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Old 21.12.2014, 16:24
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Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

Hello everyone,

I am starting a new job in Opfikon, and am looking to relocate in the Zurich area

I am single, less than 30 and would like to be quite close my workplace. I am hesitating between living in Opfikon and either center or noth of Zurich and would like your point of view to make up my mind.

- I prefer city and international atmosphere over farm/village/nature
- I don't need to have many restaurants/bar in the neighbourhood, but I like supermarkets open after 19h, and fitness club open until 22h
- Fresh markets (fruits...) the weekend is a plus
- I would like to go to downtown on weekends and still come home without having to wait 1h the next train/bus in the cold


Which leads to the following questions:
- Apart from the rent, is life (food, gym...) cheaper in Opfikon compared to Zurich?
- I read that Seebach is very quiet, is Oerlikon/Glattburg more busy?
- How frequent are the night transports? There a several lines from Central to Oerlikon/Seebach, whereas there are only 2 going to Glattburg, Opfikon...
- I am struggling to compute the tax thing as the two following websites yield to a significant tax gap. If we take for example a 100k annual salary, what would be the tax difference between Zurich and Opfikon?

http://www.homegate.ch/moving/planni...ewcity=Opfikon
https://www.ethz.ch/en/the-eth-zuric...alculator.html

Thank you all !
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Old 21.12.2014, 16:38
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

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Hello everyone,

I am starting a new job in Opfikon, and am looking to relocate in the Zurich area

I am single, less than 30 and would like to be quite close my workplace. I am hesitating between living in Opfikon and either center or noth of Zurich and would like your point of view to make up my mind.

- I prefer city and international atmosphere over farm/village/nature
- I don't need to have many restaurants/bar in the neighbourhood, but I like supermarkets open after 19h, and fitness club open until 22h
- Fresh markets (fruits...) the weekend is a plus
- I would like to go to downtown on weekends and still come home without having to wait 1h the next train/bus in the cold


Which leads to the following questions:
- Apart from the rent, is life (food, gym...) cheaper in Opfikon compared to Zurich?
- I read that Seebach is very quiet, is Oerlikon/Glattburg more busy?
- How frequent are the night transports? There a several lines from Central to Oerlikon/Seebach, whereas there are only 2 going to Glattburg, Opfikon...
- I am struggling to compute the tax thing as the two following websites yield to a significant tax gap. If we take for example a 100k annual salary, what would be the tax difference between Zurich and Opfikon?

http://www.homegate.ch/moving/planni...ewcity=Opfikon
https://www.ethz.ch/en/the-eth-zuric...alculator.html

Thank you all !
Then you're coming to the wrong country. Most shops, supermarkets included, shut at the latest at 7pm most days. Usually there's one late night (9pm) shopping day, they'll close around 4/5pm on Saturdays and not be open at all on Sundays. Zurich seems to be a bit better with closing times (Migros supermarkets at least) at 8pm weekdays and 6pm on Saturdays.

And fitness clubs are rarely open past 10pm if they're even open that late.
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Old 21.12.2014, 16:45
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

The Coop opposite HB in Zürich is open until 10pm most days, so late evening shopping isn't a major problem.

Take a look at the zvv.ch website for info on public transport. By and large, transport throughout the city is fast and frequent, and the night bus network is good but costs an extra CHF 5 on top of your usual fare.
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Old 21.12.2014, 16:55
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

Oerlikon seems to be most suitable from the information you have provided. Be careful of the advice from the folks living in the red neck places (anywhere out side Zurich) as Züri is a very different beast. There are also shops at the airport which is one stop on the train from Oerlikon and are opened at "swiss" unsocial hours, The connections to the city are very good and music events are also on your doorstep.



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Old 21.12.2014, 17:33
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

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Then you're coming to the wrong country. Most shops, supermarkets included, shut at the latest at 7pm most days. Usually there's one late night (9pm) shopping day, they'll close around 4/5pm on Saturdays and not be open at all on Sundays. Zurich seems to be a bit better with closing times (Migros supermarkets at least) at 8pm weekdays and 6pm on Saturdays.

