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  #21  
Old 15.08.2011, 13:38
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

Some people obviously do not know the difference between renting you a place and lending. You pay not for her to lend you a bed, but for you to have your appartment, without inspections.

Chances are, she has always wanted to keep your deposit, those people probably get together over coffee and figure out how to get the deposit from naieve, new, short term foreign renters..And it looks to me she as prepared the situ over the last few months for her to think she can actually stand her ground, ripping you off.

Contact your association, as has been suggested, they have legal help, I am sure they are used to obsessive, money orriented landladies. And chances are, she breached her contract, will have to return not only the deposit but I wonder what would happen should you ask for a rent discount due to lack of privacy, etc. Probably zero chance, but at least she might back off.

Cmon, sticking her head into the toilet telling you you haven't scrubbed enough?
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  #22  
Old 15.08.2011, 13:47
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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I'm in a sticky situation.

Things mentioned were the WC which I had closed anyway.
Too much detail
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  #23  
Old 15.08.2011, 14:32
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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Too much detail
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  #24  
Old 15.08.2011, 14:49
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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repair the door yourself before handing the keys back otherwise she will just replace the whole door unit and take that from the depo, and if the door isnt available anymore guess what will be replaced!
sorry, are you suggesting I remove the door?
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  #25  
Old 15.08.2011, 15:06
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

To reinforce what everyone has said, you should join the Mieterverband a.s.a.p. and show them your rental contract. She is not allowed to enter your apartment when you are not there, ask the Mieterverband for advice on what to do, as it is trespass which is a crime.

Regarding the demand for extra cleaning money, laugh it off or ask her for a detailed invoice in writing. Detail of the 3 hours worked, date and hours from & to, tell her you want to take it to the police to reinforce your trespass accusation!

Go and see the Mieterverband as soon as possible and ask them to back date your membership join date by 3 months: http://www.mieterverband.ch/?id=2287

You can also ask the Mieterverband to send an observer at the handover on 31.08.2011, for this you will have to pay an extra charge, but it will be well worth it!

Is it obvious that the shower door has been broken a long time? Heavy corrosion? (Chances are it is very old and worthless, i.e. you are not expected to repair it.) Or did you break it accidentally? Your 3rd party insurance will pay for the repair or replacement if it was an accident.
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  #26  
Old 15.08.2011, 15:08
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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repair the door yourself before handing the keys back otherwise she will just replace the whole door unit and take that from the depo, and if the door isnt available anymore guess what will be replaced!
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sorry, are you suggesting I remove the door?
I think he is at least suggesting that it would be cheaper for you to arrange someone to fix the door yourself.

You can guarantee that the repair cost deducted from your bond will be far more expensive.
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  #27  
Old 15.08.2011, 15:35
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

Also, put any damage repairs through your house insurance. Let her argue the toss with them.

Cheers,
Nick
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  #28  
Old 15.08.2011, 15:40
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

Thanks for all the support, everybody. I feel much better.

I did talk to my HR and they confirmed that she can't make such an idiotic request.
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  #29  
Old 15.08.2011, 16:06
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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sorry, are you suggesting I remove the door?

no repair the door yourself or arrange for the door to be repaired. someone at work had a similar issue, the door for that model of shower wasnt available any more and the whole shower unit was replaced at massive cost to him.

Ths is of course only valid if the door has broken thru damage, if it is corroded etc then thats just wear and tear and tough for her
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  #30  
Old 15.08.2011, 16:13
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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no repair the door yourself or arrange for the door to be repaired. someone at work had a similar issue, the door for that model of shower wasnt available any more and the whole shower unit was replaced at massive cost to him.

Ths is of course only valid if the door has broken thru damage, if it is corroded etc then thats just wear and tear and tough for her
This could be the case as it seems to be very old.

I think it was more wear and tear than damage. There was no accident, it just started falling apart.
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  #31  
Old 15.08.2011, 16:16
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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Thanks for all the support, everybody. I feel much better.

I did talk to my HR and they confirmed that she can't make such an idiotic request.
Good. At least they know of the situation. Now just because I am feeling combative today, I would do the following:

1. Get a membership to the mieterverband. If not, at least work something out with them to be there on your handover day. The cost of having them there will probably be less than your month's rent.

2. Tell her that you will arrange directly with the cleaning company to come and clean on the final day and that the cost of the cleaning company should not be taken out of your deposit BUT to be invoiced to you directly.

Message: dont eff with me, biatch.

3. Tell her nicely (and innocently, if you can) that you've spoken to your HR today and they've confirmed that she is not allowed to take the money out of your bank account.

Message: dont eff with me, biatch.

4. (Once you've managed to get someone from mieterverband to be present on Handover Day): Tell her that someone will be present on handover day to advise you on the correct procedures and your rights "for a smooth handover" of course

Message: seriously, dont eff with me, biatch.

