Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Housing in general  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 22.05.2014, 20:17
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,910
Groaned at 399 Times in 307 Posts
Thanked 16,862 Times in 9,510 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insurance]

Had a letter from the Fribourg ECAB re updating the assurance des bâtiments on our property. Evidently it hasn't been done since 1984! I've got to send back the card and they'll then get in touch about arranging an appointment to come and see the property, but what sort of things are they looking at? I've got a copy of the old ECAB taxation form, but that's it. I assume it's something to do with how much it would cost to rebuild the property if it burnt down as we've been paying our cantonal insurance since we moved in.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 22.05.2014, 20:23
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

We had the same thing after we moved here. Again, it had not been done for decades. It's also very much got to do with how much tax you pay- what the rent would be if you rented. It can raise your tax significantly, especially if improvements have been made, new kitchen, another bathroom, etc, etc, and if prices have gone up significantly in your area too. Partly based on surface and volume, and quality/luxury (decor, bathrooms,kitchen, etc, etc) - they basically look at everything... and decide the rental value- which determines the amount of tax to pay. They will have all the measurements already of course- and a very good knowledge of local prices- but want to determine whether it is a 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5 * type of property.

We were able to barter hard and get the figure they came up with significantly, because a large % of voume is not used, and because part of our house is used for caricative purpose. Speaking the language really helped.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 22.05.2014, 20:58
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,910
Groaned at 399 Times in 307 Posts
Thanked 16,862 Times in 9,510 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

Darn, language isn't going to help us. I'm going to have to ask for someone who speaks reasonable English as our spoken French is practically non-existent.

Sounds as if it's somewhat similar to the form I had to fill in for our tax returns after we first moved in. Room dimensions, did we have the benefit of street lightning, were windows single/double glazed, etc. That was used to assess the theoretical rental value for taxation purposes. We did quite well out of it actually, the value it worked out at was much less than we paid to buy the property so it gives us a negative figure on our wealth side for tax.

On the blurb we got from the estate agent before buying there are 3 hypothécaires dated 1970, 1985 and 1990 under droit de gage, but what they were for I don't know. Nothing in the house is particularly new. House was built in 1950, but the kitchen/bathroom could be any of those 3 dates. No dates on the appliances and I don't have any manuals for them either.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Medea Fleecestealer for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 22.05.2014, 21:13
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 12,659
Groaned at 205 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 20,685 Times in 8,522 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

Quote:
View Post
Darn, language isn't going to help us. I'm going to have to ask for someone who speaks reasonable English as our spoken French is practically non-existent.

Sounds as if it's somewhat similar to the form I had to fill in for our tax returns after we first moved in. Room dimensions, did we have the benefit of street lightning, were windows single/double glazed, etc. That was used to assess the theoretical rental value for taxation purposes. We did quite well out of it actually, the value it worked out at was much less than we paid to buy the property so it gives us a negative figure on our wealth side for tax.
The value they attribute to a property for the theoretical rental value is always less than the actual value if the property, it's usually something around 6o% of the actual value. I think what Odile us describing is the visit to estimate that.

The estimation for the cantonal insurance is completely different and is basically to assess the property for the cantonal buildings insurance policy. They check the boiler type, fuse box, what the kitchen is made from ( if the work tops are granite etc), open fireplaces etc and score each thing on a form. They then do some sort if calculation involving the total volume of the property to work out how much you have to pay annually for the cantonal insurance.

It's all or sty straightforward really and whilst it may be useful to be able to speak to them in French you don't need to be particularly fluent.

Depending on when it is I could come and translate for you.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Belgianmum for this useful post:
  #5  
Old 22.05.2014, 21:25
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

The Ecap never came to estimate actually. But you are right BM, they will probably have a separate visit for the 'estimation cadastrale' to value the rentable value and tax. We managed to cut their valuation by over 1/3 which was good.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 22.05.2014, 21:39
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 12,659
Groaned at 205 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 20,685 Times in 8,522 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

Quote:
The Ecap never came to estimate actually. But you are right BM, they will probably have a separate visit for the 'estimation cadastrale' to value the rentable value and tax. We managed to cut their valuation by over 1/3 which was good.
Yes we had two separate visits.