And fitness clubs are rarely open past 10pm if they're even open that late.
Uh....that depends. Some of this is quite true, but the closer you live the Zurich, the later things seem to be open.
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Old 21.12.2014, 18:30
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

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Uh....that depends. Some of this is quite true, but the closer you live the Zurich, the later things seem to be open.
Checked opening times for several Migros in and around Zurich and also some fitness clubs. Only found one that was open past 10pm and that was one night only until 11pm. Another closed at 9.30pm every night.

Don't know where the OP is moving from, but you should remember that most people finish work around 4-5pm so even with shops closing at 7-8 there's plenty of time left to get the things you need. If your new firm runs flexy-time then you can go in early and finish early.
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Old 21.12.2014, 18:44
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

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Then you're coming to the wrong country. Most shops, supermarkets included, shut at the latest at 7pm most days. Usually there's one late night (9pm) shopping day, they'll close around 4/5pm on Saturdays and not be open at all on Sundays. Zurich seems to be a bit better with closing times (Migros supermarkets at least) at 8pm weekdays and 6pm on Saturdays.

And fitness clubs are rarely open past 10pm if they're even open that late.
Many Migros close at 8pm, which is fine with me.
http://filialen.migros.ch/fr/#/Zuerich-Flurstr./4797095

Fitness closing at 10pm is also fine.

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Take a look at the zvv.ch website for info on public transport. By and large, transport throughout the city is fast and frequent, and the night bus network is good but costs an extra CHF 5 on top of your usual fare.
Ok, good to know

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Oerlikon seems to be most suitable from the information you have provided. Be careful of the advice from the folks living in the red neck places (anywhere out side Zurich) as Züri is a very different beast. There are also shops at the airport which is one stop on the train from Oerlikon and are opened at "swiss" unsocial hours, The connections to the city are very good and music events are also on your doorstep.
Oerlikon seems indeed to be a good comprise given my criterias. I'm just trying to balance the pro/cons with Opfikon since rent are significantly more expensive.

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Uh....that depends. Some of this is quite true, but the closer you live the Zurich, the later things seem to be open.
Ok thx.

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Checked opening times for several Migros in and around Zurich and also some fitness clubs. Only found one that was open past 10pm and that was one night only until 11pm. Another closed at 9.30pm every night.

Don't know where the OP is moving from, but you should remember that most people finish work around 4-5pm so even with shops closing at 7-8 there's plenty of time left to get the things you need. If your new firm runs flexy-time then you can go in early and finish early.
I have not started my new job yet, but I expect long working hours. However if everything closes at 19h, I think I could reasonably leave at least once a week early.

What about the atmosphere, which places are the most lively?
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Old 21.12.2014, 18:58
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

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What about the atmosphere, which places are the most lively?

Where you moving from ? .. Lively is relative, by Swiss standards its lively out that part of Zurich but not very swiss if that makes any sense

If this kind of lively is more your thing



Then you need to live else where
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Old 21.12.2014, 19:04
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

Oerlikon would be a good place to be but depends on what area to be honest. There are bits of Oerlikon which are well out in the sticks so I'd look closely.

We live halfway between Seebach tram station and Glattbrugg/Opfikon train stations. It's worked well in the last two years as a 7-8 minute walk gets us to either of the stations mentioned above...trains are basically every 15 mins and gets you to town in 10. Trams are every 7 mins but takes about 18 mins into the HB. If you like taking cabs, it's about 35 bucks on a night out which isn't so bad either.

No cafes or restaurants that are really walkable except those in Oerlikon or Glattpark but you can easily get into town for those.

Major upside to living in Seebach/Oerlikon is really cheaper rent and more space.

We used to live in Kreis 3 which was great for walking into town but we paid a lot more rent on an apartment that's older and smaller than the one we are in now.
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Old 21.12.2014, 23:05
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

Is there any website to search flats directly on a map ? It is tedious to check individually the address and distance to my desired tramway lines.

I realise that there are very few modern 2 rooms flats around Oerlikon. How long does it take to find an apartment in Zurich?
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Old 22.12.2014, 00:13
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

If you are young urban usual,kind of guy, anywherre in Zürich will do. Just pay attention to the immediate surrounding for noise issues when you visit. Otherwise, you'll have to deal with what is available, so know the difference between chosing and being picky.
Make sure you have all the paper ready to send for application, otherwise you'll be rejected just for a missing A4 or a missing working permit.
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Old 22.12.2014, 08:11
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

I dream of finishing work at 4-5pm.

