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-   -   Polarised society:Why? (https://www.englishforum.ch/general-off-topic/299307-polarised-society-why.html)

Flying Kite 26.07.2020 15:10

Polarised society:Why?
 
I did post in some of the threads where people are so polarised that I thought where the multipolar society disappeared as we know in beautiful '70s,'80s, the '90s when you can think wherever you want. Now is only supporters of Trump or anti-Trump, pro-Brexit or anti-Brexit, pandemic believers or anti-pandemic believers. Where are the other useful threads? Can we live without discussing these three problems?

olygirl 26.07.2020 15:21

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
I'd love to respond but after reading your vaccination posts, I'm afraid I'd only be feeding a troll. A pity, really.

Belgianmum 26.07.2020 15:41

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by olygirl (Post 3201618)
I'd love to respond but after reading your vaccination posts, I'm afraid I'd only be feeding a troll. A pity, really.

Could you actually understand those posts? I couldn’t.

olygirl 26.07.2020 16:10

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
I think he meant that society is more divided today than in the 70s, 80s and 90s, with right wing politicians leading the way despite the loud complaints from the center to left wing crowd.

In a way, he's got a point. The US managed to impeach Nixon and Clinton was almost impeached due to his sexual conduct in the office. I can't say why the UK and the US have taken steps backwards in electing politicians who want to undo the past. My theory is that social media has given a greater voice to the right minority, who feed and pander on public fears and then promise to rectify the situation, real or unreal. Perhaps this was all triggered by 9/11.

I also feel the present federal governmental leaders are corrupt with the Republicans more so than the Democrats. Lobbying has encouraged the corruption and has the prize of power over serving the people has become priority. Mitch McConnell would be an example of this.

The loud younger female politicians are making many feel uncomfortable, perhaps because their voices are demanding that people look at themselves and their political standing -- something that many would rather project than actually self-reflect.

Times are changing and the minorities are demanding to be represented equally. I hope a new sweep of younger, more rational politicians will pave the way to better leadership and decision-making in both the UK and the US.

Sorry for the sermon... I think whatever the OP is smoking has been teleported through the internet and into my own nostrils. Like, yeah, baby.

Belgianmum 26.07.2020 16:20

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by olygirl (Post 3201628)
I think he meant that society is more divided today than in the 70s, 80s and 90s, with right wing politicians leading the way despite the loud complaints from the center to left wing crowd.

In a way, he's got a point. The US managed to impeach Nixon and Clinton was almost impeached due to his sexual conduct in the office. I can't say why the UK and the US have taken steps backwards in electing politicians who want to undo the past. My theory is that social media has given a greater voice to the right minority, who feed and pander on public fears and then promise to rectify the situation, real or unreal. Perhaps this was all triggered by 9/11.

I also feel the present federal governmental leaders are corrupt with the Republicans more so than the Democrats. Lobbying has encouraged the corruption and has the prize of power over serving the people has become priority. Mitch McConnell would be an example of this.

The loud younger female politicians are making many feel uncomfortable, perhaps because their voices are demanding that people look at themselves and their political standing -- something that many would rather project than actually self-reflect.

Times are changing and the minorities are demanding to be represented equally. I hope a new sweep of younger, more rational politicians will pave the way to better leadership and decision-making in both the UK and the US.

Sorry for the sermon... I think whatever the OP is smoking has been teleported through the internet and into my own nostrils. Like, yeah, baby.

Sorry, I obviously wasn’t clear and you misunderstood my post.
I was referring to his vaccine posts which were pretty much incomprehensible, I understand this one.

MusicChick 26.07.2020 16:28

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Kite (Post 3201613)
I did post in some of the threads where people are so polarised that I thought where the multipolar society disappeared as we know in beautiful '70s,'80s, the '90s when you can think wherever you want. Now is only supporters of Trump or anti-Trump, pro-Brexit or anti-Brexit, pandemic believers or anti-pandemic believers. Where are the other useful threads? Can we live without discussing these three problems?

