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Old 11.02.2015, 14:55
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Giving up..

Hi everyone,

After two years searching for a bigger appartment in the center of Luzern, nothing has changed. I have sent no less that fifty aplications, with the corresponding updated betreibungauszug and it's costs, all the documents required, recommendation letters from my office, the parent's of my daughter's swiss friends and still nothing..

I called this morning to the Luzernerpensionkasse in order to visit an appartment that appeared yesterday night and the lady, that already met me in other occasions while showing other appartments for which i applied but was rejected, advised me that it was already rented.. The add appeared around 18.00PM, i called at 08.40AM today.. and the flat is already gone..

I have to say that today i feel really, really bad.. I am a well educated person, with a PhD in Biochemistry, single mother of a 5 years old girl, i have a good salary, non smoker, i only drink socially, i enjoy reading, nerd computer games, cooking sometimes,.. and i am only seeking a bigger appartment in order to be able to have a proper life with my daughter, work, help her with her homework, invite from time to time her friends to spend the afternoon with us.. but i am always rejected.. I used to be strong but today, today i feel total and completely defeated..
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Old 11.02.2015, 14:59
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Re: Giving up..

Don't give up...

Soon is the big moving date of March + April. Keep looking. If you give up now the next available opportunity is September / October.
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Old 11.02.2015, 15:01
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Re: Giving up..

+1

Don't give up an hopefully you can find a new flat!

Good Luck!
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Old 11.02.2015, 15:15
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Re: Giving up..

It sounds like it isn't personal (although hard not to feel like it is) and maybe in the pecking order a single parent isn't as attractive a tenant as dink's or sink's, so maybe you are already at a disadvantage. It probably isn't what you want to hear but if it's a landlords market, then the best option is to look slightly further a field, does it have to be central Luzern?.
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Old 11.02.2015, 15:33
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Re: Giving up..

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It sounds like it isn't personal (although hard not to feel like it is) and maybe in the pecking order a single parent isn't as attractive a tenant as dink's or sink's, so maybe you are already at a disadvantage. It probably isn't what you want to hear but if it's a landlords market, then the best option is to look slightly further a field, does it have to be central Luzern?.
I would not mind to change the neighborhood but then they will change my daughter's school and i cannot make her pass through more stressful changes..

And yes, at the very begining i tried not to take it personal.. They are running a business and they make the rules of their business.. But still..

Thank you for your comments and support..
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Old 11.02.2015, 16:17
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Re: Giving up..

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I would not mind to change the neighborhood but then they will change my daughter's school and i cannot make her pass through more stressful changes..

And yes, at the very begining i tried not to take it personal.. They are running a business and they make the rules of their business.. But still..

Thank you for your comments and support..
I know how you feel. I've been looking for a flat, any flat! and I'm always amazed that the flat is gone or there are already 20 people who have applied one day after the ad is up. In my case I know it's because I've been looking at lower price ranges. I've had to up my price to get an apartment and I KNOW I'm paying too much for it. Sigh.

My only suggestion for you is for you to stress the fact that you have a child in the school district you are looking in. I lost an apartment just for that reason. It was out in a village, but still, the management company told me they choose the family with the child at the near by school so that the child could stay in school.

If you are not stressing that point already, start doing so.


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Good afternoon,

Thank you very much for this advice. I always stay and try to speak either to the immobilien person's, either to the person living in the flat but still no luck.

All my entourage knows that i am searching for an appartment, all my daughter's parents, the teachers, the betreuung's carers as well, in my job they print me recommendation letters but i see that they have started to "pff.. it's her again.."

I will see how long i can stand this situation but i have started to think to go back to my country.. This might not have been the right choice to raise my daughter..
Recommendation letters? Really? Is that needed? Are you maybe giving them too much paper work?

Anyway, if you do need letters of recommendation ask them not to be dated or use the same ones. You don't need a new one for every application.
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Old 11.02.2015, 15:34
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Re: Giving up..

