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  #21  
Old 16.08.2012, 08:28
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

At the inspection before we moved into our flat, the agent pointed out holes in the walls and said to the previous tenant that they should have been filled in, but did nothing about it.
It saved us having to drill new ones for our pictures though.
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  #22  
Old 16.08.2012, 10:12
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

Most contracts seem to state that you should just leave them. Of course, then the question comes along - how many holes are acceptable in a wall.. (We must be told!)

I think a lot of problems come from people using 8mm plugs and 100mm screws to hang a postcard on a wall. And this is after using a tiny drill to try and drill through the brickwork (or concrete as the case may be) and making a complete mess of the hole. Usual thing that happens is pushing hard on the drill to get through the brick and then suddenly you hit the airgaps in the brick, at which point the chuck of the drill slams into the wall and you end up with a huge countersunk hole! Done that a few times.. Another common one is using an underpowered drill which goes through the plaster fine, but then hits a pebble in the concrete and then the drill bit does a merry dance on the surface of that, as it won't go through it, thus creating another fine mess.

Rule #1 - only use the smallest possible screw and plug possible. Look on www.fischer.de for information. Even a correctly installed 3mm plug can safely take a force of 0.16 kN - 16 kg hanging on it, effectively.
Rule #2 - be aware of the airgaps in the brickwork
Rule #3 - use a good drill with enough power, SDS is best, especially if you have to go into the ceiling. And use good quality drill bits.
Rule #4 - let the drill do the work.

For filling unwanted holes, and if you have the textured plaster on the walls, you can buy small pots of this at Coop and this works well. It's called Marmoran (Vollabrieb)

Cheers,
Chris
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  #23  
Old 16.08.2012, 10:25
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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Rule #1 - only use the smallest possible screw and plug possible. Look on www.fischer.de for information. Even a correctly installed 3mm plug can safely take a force of 0.16 kN - 16 kg hanging on it, effectively.
Rule #2 - be aware of the airgaps in the brickwork
Rule #3 - use a good drill with enough power, SDS is best, especially if you have to go into the ceiling. And use good quality drill bits.
Rule #4 - let the drill do the work.
I would also use a metal detector to ensure not to drill in wires or pipes.
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Old 16.08.2012, 10:46
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

This is a guideline (see attached picture) that shows where electricians are allowed to place the cables. In floors and walls, this does not apply; they can be laid such that the shortest possible route is followed. In bathrooms, they should be 6cm deep; other rooms they should be so deep that they are sufficiently protected from mechanical damage (usually 20mm or more)

But, when using a metal detector, you may also detect the reinforcing bars - these are really quite close to the surface (about 20mm). Rule of thumb here is that if the rebar is 1cm or larger in diameter do not cut it, as it can be under tension. Less than this, then it is a part of the mesh and can be cut without worry.

Cheers,
Chris
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  #25  
Old 16.08.2012, 20:57
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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Rule #1 - only use the smallest possible screw and plug possible. Look on www.fischer.de for information. Even a correctly installed 3mm plug can safely take a force of 0.16 kN - 16 kg hanging on it, effectively.
Rule #2 - be aware of the airgaps in the brickwork
Rule #3 - use a good drill with enough power, SDS is best, especially if you have to go into the ceiling. And use good quality drill bits.
Rule #4 - let the drill do the work.
Rule #5 - ignore rules 1 -4 and call chrisIDS to drill the holes for you.
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  #26  
Old 17.08.2012, 13:55
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

This sounds stupid. But how to drill the holes on the wall? just need some small holes to hang pictures. Don't want to spend a lot on buying the electrical drills. Can I do it by myself with a hammer and nail?
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  #27  
Old 17.08.2012, 13:59
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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This sounds stupid. But how to drill the holes on the wall? just need some small holes to hang pictures. Don't want to spend a lot on buying the electrical drills. Can I do it by myself with a hammer and nail?
Generally, no.

