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  #501  
Old 27.08.2009, 13:24
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Re: Religious Musings

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No I don't have any spiritual leader so I can't be classed as having a religion like you were suggesting
Can be anyone...
What about Tony Montana?
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  #502  
Old 27.08.2009, 13:26
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Re: Religious Musings

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Devil usually gets it from everyside...
Devil can take it as he has thick skin Devil likes to take and give.
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  #503  
Old 27.08.2009, 13:28
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Re: Religious Musings

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Devil can take it as he has thick skin Devil likes to take and give.
I knew there was something odd about you
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  #504  
Old 27.08.2009, 13:31
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Re: Religious Musings

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Can be anyone...
What about Tony Montana?
Nah! Just having a laugh.
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  #505  
Old 27.08.2009, 13:37
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Re: Religious Musings

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I knew there was something odd about you
Pleazzzzz! Give me credit man. Everything is odd about me

Ok Dervaish be good. I am off for now.
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  #506  
Old 27.08.2009, 13:59
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Re: Religious Musings

Oh... quiet you 2! It's unfortunately as always, whenever biology, geology or science is debated with religious types they just repeat some common missconceptions and missunderstandings, then get educated about it at lenght...ignore it and repeat their missconceptions. There is indeed thousands of proofs for evolution, any school book is based on the concept of evolution, medicine is incomprehensible if you don't understand evolution etc.
Don't pretend to discuss science if don't want to hear about it... discussion over.
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  #507  
Old 27.08.2009, 14:21
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Re: Religious Musings

Hashbrown ---Quote--- And I must say, what is this crap about negative mutations?!?! It makes no sense, not even in English. If you understand the whole point of evolution and the debate of design vs evolution, then it is that there is no postive/negative/whatever judgements on a mutation. It either propagates due to survival or due to competitive advantage or it doesn't. ---End Quote---

On the radio this morning I heard that scientists have genetically altered a monkey's DNA to eradicate a genetic disease. This means that the genetic predisposition will not be passed on to offspring.Now they want FDA approval to use it on humans. They are sure that they can prove it is safe, but htere are ethical considerations-they can be accused of creating a super race.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...248236&ps=cprs
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  #508  
Old 27.08.2009, 14:45
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Re: Religious Musings

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Persoanlly, I think EVERYONE has a Religion... if you define it as a Way of Life or a Person's set of beliefs... does not has to be Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism etc...

Not having a Religion is also a Religion.

Believe in Evolution is also a Religion.. if a person basis his/her actions on that Principle.. no afterlife no Accountability, we're here mere by a "Chance" or "coincidence" ... so just have it large while you can... and do what you can do.
Well if you define Religion as something it's not (way of life) then yes, everyone has one. But if you don't deliberately distort the meaning of the word then no, absolutely not.
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A religion is an organized approach to human spirituality which usually encompasses a set of narratives, symbols, beliefs and practices, often with a supernatural or transcendent quality, that give meaning to the practitioner's experiences of life through reference to a higher power, God or gods, or ultimate truth.[
Evolution is not a set of beliefs, no matter how often religious loonies repeat it. It's a scientific theory (and I hope by now you understand the word theory in science) that has been confirmed and proven countless times. No belief necessary at all. No leap of faith.
You don't just trust it, you test it, and if there's not the slightest scientific doubt left it becomes common knowledge and is rightfully taught in schools. I find those attempts to equalize every viewpoint and tear it down to the level of Religion very cumbersome. Again, I thought you were a level-headed, critical mind Dervaish. But I'm afraid on this topic you are on the level of an average American fundamentalist who's never seen a proper school from the inside. You repeat precisely the same arguments which show you haven't quite understood the scientific verification process. And by posting random quotes out of concept you're not doing yourself a favour either. It's just, if somebody doesn't want to listen, but pretends to discuss a topic it's nothing but a waste of time.
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  #509  
Old 27.08.2009, 14:49
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Re: Religious Musings

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Not having a Religion is also a Religion.
Like not collecting stamps is a hobby ?
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  #510  
Old 27.08.2009, 14:52
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Re: Sawm of Ramadan ( 2009 )

Freedom of religion is a controversial subject, even in the twenty-first century, and it usually generates a lot of heated discussions. The view of Islam in this regard is evident from the Qur’an, which says what means:

*{Say, ‘The truth is from your Lord’: Let him who will, believe, and let him who will, reject [it]}* (An-Nisaa' 4:29)

Again, God says:
*{Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error…}* (Al-Baqarah 2:256)

These two verses clearly show that a person’s belief must be true, sincere, and not generated as a result of force or compulsion from outside. From the Islamic point of view, Man is God’s khalifah (vicegerent) on earth; which means that he is a free and responsible ambassador of God on earth, and everything on earth has been created for him.
Thus, Heaven or Hell is the natural outcome of the willful choices we make here; and that is the test God has presented before us. As in the case of any test, the participants must have the freedom of choice. If not, the test and the reward or punishment will be meaningless.
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  #511  
Old 27.08.2009, 14:55
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Re: Sawm of Ramadan ( 2009 )

So much for the theory, sarahsghaar !?
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  #512  
Old 27.08.2009, 14:55
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Re: Religious Musings

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Like not collecting stamps is a hobby ?
Ofcourse.. IF it helps you passtime or amuses you.
Think about it
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  #513  
Old 27.08.2009, 14:59
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Re: Religious Musings

And above all Quran, hadid, sunnah tells us all this! and thats what we muslims call faith!
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  #514  
Old 27.08.2009, 15:00
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Re: Religious Musings

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Well if you define Religion as something it's not (way of life) then yes, everyone has one. But if you don't deliberately distort the meaning of the word then no, absolutely not.


