Ok, so ive found a really great apartment in a great location and really want it.

Only problem is how do I get it?

It's so strange from me that 30 people or so apply for it and then they chose who to take. What do they base this choice on?

In London, the first person to say I want it and give the deposit gets the place!

Does anyone have any advice on how to be above the rest?

I wanted to call up the agent and say, "ok what does it take for me to get the place" but my Swiss wife said then we will never get it!

What kind of a country do we live in that a man can't bribe some one?

Selling your soul to the Devil should make things a little easier

What you have described is the normal situation for finding an apartment & it usually doesn't matter where or how good the place is it is usually always the same. Having a Swiss wife does help though, puts you ahead of the Auslanders.

Good Luck!

hi Lee, in my experience - and I have done this a few times due to much-moving Mr. Bartholemew - it takes a mix of your tenacity and wife's Swissie subtlety for tough housing markets like Zurich.

As soon as you've been to see the flat and know you want it, its important to act quickly. Ask the current tenant to tell you who the "decider" is. They should know because it will probably be the same person who's responsible for the faulty dishwasher, dripping faucet, etc. For instance, in most of my past apartments, its been an employee at a larger real estate management firm, but its important to get a name.

Then, hightail it home and write a sincere cover letter for the entire sheaf of documents they are probably going to ask you to send: the Betriebungsregister stuff saying you're not in default, any application forms they're asking you to fill out, whatever else they want, but make sure you have this stuff ready at home.

The cover letter should be short, tightly written and addressed to a name, not the company, and could be something like: my wife and I saw this apartment, really like and it feel we'd be ideally suited; we've lived in our current building for 15 years and are looking for something bigger/more central/fill-in-the-blank and this fits the bill perfectly; please find all our 84 pages of stuff you asked for attached. If there aren't any specific questions on the application about what you do for a living, might be a good idea to include that in the cover letter. Play up any good points you haven't been asked about in the application forms, such as non-smoking, no pets, no loud musical instruments, but I would avoid saying things like, I would do anything to get this apartment. The last line should be a reference to your daytime availability and willingness to be at their disposal should they have any questions.

I would fax the cover letter and forms to the "decider" immediately (this can make a big difference! If you've been to see a flat after work and really want it, get the fax sent through that night so the person has it on their desk next morning) with a note saying they can expect the originals in the mail shortly. Call the Herr-Frau Decider the next day, and ask nicely if they have received the stuff you faxed. If they seem nice, you might ask how long they expect to take to decide who to grant the apartment to. If not, just say you are available anytime for any questions and make sure they get the originals in the mail quickly.

Unfortunately, all you can do then is wait. After about 5 days, call again and ask if there is anything more you can provide them with. This may lead to them saying they have already decided or are about to decide. Don't despair if they already have decided and it's not you! People turn down apartments all the time, so just tell the decider you're sorry to hear that but perhaps they could keep you in mind in case the flat unexpectedly becomes free after all.

Bartholomew's advice is all excellent, and I would say the same based on recent experiences. Your Swiss wife should definitely help- make sure you send in her Swiss ID papers as well as yours. Not that the Swiss don't like foreigners..... they just prefer, it seems, to rent to Swiss people who won't be moving out again in a year's time and incurring added costs in the whole rental procedure.

The most important things for me were a) the direct phone call to the 'decider', preferably in German, just like Bartholomew suggested- this really worked for me; and b) the statement of no-debts-owing that you must get from your Kreisburo. If you don't have this, they won't consider your application in most cases. Even if you just moved here, get one. It makes a big difference. It costs around 20 SF I think from the Kreisburo.

Good luck!

It's called a sellers' market - where demand outstrips supply.

As a non-Swiss you have a big disadvantage. The landlords biggest concern is that you will leave again soon and they'll have to go through the letting process again. So in the letter that Bartholemew rightly suggests - stress that you are here forever and will never leave. Of course circumstances might change in the future...

Also consider including a photo. If you've met the decision maker already, it'll jog their memory. Sounds whack, I know, but you're pitching your brand, so make it glossy!

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That's for all the advice everyone.

I guess I should ask my wife to do everything but she is not as sales minded/aggresive in her ways as I am.

I will try my best, here's hoping!

