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  #21  
Old 03.03.2015, 17:46
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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He can def join me, and work.
Please do let us know how that goes!
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  #22  
Old 03.03.2015, 17:54
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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I believe they refer to that as stockholm syndrome.
I also believe they refer to it as "being happy". I'll let you mull it over.
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  #23  
Old 03.03.2015, 18:13
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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I also believe they refer to it as "being happy". I'll let you mull it over.
Not when you start the statement with an apologetic list of negatives, including the system and the people, it's not. But confusion is to be expected in advanced stages of delusion, so it's ok.

I never said it's not a good place. Just if you have free choice of the world, why here. It's a perfectly legitimate question.
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  #24  
Old 03.03.2015, 18:15
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Don't listen to moaning expats who are so unhappy with the country or their own lives that they always feel the need to put the place down.
I like Switzerland.

BUT

The bureaucracy is an absolute nightmare! You can't reason with them or argue your case… well you can but you won't win!

The OP needs to be aware of 2 things.

1 She may need to come first, then apply for family reunification to allow her BF to join her.

2 As they are not married, a family reunification permit is not guaranteed … although having a child together may help!
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  #25  
Old 03.03.2015, 18:30
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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I like Switzerland.

BUT

The bureaucracy is an absolute nightmare!
Looks like you haven't lived in many countries, right?
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You can't reason with them or argue your case… well you can but you won't win!
In particular you won't get anywhere when trying to push your case by money, whereas in many countries that's where the whole game begins.
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  #26  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:15
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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I have researched all of this, and bringing my Br will not be a problem. He is also the father of an EU citizen, but that is just a bonus. He can def join me, and work. He can even bring his parents, if they depend on him.

What I do not know is,how easy it will be to rent an apartment
I'm sorry, but I think you're not correct. As an unmarried couple your only option is for you to apply for a concubine permit for him which means you need to be financially responsible for him for 5 years. It will grant him residence, not sure about work rights and it certainly won't allow him to bring his parents over. The fact that he is a father of an EU child means nothing. Note the first sentence in the link below:

"As cohabitation is not recognised in law, you and your partner are to a large extent treated as individuals and not as a married couple."

https://www.ch.ch/en/cohabiting

This gives Vaud's info on the concubine permit which may help.

http://www.vd.ch/themes/vie-privee/p...s-du-concubin/

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  #27  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:32
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Re: Renting if self-employed

Re the residency permits:

I am basic my information (partially) on the following research, mostly obtained from official sources.
EU/EFTA nationals
Persons who are not gainfully employed (e.g. retirees and students) may remain in Switzerland if the following conditions are met:

They have adequate financial resources to cover the cost of living in Switzerland so as to ensure that they will not become dependent on welfare benefits, and
They have a health insurance policy that also includes accident coverage.
Students must also show the letter confirming that they have been admitted to a recognised educational institution (confirmation of enrolment).
Stays of up to 90 days within a six-month period do not require authorisation. For longer stays, foreign nationals have to register with the cantonal migration office as a non-employed person. The corresponding EU/EFTA residence permit will remain valid for a period of five years
https://www.ch.ch/en/retirement-or-study-switzerland/

and
Citizens from EU-17 states and EU-8 states enjoy full freedom of movement. This means that citizens of those countries are free to travel to Switzerland, and to live and work here.
(I am an EU citizen)

and
Nationals from all EU/EFTA member states without gainful employment are entitled to a B permit if they can prove they have sufficient financial means and adequate health and accident insurance.
https://www.bfm.admin.ch/bfm/en/home...b_eu_efta.html

and
EU/EFTA citizens holding a Swiss residence permit may bring the following family members to Switzerland under the family reunification programme:

Spouse, registered partnership
Children and grandchildren under the age of 21 or older if you agree to pay their living expenses,
Parents and grandparents if their living expenses are covered.
If you are enrolled in an education and training programme, you may only bring your spouse, dependent children under the family reunification programme. Regardless of the nationality of the family member, he/she will receive an EU/EFTA residence permit (even if the person is a third-state national). This permit will have the same period of validity as your own residence permit. Family members may take up employment but must register with the cantonal immigration and labour market authorities.
https://www.ch.ch/en/family-reunification-eu-efta/
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  #28  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:36
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Re: Renting if self-employed

Yes you are fine as are your children, if you have the finances.