I only see some lack of tolerance for other opinions within some strata of people, usually those who overconsume social media. Otherwise people seem the same as the generations before: opinionated and fun. Maybe less likely to keep a healthy distance from issues sometimes. Issues and ideas shouldn't be mistaken for people. You seem to panic a little, I wouldn't.

Guest 26.07.2020 17:16

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
I don't really think this is the case, or at least no more than it has always been.

The big issues you mention tend to bring out the extremes more than the moderates, with social media making it easy to jump on any given bandwagon, so those with strong views will be more vocal than those who don't really care much either way.

On top of that there are a lot of people who deliberately post provocatively, then fall back on "it's just my opinion, of course I'm not trolling", and these bring out many more people who just can't let stupid, nonsensical, false or simply erroneous posts stay there unopposed, so while there may be many people arguing against a Trump defender, for example, it doesn't necessarily meant they're all vehemently anti-Trump.

AbFab 26.07.2020 17:18

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Kite (Post 3201613)
I did post in some of the threads where people are so polarised that I thought where the multipolar society disappeared as we know in beautiful '70s,'80s, the '90s when you can think wherever you want. Now is only supporters of Trump or anti-Trump, pro-Brexit or anti-Brexit, pandemic believers or anti-pandemic believers. Where are the other useful threads? Can we live without discussing these three problems?

„It‘s the internet stupid“ to misquote James Carville.

Unlike the 20th century we can now express our views loudly and anonymously on whatever subject we feel we are world-class experts in...

greenmount 26.07.2020 18:50

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

I don't really think this is the case, or at least no more than it has always been.

The big issues you mention tend to bring out the extremes more than the moderates, with social media making it easy to jump on any given bandwagon, so those with strong views will be more vocal than those who don't really care much either way.

On top of that there are a lot of people who deliberately post provocatively, then fall back on "it's just my opinion, of course I'm not trolling", and these bring out many more people who just can't let stupid, nonsensical, false or simply erroneous posts stay there unopposed, so while there may be many people arguing against a Trump defender, for example, it doesn't necessarily meant they're all vehemently anti-Trump.
This (all of it). I wanted to post something along the line but I don't have your eloquence so thanks.

@OP,

Plenty of other threads, why don't you have a look at those? ;)

Tom1234 26.07.2020 20:17

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

On top of that there are a lot of people who deliberately post provocatively, then fall back on "it's just my opinion, of course I'm not trolling", and these bring out many more people who just can't let stupid, nonsensical, false or simply erroneous posts stay there unopposed, so while there may be many people arguing against a Trump defender, for example, it doesn't necessarily meant they're all vehemently anti-Trump.
I think you're being too nice. I think a lot of these people actually believe the rubbish they post and trolling is far from their mind.

Looking at it another way, if Donald Trump wasn't U.S. President and instead only frequented social media and online forums, he'd probably be banned from most of them for being a troll. He's not a troll he believes in himself and his opinions.

3Wishes 26.07.2020 21:32

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by olygirl (Post 3201628)
...In a way, he's got a point. The US managed to impeach Nixon and Clinton was almost impeached due to his sexual conduct in the office...

Slight correction here. Nixon was not impeached. Congress held impeachment hearings but Nixon resigned and left office before they concluded.

Clinton was impeached by the House on Dec. 19, 1998. However the Senate did not remove him from office. And as you know, he did not resign. ;)

Jim2007 26.07.2020 21:35

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Kite (Post 3201613)
I did post in some of the threads where people are so polarised that I thought where the multipolar society disappeared as we know in beautiful '70s,'80s, the '90s when you can think wherever you want. Now is only supporters of Trump or anti-Trump, pro-Brexit or anti-Brexit, pandemic believers or anti-pandemic believers. Where are the other useful threads? Can we live without discussing these three problems?

I don’t feed the trolls and I have yet to see a substantial post from you.

olygirl 26.07.2020 21:56

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 3Wishes (Post 3201680)
Slight correction here. Nixon was not impeached. Congress held impeachment hearings but Nixon resigned and left office before they concluded.