The bigger supermarkets close at 8pm - there are also small shops of the Coop Pronto variety that open until 10 - mainly located near rail stations. If you work in Opfikon chances are you will travelling to/from work by train - so shopping after work will be no problem.

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Checked opening times for several Migros in and around Zurich and also some fitness clubs. Only found one that was open past 10pm and that was one night only until 11pm. Another closed at 9.30pm every night.

Don't know where the OP is moving from, but you should remember that most people finish work around 4-5pm so even with shops closing at 7-8 there's plenty of time left to get the things you need. If your new firm runs flexy-time then you can go in early and finish early.
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Old 22.12.2014, 08:25
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

Another vote for Oerlikon from me.

Plenty of fitness centres (for example the one in Swissotel is open 24 hours).

The Coop opposite the station is open until 10 every night, and a new shopping area inside the station is currently being built (to make Oerlikon more of a travel hub) so I would guess those hours will probably extend to 23:00 at some point.

There is already shopping at the station on Sundays too, which anyone who lives in Zurich will tell you is very handy!

Aside from all of that, it's a fun place to live, a few nice bars and restaurants and you can be at the main station in 5 mins now, thanks to the new train line. Trains, trams and buses run to Oerlikon, so you'll never have problems getting back at night - a taxi from around the main station will run you 20-25chf, so not the end of the world if you end up out until the small hours in town!
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Old 22.12.2014, 09:52
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

A website for searching flats that I would recommend is http://www.homegate.ch/. They had a good map search, but now I see that they have changed their website and it seems that that option is missing currently.

As for how long it takes to find an apartment, it really depends on how picky you are and also how lucky you will get with the real estate agency.
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Is there any website to search flats directly on a map ? It is tedious to check individually the address and distance to my desired tramway lines.

I realise that there are very few modern 2 rooms flats around Oerlikon. How long does it take to find an apartment in Zurich?
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Old 22.12.2014, 23:01
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

Thank you all for your help.

Oerlikon seems to be the good deal, however there are very few modern apartments available in the [40m²;60m²] range, so I am afraid it might take a while to find something. What about Opfikon, does everything closes really sooner?

Why most flats I see don't have a separate kitchen, is it the standard in Switzerland?
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Old 23.12.2014, 08:11
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

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Thank you all for your help.

Oerlikon seems to be the good deal, however there are very few modern apartments available in the [40m²;60m²] range, so I am afraid it might take a while to find something. What about Opfikon, does everything closes really sooner?

Why most flats I see don't have a separate kitchen, is it the standard in Switzerland?
You are not looking for an apartment at a good time, many contracts say you can't move in December. You may get a better selection in January, but more will come in Febuary. Maybe you could do a flat share until you find what you really want.
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Old 24.12.2014, 08:02
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

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... there are very few modern apartments available in the [40m²;60m²] range...

Why most flats I see don't have a separate kitchen, is it the standard in Switzerland?
Most modern build apartments tend to favour an open plan living room / kitchen, makes more of the space and gives the place a more spacious and well lit feel.

If you want a separate kitchen, you'll probably need to look at properties built before 2000, maybe even earlier.
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Old 25.12.2014, 18:26
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

Okay thanks for the tip, I'll look for older properties. I find so much more convenient to have a separate kitchen, isolating noise and smell.

Is there any good shareflat website? I'm moving in Zurich in February, so I hope to find more flats in the coming month.
Is there a strong competition to get a flat, is it the highest revenue who wins, how does it work usually?
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Old 25.12.2014, 19:07
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

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Okay thanks for the tip, I'll look for older properties. I find so much more convenient to have a separate kitchen, isolating noise and smell.

Is there any good shareflat website? I'm moving in Zurich in February, so I hope to find more flats in the coming month.
Is there a strong competition to get a flat, is it the highest revenue who wins, how does it work usually?
Have a look at this one:

http://www.wgzimmer.ch/wgzimmer.html?wc_country=ch
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Old 28.12.2014, 22:07
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Re: Another expat in Zurich, which district should I live?

hello Draknof

there's been provided various single infos, but I try here to give a comprehensive overview, also for anyone else with the question "in which district should I live?".