The keyword here is;

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Spouse
Your boyfriend is not your spouse.
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  #29  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:36
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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I have researched all of this, and bringing my Br will not be a problem. He is also the father of an EU citizen, but that is just a bonus. He can def join me, and work. He can even bring his parents, if they depend on him.

What I do not know is,how easy it will be to rent an apartment
I do hope you are right. If I were you though, I'd choose my canton carefully. It seems to be easier in certain cantons than in others. Since you work at home and are not limited to any particular canton that is an advantage. Vaud and Geneva seem to be more open to non married couples.


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I like Switzerland.
The bureaucracy is an absolute nightmare! You can't reason with them or argue your case… well you can but you won't win!
Huh? We really do live in parallel Switzerlands. In terms of bureaucratic nightmares.... You should try South America.... Or Belgium.

Switzerland is a well oiled machine compared to many, many countries.
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  #30  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:38
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Yes you are fine as are your children, if you have the finances.

The keyword here is;



Your boyfriend is not your spouse.
Sorry, I didn't quote the whole thing, I guess. It actually says:
https://www.ch.ch/en/family-reunification-eu-efta/

EU/EFTA citizens holding a Swiss residence permit may bring the following family members to Switzerland under the family reunification programme:

Spouse, registered partnership


Registered partnership also includes same sex partnerships, incidentally.
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  #31  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:39
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Sorry, I didn't quote the whole thing, I guess. It actually says:
https://www.ch.ch/en/family-reunification-eu-efta/

EU/EFTA citizens holding a Swiss residence permit may bring the following family members to Switzerland under the family reunification programme:

Spouse, registered partnership


Registered partnership also includes same sex partnerships, incidentally.
Registered partnerships are only valid for same sex couples except in certain cantons. Neuchatel and Geneva recognize opposite sex partnerships IIRC. Vaud is also one of the easier cantons for non-married couples. But I'm not sure if it's law or common practice.
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  #32  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:41
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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I do hope you are right. If I were you though, I'd choose my canton carefully. It seems to be easier in certain cantons than in others. Since you work at home and are not limited to any particular canton that is an advantage. Vaud and Geneva seem to be more open to non married couples.
Thanks for this. I must say, the beuracracy does scare me. I have researched this left right and centre, but know that I can be stone walled at any point. And the fact that I will not be in my first-language environment is daunting.

Nevertheless, I am HOPING that Switzerland is in fact a well oiled machine that I think it is, and that rules are rules, and as long as everyone follows them, it will all work out. That belief is a big part of why we chose Switzerland. Transparency.

But, I wil be the first one to admit that I know NOTHING based on experience when it comes to this. Hence I intend to use EF shamelessly to anticipate issues, and try to avoid them.

Thanks for all your insight!
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  #33  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:41
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Sorry, I didn't quote the whole thing, I guess. It actually says:
https://www.ch.ch/en/family-reunification-eu-efta/

EU/EFTA citizens holding a Swiss residence permit may bring the following family members to Switzerland under the family reunification programme:

Spouse, registered partnership


Registered partnership also includes same sex partnerships, incidentally.
Yes, the Swiss will recognise a "same sex" registered partnership OR a traditional marriage. But you haven't mentioned either of these. I'm assuming that you are female and your boyfriend male, so the registered partnership does not apply.

I'm not saying it won't work, but a permit isn't guaranteed without marriage (or registered partnership if same sex).
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  #34  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:43
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Registered partnerships are only valid for same sex couples except in certain cantons. Neuchatel does recognize opposite sex partnerships IIRC.
Oh. That is not what I read elsewhere ... I read that we need to prove he is unencumbered, and that we have a solid relationship for at least a couple of years (easy to prove when you have a 4 year old together).