Clinton was impeached by the House on Dec. 19, 1998. However the Senate did not remove him from office. And as you know, he did not resign. ;)

You're right, of course. I find impeachments rather confusing. Thanks for clearing that up.

Flying Kite 26.07.2020 22:32

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
I just never believed in the mainstream, because it was created through manipulation for the certain needs of our leaders...I see in many of my posts people don't get what I mean because I am not so "eloquent" as others on this forum...I don't have an oratory talent, can't express myself in the words that will make you think differently...but that doesn't stop me to read Schopenhauer, Hegel, Nietzsche, Marx, and not the last the greatest psychologist Freud... nowadays Carnegie is used as a bible creating maneaters(figurative)...

Jim2007 26.07.2020 23:12

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Kite (Post 3201691)
I just never believed in the mainstream, because it was created through manipulation for the certain needs of our leaders...I see in many of my posts people don't get what I mean because I am not so "eloquent" as others on this forum...I don't have an oratory talent, can't express myself in the words that will make you think differently...but that doesn't stop me to read Schopenhauer, Hegel, Nietzsche, Marx, and not the last the greatest psychologist Freud... nowadays Carnegie is used as a bible creating maneaters(figurative)...

Right, because whatever flavour you are following is pure and without an agenda....

We don't care what you believe or don't believe, that is entirely your business. But expecting us to follow you don't the rabbit hole is not going to happen.

And yes I read all of these nineteen century philosophers in college and then some... and they definitely do not trump science when it comes to your triads on vaccines and mask wearing.

Caleb 27.07.2020 07:06

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Kite (Post 3201691)
...but that doesn't stop me to read Schopenhauer, Hegel, Nietzsche, Marx, and not the last the greatest psychologist Freud...

Really? You read and understand Hegel? And peedle anti-vaccination conspiracy theories at the same time?

Was vernünftig ist, das ist Wirklich; und was wirklich ist, das ist vernünftig ("What is rational is real; And what is real is rational"; Hegel)

MusicChick 27.07.2020 08:33

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Caleb (Post 3201704)
Really? You read and understand Hegel? And peedle anti-vaccination conspiracy theories at the same time?

Was vernünftig ist, das ist Wirklich; und was wirklich ist, das ist vernünftig ("What is rational is real; And what is real is rational"; Hegel)

There are many rational neuroscientists and philosophers who disagree with Hegel. Just sayin'

Chemmie 27.07.2020 09:37

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
I always seem to find, that people struggle with non-absolutes. Whether its understanding percentages, risks, probabilities, good, evil.

The last two are big ones. I feel many people now a days feel lost and insignificant as an individual. One of the easiest ways to feel self worth is to identify others as bad or wrong or evil. (With the intent that the self is thus good and right).

However, if the bad guy is not absolutely polarized as BAD, then the self cannot be absolutely polarized as GOOD, and the attempt to feel self worth is lost.

Maybe also why super hero movies have become increasingly popular. A simple entertaining example where the absolute good triumphs over absolute evil.

Caleb 27.07.2020 09:50

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
Of course, there's a lot to disagree, particularly when it comes to cosmology, awareness, and the fundamental question of "what reality really is".

On the other hand, from "disagreeing with Hegel" to saying that "vaccines are bad because it's actually an excuse for governments to put microchips in you to read what you eat, for marketing purposes"...sorry, I draw the line at "reasonable" quite a few meters away from it (read reasonable/rational/vernünftig).

gaburko 27.07.2020 10:00

Re: Polarised society:Why?
 
in the "beautiful" and multipolar 70s:
- Apartheid was raging
- Half of the planet was under communism
- In the US the civil rights movement was futile and had to give birth to the Black Power movement
- Certain cantons in Switzerland hadn't yet given voting rights to women
- I wasn't born yet

The list goes on, so "beautiful" is relative: if you were a black woman in SA or a white working class guy in Ural, maybe not so much.


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