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Old 05.04.2013, 22:22
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Converting a plug socket

Hello fellow EFers.

Short question: is there any reason I can't take out a 3-plug socket and replace it with a cable (assuming the flex in the scoket is not long enough) and a single extension lead socket?

So replacing one of these:


With this (the socket on the right, not the plug on the left):


Longer version: they put the plug sockets too high in our bedroom, which means the bed blocks access. However, I could get a cable out of the socket and attach a single socket with an exension lead so that it hange below the bed frame thus making it accessible to use... It is our house, so no problems with the letting agent/owner.
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Old 05.04.2013, 22:31
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Re: Converting a plug socket

Why do it so difficult?

What is wrong with a simple extension cable from the wall sockets placed where you want them?

Also, when you leave, you have to return the apartment to the same condition as when you received it... Another reason to use an extension cable.
JC
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Old 05.04.2013, 22:37
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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Hello fellow EFers.

Short question: is there any reason I can't take out a 3-plug socket and replace it with a cable (assuming the flex in the scoket is not long enough) and a single extension lead socket?
Probably regs.
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Old 05.04.2013, 22:37
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Re: Converting a plug socket

And if there isn't much room, try one of these types of plugs:


(obviously wrong plug style, but I've seen these at Obi here in Basel)
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Old 05.04.2013, 22:37
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Re: Converting a plug socket

You can do what you like, but that would be against the usual European normal practice. If an electrician did that he could be prosecuted!

You can buy Swiss extension cables with flatter plugs, 90 degree angled,

http://www.brack.ch/tabid/294/Default.aspx?ID=153569

http://www.google.de/imgres?start=49...1&tx=61&ty=105
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Old 05.04.2013, 22:40
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Re: Converting a plug socket

Perfectly fine, I know because my notoriously fussy Swiss electrician directly wired the fridge into its own dedicated electric point (replacing the standard socket that was there before). The reason I requested it is because my 2 yo would most likely keep on unplugging the fridge => parents
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Old 05.04.2013, 22:43
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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Perfectly fine, I know because my notoriously fussy Swiss electrician directly wired the fridge into its own dedicated electric point (replacing the standard socket that was there before). The reason I requested it is because my 2 yo would most likely keep on unplugging the fridge => parents
But he didn't leave access to a live 220 volt connection at the wall did he?
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Old 05.04.2013, 22:58
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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But he didn't leave access to a live 220 volt connection at the wall did he?
He replaced a regular socket with something that looks like this

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Old 06.04.2013, 07:50
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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But he didn't leave access to a live 220 volt connection at the wall did he?
What makes you think I am stupid enough to do that? I think I'll also leave the wires live when working on them.

As mentioned there is no room for a plug in the socket, so the socket is useless. I've already tried the 90 deg options.

Thanks Castro, looks like you got what I was talking about.
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Old 06.04.2013, 09:13
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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What makes you think I am stupid enough to do that?
Because like 90% of posters here asking for help, you didn't describe the problem, nor the solutions you have discarded, in your first post.

You could have stated you had considered the 90 degree cable connection and saved me about 10 minutes looking for a suitable image to show you they exist.

I assume the bed head would maybe cover the socket, and you are maybe tempted to botch the job, but you have not stated if it does.
(Quote: they put the plug sockets too high in our bedroom, which means the bed blocks access.)

Why do we always have to drag it out of them?
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Old 06.04.2013, 09:27
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Re: Converting a plug socket

I find it hard to believe that running a hardwired flexible extension cord from a wall outlet would meet electrical code standards in CH(regardless of what your electrician may have already done). It is generally not permitted in the US, at least, according to section 400.8 of the National Electrical Code. There are only rare circumstances where it would be allowed, and even then the cord must be rated up to a certain amperage and insulation value.

Article 400
Flexible Cords and Cables

400.8 Uses Not Permitted. Unless specifically permitted in 400.7, flexible cords and cables shall not be used for the following:
(1) As a substitute for the fixed wiring of a structure
(2) Where run through holes in walls, structural ceilings, suspended ceilings, dropped ceilings, or floors
(3) Where run through doorways, windows, or similar openings
(4) Where attached to building surfaces
Exception to (4): Flexible cord and cable shall be permitted to be attached to building surfaces in accordance with the provisions of 368.56(B)
(5) Where concealed by walls, floors, or ceilings or located above suspended or dropped ceilings
(6) Where installed in raceways, except as otherwise permitted in this Code
(7) Where subject to physical damage

Good luck!

Last edited by pilatus1; 06.04.2013 at 09:45.
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Old 06.04.2013, 09:31
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Re: Converting a plug socket

According to our electrician that flat kind of socket isn't legal to install anymore, you should have one like this


Would that help at all for your problem? In my house I removed a socket and converted it to a junction box. I encased the lead in a thin UPVC box cable guide, fixed to the wall). At the far end, I added a box socket (like this, but Swiss
).

When we had the electrical inspection, it passed without comment. I'm fairly sure the solution you're looking at it isn't acceptable - though it is exactly what I've done for my 16A supply to run my chain saw and angle grinder.