I guess I will research this further, but if he needs to be my spouse that can be arranged :-)
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  #35  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:44
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Re the residency permits:

I am basic my information (partially) on the following research, mostly obtained from official sources.
EU/EFTA nationals
Persons who are not gainfully employed (e.g. retirees and students) may remain in Switzerland if the following conditions are met:

They have adequate financial resources to cover the cost of living in Switzerland so as to ensure that they will not become dependent on welfare benefits, and
They have a health insurance policy that also includes accident coverage.
Students must also show the letter confirming that they have been admitted to a recognised educational institution (confirmation of enrolment).
Stays of up to 90 days within a six-month period do not require authorisation. For longer stays, foreign nationals have to register with the cantonal migration office as a non-employed person. The corresponding EU/EFTA residence permit will remain valid for a period of five years
https://www.ch.ch/en/retirement-or-study-switzerland/

and
Citizens from EU-17 states and EU-8 states enjoy full freedom of movement. This means that citizens of those countries are free to travel to Switzerland, and to live and work here.
(I am an EU citizen)

and
Nationals from all EU/EFTA member states without gainful employment are entitled to a B permit if they can prove they have sufficient financial means and adequate health and accident insurance.
https://www.bfm.admin.ch/bfm/en/home...b_eu_efta.html

and
EU/EFTA citizens holding a Swiss residence permit may bring the following family members to Switzerland under the family reunification programme:

Spouse, registered partnership
Children and grandchildren under the age of 21 or older if you agree to pay their living expenses,
Parents and grandparents if their living expenses are covered.
If you are enrolled in an education and training programme, you may only bring your spouse, dependent children under the family reunification programme. Regardless of the nationality of the family member, he/she will receive an EU/EFTA residence permit (even if the person is a third-state national). This permit will have the same period of validity as your own residence permit. Family members may take up employment but must register with the cantonal immigration and labour market authorities.
https://www.ch.ch/en/family-reunification-eu-efta/
Yes, most of that is correct - for you. But your boyfriend is NOT your spouse so doesn't qualify under family reunification, therefore neither do his parents. Registered partnerships are ONLY for same sex couples as miniMia points out.

As an unmarried couple the concubine permit is your only option unless your boyfriend gets his own permit via an approved job offer which is extremely difficult to do for a non-EU national. He needs to be highly qualified/skilled to even stand a chance. The process is outlined here.

https://www.bfm.admin.ch/bfm/en/home...zulassung.html
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  #36  
Old 03.03.2015, 19:49
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Nevertheless, I am HOPING that Switzerland is in fact a well oiled machine
It's a relatively well oiled machine.


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Oh. That is not what I read elsewhere ... I read that we need to prove he is unencumbered, and that we have a solid relationship for at least a couple of years (easy to prove when you have a 4 year old together).

I guess I will research this further, but if he needs to be my spouse that can be arranged :-)
Ok. It's not like it's completely impossible to bring your partner who you are not married to. It's just not guaranteed. As I said, some cantons are easier than others. You'll read on the forum some success stories and some refusals.

Again, my advice is to choose the appropriate canton. I'd pick Geneva in your case. Though Geneva has other issues. The German cantons seem to giving people more problems even when they are EU/EU non married couples when only one is working.

I haven't even gotten into the renting question which was your original concern...
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Old 03.03.2015, 19:55
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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I haven't even gotten into the renting question which was your original concern...
Whenever you are ready...

Last edited by 3Wishes; 09.07.2015 at 23:29. Reason: fixed quoting
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  #38  
Old 03.03.2015, 20:09
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Whenever you are ready...

Basically, the higher the rent the less competition you will face. And if you are looking at 5-6K a month, you won't have a problem finding a place. Though may not get the same things you'd get in SA for that price.

As long a you have proof of a few years of your income then you shouldn't have a problem even if you are self employed. Usually they will ask for 3 years of tax returns for self employed people.

However, remember, they usually look for you to spend no more than about 30% of your income on rent.
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  #39  
Old 03.03.2015, 20:27
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Which we all know is the capital of Swiss
No, capital of Swiss is SWISS
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  #40  
Old 03.03.2015, 21:03
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Re: Renting if self-employed

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Though may not get the same things you'd get in SA for that price.
HA HA HA! You mean I am not going to get a 8 bedroom house with a swimming pool, tennis court, six garages and two acres of land?
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