First, some general information:

- Basically, in Switzerland, all towns, villages and city districts are of a mixed nature: there exist of course more upscale or more downscale environments, but you will find in every upscale area also some people with ordinary income living there, and in every downscale area also wealthy people. There are no "ghettos" with purely one kind of housing and one kind of people like in many other countries.

- It's everywhere in the country safe to walk home alone at night. Safety is not really something that should influence on the choice of the place of living because it is everywhere pretty the same. Very rarely it happens that at a certain train station of a village in the country-side a small group of bored teenagers emerges which likes to hang out there and might behave sometimes a little bit nasty. And there is probably only one street in the whole country (Langstrasse, Zürich, red light district) which while not being really unsafe might rather not be recommendable for families for living.

- As a general rule, infrastructure and mobility in cities and villages in Switzerland is better, than in places of the same size in most other countries. So you can enjoy a calm environment in the country-side, but still be pretty well served in many aspects of life there.

- If you on the other hand really like a big-city environment, living close to the center of Zürich is pretty much the only option in the whole country to get close to that lifestyle. It's not London, Moscow or NYC, but it's much more than cities of the same size offer in most countries.

- Swiss people, no matter how wealthy, all rely on public schools for their children. They are good and that's the way it works here. The priorities and the system might be different than in many other countries, but big multinational companies moving to Switzerland always emphasize that the well-educated pool of local human resources is one of the most important assets which influenced their move - so, it can't be that bad. ;-) Switzerland is since more than a century internationally famous for its private schools, but it's basically a business oriented with nearly exclusively foreign clients. Only a very small number of Swiss children visit such private schools - they are mostly children from rich families with learning problems like dyslexia who are not be able to get the desired degree in the public school. So, in Switzerland, in opposite to most other countries, a degree from a public school has actually a higher value than one from a private school! The only thing that (foreign) parents have to consider is the choice of residence when their children are entering Primary School at the age of seven. The children have to attend the assigned school in the area of residency of the parents. Now, there are some areas especially in big cities like Zürich where the percentage of (foreign) children with low language skills entering the school system is 50% or even much more. In such cases, the quality of the lectures can be impacted in a negative way and some children are underchallenged. Of course, there are initiatives to overcome this problem with special courses for foreign children at kindergarten-age, but to this date it is still an issue.

- In Switzerland, the big majority of people are renting their flat, especially in cities only a very small number of people own their housing, even though, ownership has been increasing recently.

- Switzerland is basically a free market economy, but there are several areas with quite extensive socialistic elements and the residential market is certainly one of them. The laws and regulations are quite unfavourable for landlords of residential buildings. Furthermore the percentage of subsidised housing is quite high. This is a disadvantage for foreigners. Landlords often don't have much possibilites of manoeuvre with prices/revenues, so they focus on the cost side. This means their ideal tenant should belong to a group of people who causes almost no administrative work, doesn't break things (no repairs), has a steady income and stays in the apartment as long as possible (again because of the administrative hassle and the possible vacancy time). In subsidised housing, there are additional political criteria. Men, singles and non-locals are discriminated in comparison with women, families, and locals (and friends of existing residents). The number of available flats in the free market is in most cities really low because of the high amount of subsidised flats and unfavourable laws for landlords. They don't have enough incentives to build new housing. Not enough residential space is built for the free market and this is for foreigners mostly the only option as subsidised flats are as mentioned mostly only for locals. It's a typical example why socialism and nationalism sooner or later always come hand in hand. I don't want to discourage people, many expats have found great places and are happy with it. But the situation on the residential market could be better with different kind of laws and policies. But that will not happen soon as the political scene in the big cities is since several decades dominated by left-wing parties.

- The last train/tram/bus from the center of Zurich in any direction in the city and canton and beyond runs somewhere between 0:00 and 0:45. On Friday and Saturday night, there are night trains and night buses in any direction within the city, the canton and beyond once per hour (with a surplus charge of CHF 5.- valid the whole night).

- The longest shopping hours you find normally at train stations, especially Zürich HB and Zürich Airport. But there are also a few 24h-hour shops at Langstrasse, plus at some gas stations. Grocery stores and shopping centers especially in urban areas are slowly, but gradually expanding their working hours.
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