Evolution is not a set of beliefs, no matter how often religious loonies repeat it. It's a scientific theory (and I hope by now you understand the word theory in science) that has been confirmed and proven countless times. No belief necessary at all. No leap of faith.
You don't just trust it, you test it, and if there's not the slightest scientific doubt left it becomes common knowledge and is rightfully taught in schools. I find those attempts to equalize every viewpoint and tear it down to the level of Religion very cumbersome. Again, I thought you were a level-headed, critical mind Dervaish. But I'm afraid on this topic you are on the level of an average American fundamentalist who's never seen a proper school from the inside. You repeat precisely the same arguments which show you haven't quite understood the scientific verification process. And by posting random quotes out of concept you're not doing yourself a favour either. It's just, if somebody doesn't want to listen, but pretends to discuss a topic it's nothing but a waste of time.

Yes, I guess you are right, I mean my information is pretty much outdated now and havent been staying abreast with recent researches and scientific developments..

Sorry about wasting your Time.
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  #515  
Old 27.08.2009, 15:01
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Re: Religious Musings

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Evolution is not a set of beliefs, no matter how often religious loonies repeat it. It's a scientific theory (and I hope by now you understand the word theory in science) that has been confirmed and proven countless times.
This is too obtuse to be taken seriously. What exactly has been proven, and what remains to be proven? I have no problem with evolution when applied to specific intra-species examples e.g. bacterial resistance to antibiotics, the shapes of Galapagos finch beaks etc.. but what evolutionists have done is take a perfectly reasonable theory of adaptation and survival and apply it wholesale to the origin of life itself. Its like a man with a hammer, every problem becomes a nail.
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  #516  
Old 27.08.2009, 15:06
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Re: Religious Musings

exactly !

and its an odd debate what should be done and what not .. basically my point is that ramzan is that Allah has nothing to do with ur hunger n thirt its ur test of refraining urself from sins and bad deeds. And according to a research in the month of fasting the crime rate in the muslin coutries falls but it stays the same in the other parts of the world.
but yes if we try being nice and all goody goody in this month we should be doing the same in other months aswell!
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  #517  
Old 27.08.2009, 15:13
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Re: Religious Musings

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This is too obtuse to be taken seriously. What exactly has been proven, and what remains to be proven? I have no problem with evolution when applied to specific intra-species examples e.g. bacterial resistance to antibiotics, the shapes of Galapagos finch beaks etc.. but what evolutionists have done is take a perfectly reasonable theory of adaptation and survival and apply it wholesale to the origin of life itself. Its like a man with a hammer, every problem becomes a nail.
Not exactly no. First of all it's nice that you acknowledge that evolution in species does happen. Living beings change and pass these changes on to their offspring. Evolution sais but that, creatures are ever-changing, adapting. There's no "fixed set of species". The origin of life, however, or more precisely the critical moment from dead to organic matter is everything but clear, and is yet very much debated. You could say it was God who triggered it, it doesn't matter to me.
It is also debated when exactly it happened. What's clear is that it didn't happen 6000 years ago.. what's also clear is that all creatures evolved over time, some died out (dinosaurs anyone?) and others changed their appearance radically (whales, from land to sea, still possessing finger bones they can't use)
Now these are but the basic concepts, and there is absolutely nothing in science that indicates otherwise. Nada, zero. All the rest is always, and will always be, subject of scientific (informed!) debates and research, as it should be.
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  #518  
Old 27.08.2009, 15:40
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Re: Religious Musings

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Now these are but the basic concepts, and there is absolutely nothing in science that indicates otherwise. Nada, zero.
What about the fossil record? Apart from a few isolated examples, It completely fails to record the existance of transitional forms in any significant number. Its true we haven't unearthed everything, and certain organism don't leave behind fossilised remains. However what we do have in the fish and invertebrate categories gives us enough to study, and when you do, you won't see this gradual shift in species, but rather discrete step changes. Its like a species is there one minute, gone the next. How do you explain that?
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  #519  
Old 27.08.2009, 15:45
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Re: Religious Musings

Let me take you by the hand and introduce you the wikipedia, the first source to read when you have absolutely no clue what you're talking about:
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Proponents of creationism have frequently made claims about the existence or implications of transitional fossils that the scientific community considers to be false and misleading. Some of these claims include:

There are no transitional fossils, made by groups like Answers in Genesis and the Institute for Creation Research;[5][3][6][7] such claims may be based on a misunderstanding of the nature of what represents a transitional feature[5] but are also explained as a tactic actively employed by creationists seeking to distort or discredit evolutionary theory and have been called the "favourite lie" of creationists.[3]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transitional_fossil

I always promise myself to stop entering such discussions where the information gap seems to be just too big. But I guess there is still plenty of ape in me and still do it all the time.
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  #520  
Old 27.08.2009, 15:52
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Re: Religious Musings

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Perhaps you can give some examples of some Greek and Indian sources which would show that? (Since you have made that claim)
http://info.math.nankai.edu.cn/navig...pics/Zero.html

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And if they were taken from Ancient Greece (Europe) then why did Europeans believed the earth to be flat in Middle ages?
Because they

a) were far more obsessed with making the World fit the Book, and

b) because they did not have the same access to the Greek works as the Arabs (Library in Alexandria contained a lot of them AFAIK)

An interesting subject btw, why did so much scientific progress in the muslim world happen until about 800 years ago, and so relatively little since?

I stop here, I see that the thread has gone somewhat downhill.
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