominate you then it will, and you'll get bitten. again, not the dogs fault, the owners should have more control over them.

as with most things in life, act like a victim and you'll become one.
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  #25  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:25
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

To go back to the initial question, but removing it a bit from this particular case. It does seem to me, as a total dog lover, that some people have lost the fundamental difference between a dog being a dog, and a dog becoming a surrogate human. Dogs need to know their place in the pecking order- they need to know who is boss. A dog that loses that clear position can quickly become a dangerous dog.

In this case - this dog should have NEVER ever been put into a stressful TV interview before having firmly settled with its new owner and been trained properly. And of course the interviewer should have been briefed properly on how to handle the dog. Experienced dog owners know about direct eye contact and face to face - others like the woman, do not. Tragic, for both. I do hope the dog will not have to suffer the consequences of the stupidity of the handlers - who presumably know what to avoid and should have briefed her and kept a much closer eye on what was happening (and not been there int he first place!).
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  #26  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:26
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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No, not at all. But I don't think the dog in question was being used in that capacity, do you?


A perfectly valid question.

The point being made by the OP, however, was that many people seemed to be blaming the presenter, and generating some hysteria in that direction. Sadly it seems to have been echoed here to some extent too.

you jump in front of a car, whose to blame? you, the car driver, Ford - for making the car, all car drivers, all car manufactures????
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  #27  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:27
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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That's what I thought.

So, as I am not expected to know which dogs are dangerous, and which aren't (I keep hearing on here that it's not the breeds but the owners), if any dog, off the leash, approaches one of my children and gets near their face, I'm going to assume that it's going to bite and act accordingly, and quickly.

How should I do that? A kick in the throat, or ribs, or something else?

The attack on the news presenter was extremely fast so telling the owner to control their dog is not a viable option.

I like dogs but I do not understand the thinking of some dog owners (especially some on here) when it's always someone else's fault.

I've been bitten here. My kids have been bitten. All in unprovoked attacks.
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Perhaps one of you who knows dogs can respond to my post then. I don't speak dog. I don't like being bitten. My children don't like being bitten either.
Watching the video, the dog was already nervous (look out for the panting - thats not happy panting, its anxiety - and licking of its lips: its not hungry. Its unsure) The handler was reinforcing its state of mind by stroking its head.

Look at how the dog tried turning away the first time. He then bared his teeth for a split second when her face got too close:



Even as a dog owner, I sometimes miss the cues that my dog gives out but there are always the obvious ones: tail between legs: scared, ears perked up, stiff stance: alert etc etc.

I am sorry you and your children have had unpleasant experiences with dogs here. But without knowing the details of what happened, it really isnt fair to say that its unprovoked - even if its unintentionally.
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  #28  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:29
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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To go back to the initial question, but removing it a bit from this particular case. It does seem to me, as a total dog lover, that some people have lost the fundamental difference between a dog being a dog, and a dog becoming a surrogate human. Dogs need to know their place in the pecking order- they need to know who is boss. A dog that loses that clear position can quickly become a dangerous dog.

In this case - this dog should have NEVER ever been put into a stressful TV interview before having firmly settled with its new owner and been trained properly. And of course the interviewer should have been briefed properly on how to handle the dog. Experienced dog owners know about direct eye contact and face to face - others like the woman, do not. Tragic, for both. I do hope the dog will not have to suffer the consequences of the stupidity of the handlers - who presumably know what to avoid and should have briefed her and kept a much closer eye on what was happening (and not been there int he first place!).
A fine example of an intelligent and balanced post. Thank you very much.
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  #29  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:33
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Perhaps one of you who knows dogs can respond to my post then. I don't speak dog. I don't like being bitten. My children don't like being bitten either.
I tried to, see earlier post
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  #30  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:40
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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No, not at all. But I don't think the dog in question was being used in that capacity, do you?
I'll have to find the link again but I did read that the dog in question was chasing a coyote whilst out hunting with its owner, when it fell into the pond and had to be rescued - hence the purpose of the program: to reunite him with his rescuers.

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A perfectly valid question.

The point being made by the OP, however, was that many people seemed to be blaming the presenter, and generating some hysteria in that direction. Sadly it seems to have been echoed here to some extent too.
Maybe because its simply common sense not to put your face too close to a dog that you arent familiar with?
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  #31  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:49
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

The media has a huge part to play in this whole "fighting dog" bullsh!t. If mistreated a labrador can be a "fighting dog" and if treated well a pitbull can be a loving family pet. Just because a dog was bred to do something hundreds of years ago it doesn't mean that breeding needs to be brought out. Nature Vs Nurture.

I've lived with pitbull and she was one of the most docile dogs I've ever met. The problem is nearly always the humans who bring the dog up to be aggressive or they don't take care of what the dog is feeling. Dogs are very emotional and it pays to take time to figure out what their emotions say. Dogs who yawn, put their ears back, lick their noses or blink repeatedly are stressed. Most humans miss that and then wonder why a stressed dog starts to growl at them.