Dont give up. As mentioned earlier, March will be the moving time, so there shall be more property on the market.
When i needed to find a new flat some time ago, i was also getting very frustrated when every application i sent got rejected. Back then, with L permit only, it looked almost impossible to get something. But eventually i got a flat.
I hope you will be able to find a new nice flat for your and your daughter very soon.
Fingers crossed and good luck!
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Old 11.02.2015, 15:36
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Re: Giving up..

Have you told people about your search? If not, let people, especially locals, know you're looking. Sometimes it helps to find something through connections.
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Old 11.02.2015, 16:50
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Re: Giving up..

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...two years searching for a bigger appartment in the center of Luzern...
In addition to what others have said above, is it possible you're searching for a flat that's too large? Sounds silly but if it's "only" you and your daughter and you're applying for a place with 3 bedrooms the landlords may feel it best to give to a larger family with more children. I have no idea what you've been looking for so I could be way off-base. It's just a thought. Good luck!
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Old 11.02.2015, 18:12
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Re: Giving up..

Thank you Makas.. This are very positive and persistent tips.

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In addition to what others have said above, is it possible you're searching for a flat that's too large? Sounds silly but if it's "only" you and your daughter and you're applying for a place with 3 bedrooms the landlords may feel it best to give to a larger family with more children. I have no idea what you've been looking for so I could be way off-base. It's just a thought. Good luck!
I applied for all the 2 rooms flat, 2.5 and 3 rooms flats. More would be too much for me and i am willing to pay until CHF 1'400.00, CHF 1'500.00. There are very nice flats in this area for this price. I can say that i was rejected from 2 i visited, the same re-appeared a few months later on Comparis and Tutti, i re-applied and was re-rejected.

This might sound crazy and unreal, but it's true.. After what happened today i could not contain the tears.. It cannot be true.. This cannot be happening to me or to anybody.. 2 years working and searching and with a kind and yes, i focus on the fact that i already know the neighborhood and that i work in the same area, and that my daughter is attending this neighbourhood kindergarten... But nothing.. i undersand their policy of "Swiss people first" but.. that's incredible.

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Old 13.02.2015, 08:29
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Re: Giving up..

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Thank you Makas.. This are very positive and persistent tips.



I applied for all the 2 rooms flat, 2.5 and 3 rooms flats. More would be too much for me and i am willing to pay until CHF 1'400.00, CHF 1'500.00. There are very nice flats in this area for this price. I can say that i was rejected from 2 i visited, the same re-appeared a few months later on Comparis and Tutti, i re-applied and was re-rejected.

This might sound crazy and unreal, but it's true.. After what happened today i could not contain the tears.. It cannot be true.. This cannot be happening to me or to anybody.. 2 years working and searching and with a kind and yes, i focus on the fact that i already know the neighborhood and that i work in the same area, and that my daughter is attending this neighbourhood kindergarten... But nothing.. i undersand their policy of "Swiss people first" but.. that's incredible.

Sorry to hear about your problems, OP.
I have to say that your restrictions for the new flat you're looking for are not going to take you anywhere IMHO.
You limit your searches to a very small area which happens to be central, thus making things 5 times more difficult, and to a a very tight budget. And...you're not Swiss. You have no idea how well networking functions here. I was happy when I found our new apartment only to realise that for the same area and similar standards I could have found a cheaper one, had I had the right connections or networking.
Recently one of my Swiss friends asked me if I want to move in a bigger place...she had heard of an apartment in the vicinity of my current one and guess what, I felt frustrated we pay double for what we have now (slightly better conditions though, but anyway).Just saying..how things appear to function for a certain price range.

Btw, your daughter is still in kindergarten, do you think she could not adapt to a new place? I think she's still at an age when people adapt very easily to a new environment.

Last edited by greenmount; 13.02.2015 at 09:03.
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Old 13.02.2015, 09:01
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Re: Giving up..

OP I'm sorry you're in such a difficult spot. This is just my opinion, trying to put myself in your shoes. Sorry if I ramble a bit but hopefully it will make sense.