Put on your best suit, train to hold your biggest smile and behave more polite than you have ever done before when you drop by at the landlords office yourself, to hand over your dossier personally.
The "decider" can forget all the other applicants because he or she knows you then as a nice guy.

Good luck!
Will

PS mentioning the company your are working for might also add

Ok people, so I went before to see the estate agent, luckly she spoke good English and after a few phone calls today and some nicely timed jokes I have a bit of a realation going with her.

I then went personally to give her the papers by hand and lucky me she was young and impressionable. I turned on the English charm and used the sales psychology that ive spent my life learning and mastering.

Ive done everything I can do, its now just time to wait and chew the fat.

Here's hoping

Good luck, we will keep our collective fingers crossed for you!

aggressive/sales minded...should work everywhere no ?

So, guess what????

They only called me and offered me the apartment!

I did call quite a few times and build up a relation with the agent. Now im stumped as I was not expecting to get it. Am going again tonight to see the place and decide.

So there you go. The sun even shines on a dog's ass somedays!

Now you can start playing their game: be hyper picky about quality of the fixtures and fittings; any scratches anywhere on the floor? What about that parking space? Kinda noisy around here, innit? Try to get them to bring down the rental price.

Look stern, suck air through your teeth and suggest a figure 10% below what they're asking. Then seal your lips until they reply. As the game goes, he who speaks first after the offer, 'loses'. My girlfriend did this, pouting a little, and was successful. Ask your wife to put on the lippy!

attaboy Lee - congrats! you indeed must be a sales-jedi...

Uncle max, you really think that trying to reduce the price will work?

Im not so sure in this case as the place is on the edge of Neiderdorf (the old town) in zurich and basically has many many many applicants. Im sure they will tell me to bugger off if i try!

That's the whole point of the Game: Each time they re-lease the place, they bump up the asking price. What you would like, I take, is to pay the same price as the old occupier. It's quite reasonable to all parties: the landlord continues to receive his lucrative income, you get a fairer price. If you don't think there's been any renovation of substantial value, 'neg' the place a little. Not too much, mind.

The landlord likes you and wants to get that contract signed, pronto. He's invested enough for his liking just getting to this point.

Bring the feminine charm along and look undecided. Don't mention your offer until you've had a good look around, made more important relationship-building conversation (so far, it's a closure in his book) and at the end make your bid.

The worst that can happen is he says no. But before he does: put up, then shut up. Look him in the eye, and be serious. Make him squirm a little, even if he says no, by not replying. Keep looking at him. Jedi mind tricks, etc. If he senses you'll walk (which you're not going to do) he may quiver. If you really feel he's not going to budge, you can agree to the price. After all, you've done your best to genuinely build the relationship with him. If he likes you he may well agree.

Alternatively, instead of asking for an outright reduction, get 'add-ons', such as included service charge (if applicable), instalation of a dishwasher, microwave, internet connection etc. These little things can soon add up, so perhaps if he doesn't give you the cheaper rental price, suggest to him he includes something of extra value to 'help you make up your mind'.

Good luck!

While you're at it, see if you can get some flexibility about laundry days. Being a hard-working professional I'm sure you're way too busy to be restricted to one fixed laundry day per week/month. Who knows, it could possibly be a show stopper...

Also find out about the neighbours... are there toddlers next door? A stoner downstairs with a big stereo? Curtain-twitchy senior citizens? Maybe see if the landlord gives hints as to why the last person left - was it for practical reasons or because of the neighbours?

Also find out about the house 'rules', both written and implicit. Is it ok to flush the loo after 10pm? Is it ok to cook exotic (read: stinky) food?

Well the only problem with all of the above is the people are still living there and we are dealing over the phone with the agent.

I managed to get a few things sorted, the rent has not increased in the past 4 years and wont also for us. They will buffer the floor, paint the walls etc.

The best thing is it has a roof terrace of around 30m2 or more and looks over the whole of Niederdorf (old town Zurich), mountains and lake!!!

The deal is done, I have the place.

I cant believe it. So many people said you have to apply to many different places and chances are slim, especially in the city center.

So you did the deal with Old Nick then .

Congratulations, when is the house warming party?!

I'll stick this question here, as its to do with getting a flat.

Just put in an offer for a place we liked, however I've spoken to the decision maker and they won't make a choice on who to rent the place out to for another week.
Is there any issues with me putting an offer down on another place and hedge my bets?