Also, did you ever look at how dogs approach each other? The never do it head on. Approaching head on in the dog world is an act of aggression, then just go straight to a dog and start poking and prodding them.

People should learn a bit about dogs before dismissing them as evil creatures. Dogs (even so called "fighting dogs" are by nature friendly and loyal. It's humans who mess them up.
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  #32  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:49
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Perhaps one of you who knows dogs can respond to my post then. I don't speak dog. I don't like being bitten. My children don't like being bitten either.
You can also try educating your kids on precautions around dogs.

I have walked my dog various times to encounter children who upon sight start screaming hysterically when the dog hasn't even seen them. This alerts the dog and excites or startles it. Of course, there is an argument for a dog to be trained not to react in these circumstances but then that argument can work both ways IMO
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  #33  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:54
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

Only if you are experienced with dogs - and she obviously was not, and had not been briefed properly. The experienced handlers should have picked up the vibes and body language straightaway and dealt with it.


Our elderly rescue dog comes with a lot of baggage, and can react if a child puts his/her face too close. So we always talk to children we meet and explain this, and explain why dogs sometimes react like this. Our grand-children we taught this from very young. Young children need to know that they should never put their head near a dog's, and that they should never make direct eye contact or stroke an unknown dog without first asking the owner if it is OK and with the above in mind. Our dog is never ever left alone with children, but our previous dog was absolutely 100% child safe.
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  #34  
Old 10.02.2012, 13:55
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Maybe because its simply common sense not to put your face too close to a dog that you arent familiar with?
Common sense? No, not unless you've been brought up with dogs and/or been made aware of their possible reactions to you doing so. Which is not 'common' sense.
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  #35  
Old 10.02.2012, 14:01
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

Yes, people should not dismiss dogs as evil creatures and react in that way, I'm with you on that.

I don't agree that "people" should learn about dogs. It is not up to non dog owners to learn all the cues/body language of dogs, why should they? They don't own (or possibly like) dogs, so you cannot expect them to. This is the responsibility of the dog owners. And that is hard enough, being the quick buggers they can be (the dogs, not the owners). They should know when to leash the dog, be able to tell whether the dog can or cannot be approached by strangers (who don't have a clue about dogs), etc, etc.

Although (ok contradicting myself a little here), non dog owners should be explained that it is not too smart to react hysterically when seeing a dog.

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People should learn a bit about dogs before dismissing them as evil creatures. Dogs (even so called "fighting dogs" are by nature friendly and loyal. It's humans who mess them up.

Last edited by E. Neubauten; 10.02.2012 at 14:06. Reason: explanation
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  #36  
Old 10.02.2012, 14:04
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

What happens when you have a roomful of fame-seekers? They become idiots and one gets bit in the face.

I'm not a dog lover but I'm with the dog on this one. If that crazy lady had tried to kiss me, I might have bitten her back too.
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  #37  
Old 10.02.2012, 14:06
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Common sense? No, not unless you've been brought up with dogs and/or been made aware of their possible reactions to you doing so. Which is not 'common' sense.
Really? Were you brought up on a remote desert island and only heard about dogs in last few years?

Shows my ignorance then!
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  #38  
Old 10.02.2012, 14:07
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Common sense? No, not unless you've been brought up with dogs and/or been made aware of their possible reactions to you doing so. Which is not 'common' sense.
Yes it is - as with pretty much any animal. Especially ones you do not know yourself (but even the ones you have spent a lifetime with, because there is no 100% safety).

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What happens when you have a roomful of fame-seekers? They become idiots and one gets bit in the face.

I'm not a dog lover but I'm with the dog on this one. If that crazy lady had tried to kiss me, I might have bitten her back too.
Thank you!
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  #39  
Old 10.02.2012, 14:09
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Common sense? No, not unless you've been brought up with dogs and/or been made aware of their possible reactions to you doing so. Which is not 'common' sense.
Debatable.

Lets remove the dog factor. Wouldnt YOU feel threatened if someone came up to you on the streets, right in your face and asked for directions? Or what if a woman ran up to you on the streets and wanted to snog you? (ok, maybe that isnt the best example..but you get my point)

Humans usually keep a polite distance from strangers. Why not from unfamiliar dogs?
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  #40  
Old 10.02.2012, 14:10
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Re: Is there something wrong with some dog lovers?

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Oh come on, you really can't beleive that? Some breeds are naturally docile and friendly, others are naturally aggressive.
I've raised and shown all breeds of dogs, including "pit bulls", which are the most loveable, laughable clowns I've ever met.

I've only ever been bitten by two breeds of dogs where it was an "attack" bite: one was an English Springer Spaniel. The other was a German Shorthaired Pointer -- both sporting breeds. I've been bitten by Basset Hounds while breaking up fights over food too.

There are some aspects of temperament that are hereditary, but those genetics are available in every breed. You can get a mean ol' French Bulldawg or a pussycat of a Doberman.

So... yes. I really mean it.
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