Do you have a problem with adults piercing a kids ears?

Kids ? Older than 10 may be not if requested, at nappy age, yes. The child must develop a sense of self realisation and want to have ears pierced and understand the consequences and issues.

IIRC, round about about the time that Sir Walter Raleigh was inventing cigarettes, Sir Francis Drake was busy circumcising the world with a 100-foot clipper.

I believe he had more an issue with the seamen than this thread.

When you show me a 50 year old philosopher with "self realisation" I'll start to believe in 10 year olds with same. Seems there's a lofty equine some people need to dismount.

By self realisation I meant a sense of self , maybe a dash of pride or at least an interest in piercing. A 10 year old knows what piercing is , a baby doesn't. Parents that pierce babies ears are treating their offspring as a fashion statement imho.

"treating as a fashion statement" is vastly different than calling it a "sadistic ritual", wouldn't you say? In the article you linked, most the girls were old enough to know what was going on. Just because you are used to the concept of piercing you think its better when in fact lets see, one is parents doing something to their kids to fit in with society and oh parents doing something to their kids to fit in with society.

Sorry, you are confusing me with someone else.

Oops you are right, but my question stands.

How wrong do you want wrong to be ?

Piercing or circumcision?

So what's the consensus now; all babies should have a PA?

I have stated my arguments, in both. As to when and when not they are acceptable. Please clarify again, I am a bit confused by your questions.

i just reread. 2 misread posts=past my bedtime. I was just trying to prove its all in what you are used to. I think both are wrong per se but not to the degree they shouldn't be tolerated.

The thread direction is going a bit off topic isn't it...

Looks like some people don`t like this discussion about this matter.

Where does this way of thinking lead to?
We can talk about this?
Or we should not talk?

Please think about

I think a few more minutes and this topic will be buried because of some reason.
Anyway, i thank to all of those people who have created and run this forum.!

Thank you

ROFL!!!! That did sound funny when you mentioned your brother! My brother is older than me so I have no clue on whether he is or not and I am NOT about to ask either! LOL! The question or topic never came up so I have no clue. But I know for my son I plan to just let him decide if he wants to be circumcised when he grows up.

OMG! Poor baby! I could not finish watching that video and hearing the baby's cries. I don't see how doctors can do that. Poor little thing. I would feel so bad and guilty if I put my kid through that.

I'm not really following the sidetrack into piercing and the use of 'self realisation' it strikes me as a willfull attempt to ignore the points made.

The degree is irrelevant, a prick to draw blood, an ear piercing, slicing off parts of the genetalia, if you did it to a stranger you'd be comitting assault. As a parent you have the responsibility to look after the childs well being, that doesn't mean you own your childs bodies.

Imagine if circumcision was performed not at birth but at 8, on your boys birthday he is held down on a table while body parts are cut off without anaesthetic. I imagine his screams would be harder to ignore when he is old enough to use language. All because (in the absence of medical need) mummy and daddy want him to be in their club.