Medea may not actually have a new visit for the estimation cadastrale if she filled out the forms and they attributed a value to the property. The guy who came to us said it could be twenty or thirty years before the came to reassess it unless there were any major works carried out in the meantime.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 22.05.2014, 21:41
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

As out property had been owned by same owner for about 450 years ( the Reformed Church )- they came to see what's what after we'd been here for a few months.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 23.05.2014, 08:58
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,910
Groaned at 399 Times in 307 Posts
Thanked 16,862 Times in 9,510 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

BelgianMum, they've asked me to send the card back to make an appointment so I assume it's because they want to come and look at the house.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 23.05.2014, 10:21
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 12,659
Groaned at 205 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 20,685 Times in 8,522 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

Quote:
View Post
BelgianMum, they've asked me to send the card back to make an appointment so I assume it's because they want to come and look at the house.
Yes they will come and look at the house to determine the value for the buildings insurance policy. ( it's called ECAP here but I guess it's ECAB in Fribourg).
This is not the same thing as the estimation for the 'cadastre' for the tax authorities.

Generally the insurance assessors come around once and make a note of all the appliances , equipment etc ( basically everything that is fixed and can't be removed) in the house then they give it a code for the insurance and you receive the bill to pay the annual premiums every year thereafter. They adjust the premiums annually in line with inflation etc according to the cantonal policy. This insurance is obligatory here for homeowners ( and in most of Romandie I believe) and covers rebuild costs in case of fire and other stuff ( can't remember what exactly.
Once you've been assessed they don't usually visit again but you do have the periodic inspections by the fire service and they pass on their findings to the ECAP people.. Our neighbour who is part of the fire service inspection team said they may visit to assess again if you have a new boiler fitted or major works on the house or in older properties if the building changes ownership.

It's not a big deal, they just go round noting things down, make a calculation and tell you who much your annual premium will be at the end if it all.

The big deal visit is the cadastral one but as I said in my previous post you may not necessarily be visited by them if they were happy with the information you put on your form and gave you a valuation based on that. They may randomly decide to visit at some stage especially if they see you've made improvements to the house but it's not a given.
This is the visit Odile was referring to in her first post but it's not the visit you will be having now.

Last edited by Belgianmum; 23.05.2014 at 10:43.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Belgianmum for this useful post:
  #10  
Old 23.05.2014, 10:46
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,910
Groaned at 399 Times in 307 Posts
Thanked 16,862 Times in 9,510 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

Um yes, that might be what's triggered this. We bought the house from the children of a woman who'd died so ECAB may have not inspected while they had it. Not sure how long it was from when she died until they sold it, but they probably saw the same surname so didn't follow up on her death.

So we're likely to see firemen too at some point are we? What will they be looking at/for?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 23.05.2014, 11:06
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 12,659
Groaned at 205 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 20,685 Times in 8,522 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What to expect - Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments

Quote:
View Post

So we're likely to see firemen too at some point are we? What will they be looking at/for?
The firemen just come and look at the boiler, fuse box, open fire, chimney and outside barbecues if you have one and tick a box on the form to say it's in order ( or not). They check if you've had the chimney swept I believe too.
Here we have to have a fire extinguisher too so they check that and make sure it's in date/ been serviced etc. The letter they sent telling us when they were coming gave all the information about what the requirements were. We wouldn't have had a fire extinguisher otherwise as it never entered our heads to get one although we had installed smoke detectors which are actually not part of the requirements.

Don't get too excited about the visit though, they don't send out the hunky young men to do the job but rather the older not fit for active service pen pushing firemen.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 23.05.2014, 11:23
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

They may also look at separating fire risk areas to stop spread in case of a fire. Friends of mine had a visit recently and had to replace some old doors with fireproof ones, and put a firewall near the boiler in cellar to stop possible spread to rest of house.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 23.05.2014, 11:30
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 12,659
Groaned at 205 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 20,685 Times in 8,522 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

Quote:
They may also look at separating fire risk areas to stop spread in case of a fire. Friends of mine had a visit recently and had to replace some old doors with fireproof ones, and put a firewall near the boiler in cellar to stop possible spread to rest of house.
Yes they look for that on the fire inspection visit.
We have the special door on the room where our boiler is and I think it must be a fairly recent requirement as our builder said they were lots more expensive than the ones they used previously.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 23.05.2014, 12:02
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,910
Groaned at 399 Times in 307 Posts
Thanked 16,862 Times in 9,510 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