I'd give up on the current search - but only to expand it to a little further out of the town center. I know you don't want to change your daughter's school because you're worried it will disrupt her. However she is old enough now to pick up on how stressed out you are trying to find a new flat, and that part of the "problem" is finding a flat that will keep her in her school.

Kids blame themselves for all kinds of stuff. It's not a stretch to think at some point she is going to feel bad, thinking she is causing your stress. It gets into a vicious circle - you feel bad you can't do what you think is best for her, and she feels bad for "causing" you stress.

Kids are adaptable. She may not like a new school at first but she will fit right in at such a young age and already having some time in Swiss schools. She'll pick up on the fact you're more relaxed.

I also know you want as much time with her as possible. That's understandable! However if giving up 10 more minutes commute each way means you have a better place to live and less stress, isn't it worth at least looking? It never hurts to have options.

Finally, I would not resign your current job without something else lined up. You say you "might" be able to get your old job back. The job market is just too competitive right now to take such risks. I would not quit what you have until you've got a new signed contract in your hands.

Hang in there and keep your eyes open to the possibilities. Sending you big, virtual hugs.
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Old 11.02.2015, 18:15
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Re: Giving up..

My hearts goes out to you and I send you a lot of positive energy in your search.
1) As amogles has pointed out make effort to chat with the land lord . Maybe you are not chatting enough. We had this problem. I realized my quiet husband was not impressing anyone with just simple handshake and then he would just look around the place.
When we went as a family, I made a lot if effort to chat. Even now the landlord calls on my mobile to discuss apartment related stuff..our landlord(s) are a couple ..mostly the lady calls me.

2) if possible while applying write a letter on how you and your daughter would be delighted to stay in the said appartment .

3) include a pic of you and your daughter ... As one of my friend did . They did not get the same apartment , but they were contacted first when another one became available.

4) you can put a wanted apartment notice at the local shopping center. We have one at COOP near my apartment and I keep seeing lot of such wanted and to let adverts.

All the best !!!
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Old 11.02.2015, 18:49
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Re: Giving up..

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They did not get the same apartment , but they were contacted first when another one became available.
This. OP, when you get rejected for an apartment, make sure to ask the agency for the reason and ask them to put you on their waiting list while reiterating your reasons as to why you'd like to rent from them. Many agencies have those lists and they will first consider people on those lists rather than people who apply to adverts on homegate etc.
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Old 11.02.2015, 18:57
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Re: Giving up..

what the other said.

Also, have you tried at any Genossenschaften?

They are not for profit and often socially inclined and being a single mother with a young daughter may tick the right boxes. Some don't advertise appartments but work purely from waiting lists. You don't need to be poor or anything to live in a Genossenschaft. On the contrary, some have very nice appartments.
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Old 11.02.2015, 19:24
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Re: Giving up..

congratulations on the decision to give up! now you have much more free time and less stress to deal with. plus you can probably save money by not moving into a bigger place!

but maybe some better opportunities will anyway come to you when you are not looking...
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Old 11.02.2015, 20:25
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Re: Giving up..

Cascabel, I really feel for you! Doing the rounds of looking for an appartment can be totally gruelling!

Others have suggested putting a photo of yourself on the application. I agree. And choose a plain passport-size photo but not necessarily as strict/serious as a passport photo. On that, I'd suggest you wear a shirt or blouse with a collar (rather than a T-shirt) but no jacket or blazer, no cleavage, nothing flashy, no "big" hair, not too much make-up. The "ideal" tenant could be one who causes no trouble, looks reasonable and sane, and who is approachable. Therefore, I recommend looking straight at the camera, a friendly smile but no laugh, with the kind of interested expression in your eyes that shows you can listen and would gladly help. That may sound over-the-top, but I think a good photo can positively influence people's decisions about you.

I also agree about not being passive, and phoning the person up the next day, to say you've considered the flat, and the journey to school and work, and you know they probably have many applicants, but you would like to confirm that you're very, very interested. Before making the call, check the date (rental start) they've advertised, and then say that date would work well for you. To be able to do this, when you are in the flat viewing, try to get the landlord/decision-maker's direct telephone number and email address, if possible, but at least be sure of his/her name.