Any electrical work must be carried by a qualified electrician, and certified. The certification in a standard fee regardless of the scope of the work - ~800CHF IIRC. On no account do any electrical work yourself in your own home as you will DIE!
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Old 06.04.2013, 09:47
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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What makes you think I am stupid enough to do that? I think I'll also leave the wires live when working on them.

As mentioned there is no room for a plug in the socket, so the socket is useless. I've already tried the 90 deg options.

Thanks Castro, looks like you got what I was talking about.
If the 90 deg plug didn't work for you, the the plate Castro has might not be ideal either. The bend on the wire coming out might well jut out further than a narrow plug. You could ram the bed into it to force it flatter, but that might cause issues too.
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Old 06.04.2013, 09:59
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Re: Converting a plug socket

Pull the bed a few cm away from the wall:
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Old 06.04.2013, 10:25
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Re: Converting a plug socket

If you guys own the house (I think that's stated in your original post) then from a practical standpoint, you can do whatever you want. There's no reason what you're describing won't work, but it's surely not going to be in compliance with the the electrical code.

The "right" way to do that would be to relocate the outlet to a more accessible area with conduit. but even then you have code requirements for outlet spacing, height above the floor, etc.

Obviously, if the cord somehow got cut or damaged you could potentially have a live wire hanging out of your wall. But in reality, I don't see how this is any more likely than if you had a power strip laying under the bed.

FYI- When we moved in (rental) the power cord for the washing machine was stuffed through a rough cut hole in the tile bathroom wall, then in through the side of a recessed junction box where it was hard wired. The hole in the tile was just filled with silicone caulk. The entire setup looked pretty mickey mouse to me.

Not knowing the Swiss code, I hired an electrician to wire up our clothes dryer and he just cut the plug off, and stuffed the wire through the same hole in the tile wall, then hard wired it into the same j-box. He didn't even bother to replace the caulk.
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Old 06.04.2013, 10:28
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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I hired an electrician to wire up our clothes dryer and he just cut the plug off, and stuffed the wire through the same hole in the tile wall, then hard wired it into the same j-box. He didn't even bother to replace the caulk.
2 wrongs don't make a right! He was obviously not complying, all cables in walls must be in conduit. Maybe he wasn't a registered electrician?
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Old 06.04.2013, 10:35
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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If you guys own the house (I think that's stated in your original post) then from a practical standpoint, you can do whatever you want. There's no reason what you're describing won't work, but it's surely not going to be in compliance with the the electrical code.
Not true DR. They can not do what ever they want - you corrected yourself in the next sentence If it doesn't meet local code, then they can not do it.
JC
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Old 06.04.2013, 10:38
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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2 wrongs don't make a right! He was obviously not complying, all cables in walls must be in conduit. Maybe he wasn't a registered electrician?
I would tend to agree, except that the electrician for the dryer install was scheduled by the relo company, and it's been my experience that they don't exactly go on the cheap when they are spending somebody else's money. Also, the bathroom where this is all located was remodeled right before we moved in. The washer installation was already in place when we did the walk through with two home inspectors, one for the landlord and one from the relo company and when I pointed it out to them they both said that it was acceptable.
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Old 06.04.2013, 10:46
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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Not true DR. They can not do what ever they want - you corrected yourself in the next sentence If it doesn't meet local code, then they can not do it.
JC

Maybe I wasn't clear in what I was trying to say. What I meant was; If he owns the house, nobody is going to bust him for putting in an installation that isn't to code. I was intending to point out that there is a difference between "not to code" and "unsafe" Obviously this could cause problems if/when they sell the house, or if they burn it down

But what he's describing, for his own home, isn't really any more unsafe than having a power strip plugged in under the bed. It's not to code, and I probably wouldn't do it that way in my own house, but from the standpoint of electrical theory, it will work just fine, which unless I misunderstood, was the original question?
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Old 06.04.2013, 10:53
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Re: Converting a plug socket

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Maybe I wasn't clear in what I was trying to say. What I meant was; If he owns the house, nobody is going to bust him for putting in an installation that isn't to code. I was intending to point out that there is a difference between "not to code" and "unsafe" Obviously this could cause problems if/when they sell the house, or if they burn it down

But what he's describing, for his own home, isn't really any more unsafe than having a power strip plugged in under the bed. It's not to code, and I probably wouldn't do it that way in my own house, but from the standpoint of electrical theory, it will work just fine, which unless I misunderstood, was the original question?
Actually, it is illegal to make any changes to the installed electrical system on your own (CYA: unless you are a Swiss certified electrician yourself). Yes, he will get busted and fined for doing that. Maybe not today, maybe not next week. The houses in Switzerland should be inspected every 10 or so years. Any unauthorized, non-code-adherent, self made, not signed off changes will be fined and immediately corrected, repaired or removed... at your cost. Including falsely wired lamps, etc.

I suggested at the beginning of this thread to plug in an extension cord - either with one socket or multiple sockets... done, easy.
JC

Addition: Please let me continue with: If he/anybody makes any changes to the installed electrical system - whether renting or own - and that change non-code-adherent or not signed off change is proved to be cause of a fire or other accident, any insurance company will not cover the damages.

2nd Addition: You may make any electrical changes yourself... IF you have the competence to do so. However, it must be checked and signed off by a Swiss certified electrician.
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