Good luck, I really hope everything goes ok from now on.
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  #32  
Old 15.08.2011, 16:20
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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Good. At least they know of the situation. Now just because I am feeling combative today, I would do the following:

1. Get a membership to the mieterverband. If not, at least work something out with them to be there on your handover day. The cost of having them there will probably be less than your month's rent.

2. Tell her that you will arrange directly with the cleaning company to come and clean on the final day and that the cost of the cleaning company should not be taken out of your deposit BUT to be invoiced to you directly.

Message: dont eff with me, biatch.

3. Tell her nicely (and innocently, if you can) that you've spoken to your HR today and they've confirmed that she is not allowed to take the money out of your bank account.

Message: dont eff with me, biatch.

4. (Once you've managed to get someone from mieterverband to be present on Handover Day): Tell her that someone will be present on handover day to advise you on the correct procedures and your rights "for a smooth handover" of course

Message: seriously, dont eff with me, biatch.

Good luck, I really hope everything goes ok from now on.
Good grief.... you are in some serious combat mode here
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  #33  
Old 15.08.2011, 16:21
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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Good grief.... you are in some serious combat mode here
I know Bloody full moon.

Feel free to ignore the above post admorgan.
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  #34  
Old 15.08.2011, 16:31
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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privacy, etc. Probably zero chance, but at least she might back off.

Cmon, sticking her head into the toilet telling you you haven't scrubbed enough?
... you should have flushed it whilst she was down there admorgan!!!
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  #35  
Old 15.08.2011, 18:28
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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Sounds like you are living with you mom.

Write off the deposit and find a new place to live; one where your landlady won't be trying to manage your business.
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If OP wasn't moving out anyway, I'd say that, I don't think writing off a deposit and simply picking up and moving is an option, folks. Did we forget how hard it is to come up with a deposit in Switzerland?
Since OP indicated that the contract was up at the end of the month and that he/she was already contractually obligated to pay the final clean out fee from the deposit, I just meant that it might not be worth it to expect or pursue the return of the remainder of the deposit from a landlady who, per OP's original post, believes that a different housekeeping standard than her own will actually "damage" the property (ridiculous). Just sounds like he/she might be wasting time to expect any level of reasonability from that landlady.
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  #36  
Old 15.08.2011, 18:32
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

I think she fancies you, Swiss style, or telling you to get a wife.
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  #37  
Old 15.08.2011, 18:42
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

Take & print some photos of the damaged shower door, print a copy of the your contract and some info from the Mieterverband website.. leave it lying round your flat, as she probably comes in anyway when you are at work.. annotate printed photos and copy of contract with handwritten questions regarding - inevitable wear and tear, age of shower door, rights of landlord access to apartment, deposit rules etc..

She just might be more respectful towards you and your deposit some evening later in the week

Good luck, she sounds like a complete fruitcake.
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  #38  
Old 15.08.2011, 19:24
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

If you are leaving Switzerland then it might be worth saying goodbye to the deposit, otherwise fight her.

The problem is the deposit is there as a protection for the landlord, not as an advance payment. If you don't follow the correct procedures when you leave she can send you a "Betreibung" and hound you through the debtors' court, as she will have the law on her side. This will not help you in future, and you may end up having to pay her.

The "Mieterverband Observer" shouldn't cost more than Fr 150,-- against being chased through the courts for a new shower installation.

On the website I gave you are a checking form to download for the handover,

http://www.mieterverband.ch/fileadmi...rotokoll_1.pdf

And a table of official lifetimes for fixtures and fittings in the apartment, (A plastic shower cabin should last 15 years, and costs Fr 1'000,-- )

http://www.mieterverband.ch/smv_lebensdauertab.0.html

She is a terrible landlord, please name and shame. Good luck!
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  #39  
Old 15.08.2011, 19:34
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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Thanks for all the replies. Backs up what I thought. I suppose the deposit has to be written off but she will get nothing else out of me.

(edit) Just to add that it was always the case that she would arrange final cleaning and that it would come out of my deposit (in the contract).
She basically 'arranged' to have this in your contract which is not really standard practice. Been there and done that, I have a feeling that the lady has done this a few times and takes advantage of newcomers who do not know the laws.
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  #40  
Old 15.08.2011, 19:40
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Re: Problems with Landlady over Apartment Cleanliness

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Some people obviously do not know the difference between renting you a place and lending. You pay not for her to lend you a bed, but for you to have your appartment, without inspections.

Chances are, she has always wanted to keep your deposit, those people probably get together over coffee and figure out how to get the deposit from naieve, new, short term foreign renters..And it looks to me she as prepared the situ over the last few months for her to think she can actually stand her ground, ripping you off.
This is exactly the case in many countries when the first time renter, in need of an apartment quickly falls into this trap.
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