Yes, we've got doors on all the rooms as this house isn't open plan, but they're just ordinary ones, same with the one in the boiler room. We've got a small fire extinguisher, but I'm not sure if it's still within its use by date or not. Better check on that.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 23.05.2014, 12:26
ecb's Avatar
ecb ecb is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: out n about - it's summer!
Posts: 2,183
Groaned at 8 Times in 8 Posts
Thanked 3,527 Times in 1,311 Posts
ecb has a reputation beyond reputeecb has a reputation beyond reputeecb has a reputation beyond reputeecb has a reputation beyond reputeecb has a reputation beyond reputeecb has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

Regarding the fire inspection - if there is anything that does not conform, they will give you a chance to put it right - you won't be thrown in jail straight away!

The visit from the (youngish and in uniform!) fire officer was actually very useful as we discussed quite a few things including special measures to take in my youngest son's room as the officer thought to ask the question (which embarrassingly I as his mother had never thought to ask) "would he tell you if there was smoke or smouldering (or even a fire ) in his room?" To which the answer was, "i'm not terribly sure - but probably not" . We are getting a smoke alarm in there which will also ring on a monitor in my bedroom. A fire in a kids' room is unlikely but it only needs to happen once ...

And yesterday we had our buildings insurance visit - again just a look see, nothing very tricky but useful in that he pointed out a couple of things that are not covered by the buildings insurance for which we will have to get separate insurance and if we had not had this conversation, I doubt we would have twigged.

So all in all, constructive visits even if they lead eventually to bills ..
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank ecb for this useful post:
  #16  
Old 23.05.2014, 12:45
Belgianmum's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Neuchâtel
Posts: 12,659
Groaned at 205 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 20,685 Times in 8,522 Posts
Belgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond reputeBelgianmum has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

Quote:
View Post

And yesterday we had our buildings insurance visit - again just a look see, nothing very tricky but useful in that he pointed out a couple of things that are not covered by the buildings insurance for which we will have to get separate insurance and if we had not had this conversation, I doubt we would have twigged.

So all in all, constructive visits even if they lead eventually to bills ..
Yes I remember that bit of the conversation but I can't remember exactly what the things were. I know that we discussed a plane falling from the sky and landing on the house ( not very likely I know) but I can't remember whether that was covered or not now.
I know that we already had cover for the things that are not covered as we'd already been though all the stuff with our regular insurance broker.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 27.08.2014, 09:24
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,910
Groaned at 399 Times in 307 Posts
Thanked 16,862 Times in 9,510 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

Well, I've finally heard back from them and have an appointment in a couple of weeks' time. It'll be interesting to hear what they say. At the moment I've got both a wonkey boiler and oven.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10.09.2014, 19:07
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,910
Groaned at 399 Times in 307 Posts
Thanked 16,862 Times in 9,510 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

Well, we had our visitors today and it all went well. They had a look around, checked boiler but didn't really worry about how it works, looked over the various rooms and measured outside dimenisons of the property. Calculated rebuild cost is a bit more than we paid for the property which is good and it seems we might even get a reduction on what we currently pay for the ECAB insurance. We'll find out when they send the documents through in about a week or so.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Medea Fleecestealer for this useful post:
  #19  
Old 29.09.2015, 16:08
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: gruyere
Posts: 124
Groaned at 51 Times in 43 Posts
Thanked 38 Times in 21 Posts
bainzy is considered a nuisancebainzy is considered a nuisancebainzy is considered a nuisance
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

Does anyone know who is responsible for the kitchen units in case of a fire, looking at ECAB's site they say no, insurance household and contents also say no, so anyone, any ideas???
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 29.09.2015, 16:11
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,786
Groaned at 99 Times in 88 Posts
Thanked 19,577 Times in 8,681 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Estimation cantonal d'assurance des bâtiments [cantonal visit for building insura

Quote:
View Post
Does anyone know who is responsible for the kitchen units in case of a fire, looking at ECAB's site they say no, insurance household and contents also say no, so anyone, any ideas???
Your own or rented?
Cause of fire? You or a defect?
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cantonal Tax Nickolus Finance/banking/taxation 1 02.06.2012 11:22
Cantonal Tax??? vickis Finance/banking/taxation 3 03.03.2011 21:53
Cantonal Tax Offices Richard Finance/banking/taxation 15 18.05.2010 10:55
cantonal rules danny Permits/visas/government 5 08.12.2006 16:29


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:56.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0