Tom
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Old 17.08.2012, 14:04
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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Don't want to spend a lot on buying the electrical drills.
You may consider renting out a drill. Not sure about costs and conditions.

Another option is to look for second hand equipment, specially from people moving out of the country.
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Old 17.08.2012, 14:54
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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This sounds stupid. But how to drill the holes on the wall? just need some small holes to hang pictures. Don't want to spend a lot on buying the electrical drills. Can I do it by myself with a hammer and nail?
What ..... just a hammer and nail ..... doing it yourself?
Do you want to upset the Associated Union of Drill Makers and Retailers, and the Picture Hangers Union, and have their wrath down upon you?

This is how General Strikes start.
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  #30  
Old 17.08.2012, 15:02
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

Well, I did the same (without drills).

Go to Jumbo and look for nails that are about 3/4 of an inch long, black in color and have golden/brass heads.

These nails are made of metals that are capable of handling large weights.
Ask the staff at Jumbo for help incase you are lost.

FYI: Hung 5 paintings on IKEA frames (medium/heavy) over a year back and they havent fallen down as yet. Although the first few nights, I had recurrent nightmares that the Monet hung over my bed might come crashing down on my head while im sleeping

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This sounds stupid. But how to drill the holes on the wall? just need some small holes to hang pictures. Don't want to spend a lot on buying the electrical drills. Can I do it by myself with a hammer and nail?
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  #31  
Old 17.08.2012, 15:41
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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Well, I did the same (without drills).

Go to Jumbo and look for nails that are about 3/4 of an inch long, black in color and have golden/brass heads.

These nails are made of metals that are capable of handling large weights.
Ask the staff at Jumbo for help incase you are lost.

FYI: Hung 5 paintings on IKEA frames (medium/heavy) over a year back and they havent fallen down as yet. Although the first few nights, I had recurrent nightmares that the Monet hung over my bed might come crashing down on my head while im sleeping
How did you do it? use a hammer? where to get the hammer then?
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  #32  
Old 21.08.2012, 00:50
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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How did you do it? use a hammer? where to get the hammer then?
At the same place that sells the nails.
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  #33  
Old 21.08.2012, 05:27
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

This is what we used

http://www.ferragsil.pt/index.php?c=31_43

works well and when you remove it you basically get a very tiny hole or 3 very tiny holes that are really unnoticeable. We got these at AKI but I think there isn't AKI in Switzerland. You can try Hornbach or Jumbo - they should have them
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  #34  
Old 21.08.2012, 08:21
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

The problem with nails is that they just won't work in many walls (mine, for example), they will just bend, or, worse, chip out large chunks.

Tom
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Old 21.08.2012, 10:07
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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The problem with nails is that they just won't work in many walls (mine, for example), they will just bend, or, worse, chip out large chunks.

Tom
No nails? what else do you use then?
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  #36  
Old 21.08.2012, 10:10
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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How anyone manages to put holes in these walls I'll never know.
drill... drill... drill....
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  #37  
Old 21.08.2012, 10:23
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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where to get the hammer then?


This reminds me of the thread "how to post a letter"
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  #38  
Old 21.08.2012, 10:36
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

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How did you do it? use a hammer? where to get the hammer then?
Just go to your nearest hardware or DIY store and ask for a hammervor.
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  #39  
Old 21.08.2012, 10:46
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

My contract says not to fill the holes. But I don't know whether to disregard that clause. I have heard horror stories from other expats (this doesn't happen to Swiss) that they were charged for repainting the walls where holes had been and then told that it wouldn't look nice if only some walls were repainted, so they were charged for the repainting of the whole apartment! I guess they can't do that to you if you've lived there 10 years, but I will be leaving after 9! Any advice?
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Old 21.08.2012, 12:36
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Re: How much do I need to pay if I put holes on the wall

Why not use "No more Nails"

Or theres the sticky hooks that come off with out damaging your walls.

Problem hopefully solved?
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