Another aspect: When you are talking to the person showing the flat, and to the agents, are you speaking German? If so, good! If not, then it might be worth your while practicing this kind of conversation with a Swiss person. You know, even if you speak only a little German in general, with a weekend's worth of determination it might be possible to memorise the vocabulary and phrases for this specific interaction. Include some sentences about your learning German. If your daughter is attending a local Swiss government school, then it's a plus to mention that her German is fluent. If you speak no German at all, then at least practice being able to say these sentences in German: "Excuse me, do you speak English, please?" and: "I'm sorry, I don't speak German, but I'm learning."
Some landlords favour not so much Swiss people but people who can speak the local language, so that the neighbours can peacefully make arrangements with one another about sharing the laundry, parking the bicycles, etc., and so the tenants will understand letters from the landlord.

Another thought about your daughter: she is young, and unless she has a particular disability or inhibition, she will probably adapt to a change. Most children do.

You say you are unwilling to take her out of her school to move to a flat a bit further away, and yet you are also considering leaving Switzerland altogether. To my ears, this kind of discrepancy from an educated person as you are, sounds like you are totally exhausted and terribly, terribly disappointed. Yes, I think you must be feeling really disheartened. Once, when I reached that point during a flat-hunt, I gave up (the name of your thread) the search for a flat for a few months. I just decided to accept where I was living and not even to look at the ads, not to apply for anything, just to give my poor weary mind a break from it all. I promised myself it would be like a holiday from that topic, and I would go back and look again, later, (I set a date for myself) when I had more energy. Of course, I don't know your situation, and maybe doing that wouldn't be appropriate for you, but for me, taking that break probably saved my sanity at the time.

I wish you courage!
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Old 11.02.2015, 21:06
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Re: Giving up..

I really do not know how to thank you all for your comments..

And Doropfiz, you have just described my actual feelings.. i stopped looking in November, and started again this month, 3 aplications rejected in 10 days, a call made and no opportunity to even visit the flat.. I am exhausted.. I had to leave work today because i could not focus on my job during he morning. This call and the way this person, that knows me and saw me handing to her for three times all my dossier, told me that the flat was gone... completely destroyed me today. It was like she was telling me "i already told you three times no, what makes you think that you will have a yes this time?"

I started crying at my desk and i needed to leave because i needed to be able to compound myself again before taking my daughter this afternoon to get some "marronis" as i promised her this morning.

I thank you for all the tips, all positive and focused on the objective, but as per today i do not see myself checking any add or visiting an appartment again.

I am not a quiter, i have never had all the problems i am encountering here and i do not know what i will do the next weeks but I have already printed and signed my resignation letter as of February 27. I only hope to be a bit better tomorrow..
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Old 11.02.2015, 22:00
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Re: Giving up..

Agree with another poster about his comment "don't be passive"
I was 7 months pregnant and living in a 1 room apartment with my husband and I was getting so despressed and desperate to find something, ANYTHING, bigger than 10sq.m... It got the point where I would search 2-3 times a day any and all new listing on compairs, local supermarket boards, newspapers, etc. I made a spreadsheet on my computer and immediately called every single new place that opened up. It went from visiting and being rejected a few times a week... to a few times a day. And after about 40 visits in 1 week, we finally got a new place together (before the baby arrived ) Very difficult being new in a foreign land and very pregnant. Lots of places really prefer the money come in and the new neighbours never be heard. Good luck and chin up! *high5*
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Old 11.02.2015, 23:48
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Re: Giving up..

Are you registered in any Wohnungsgenossenschaft yet?
I know that in zürich it is possible to be in a genossenschaft even if you're not living in one of their flats but you also get the ads which are often not out in public.
If there is a genossenschaft with appartments in your area, it might be worth becoming a member if that's possible.

In a genossenschaft you also have better chances if you have a child.
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