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  #21  
Old 14.04.2015, 14:06
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

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Post a note on the door to say you have authority to remove it within a week if it is not cleared, you have also involved the Police and Mieterverband and your agency is fully aware of it.
Good idea! except that you would really have to have notified the police etc.
Actually I assume that as it is part of your rental agreement, then you are paying for that cellar - therefore that gives you rights - however there should be just warning to the offender(s).
What I would do is the following:
1. Post a note in the letterbox of each tennant in the building, stating that there is unsolicited use of your cellar - Kindly ask that the lock should be removed and contents removed within 1 week. If not then you will exercise your right to cut the lock yourself. You will then remove the articles and leave them in the cellar communal space.
2. Send a copy of the note by registered post to the owner.
3. Post a reminder in all the mail boxes 1 day before the week deadline is up. (If you suspect that someone may be on holiday then you may wish to consider extending the deadline).
3. After one (or 2) week(s), remove the offending lock and carefully remove and stack everything that is not yours in an open cellar space.
4. Take photos before and after for your records and try to have someone as a witness if and when you have to remove the stuff.
5. Notify the owner (by registered post) that you have removed the lock after no response and the articles therein (which are not yours) have been placed in a certain area (obviously stating where, with photos).

Actually the contents themsleves may give some clue as to the identity of the owner.
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  #22  
Old 14.04.2015, 14:06
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Print 5 copies saying to remove stuff out cellar. stick paper to front door of houses, give them 2 days to clean, throw shit out in corridor,Lock with your key, handover apartment.....Done Maybe someone else made a mistake so give opportunity to clear out their stuff

Don't see the need to get legal advice or writing letters to agencies etc.

Do you let people put their furniture etc in your apartment, or in your car? No it is your space since you pay rent so thats the end of it
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Old 14.04.2015, 14:26
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

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Is there any chance it could belong to the apartment owner? Maybe they saw it wasn't in use and didn't think it would be an issue?
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How can it belong to someone else ? I
Sorry, Typo. What I meant was, is there any chance it could be the owner of your apartment using the cellar?
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  #24  
Old 14.04.2015, 14:28
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

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Sorry, Typo. What I meant was, is there any chance it could be the owner of your apartment using the cellar?
I don't know if this would be the case as I also asked the renting agency to check if they have by mistake allotted the same cellar to some new tenant.

They replied "Sorry, your cellar, your responsibility. We CANNOT HELP"...
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  #25  
Old 14.04.2015, 14:33
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

The OP, hemant patadia, is leaving the country, he can throw the stuff away the day before the handover, sweep the cellar out, and leave the country.

Why make life difficult? If the tramp wants to keep his stuff he can take it away in the time before the handover.
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Old 14.04.2015, 14:42
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Letters posted on the front door(s), letters in dozens of people's mailboxes, reminders about previous letters, and on and on it goes.... I don't know about you but I'm tired after just reading all these suggestions. What's more, I'm not even convinced that this is your problem to solve!

If you are paying for the use of a cellar compartment but cannot access it (in this case because some unknown person has placed a lock on the door), this counts as a Mängel or defect in the apartment. You are entitled to have your rent reduced accordingly, for however many months it takes the agency to sort out the problem so that you have access to your paid-for space.

This is the approach I would take: try to make it their problem to solve, not yours. Talk to the Zürich "Mieterverband" (tenants' association) for advice on the exact procedure to follow. I reckon they will say you have to start by sending a registered letter, notifying the agency of the problem and asking them to fix it within X weeks, but at least it'll be one letter and not several dozen of them.
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  #27  
Old 14.04.2015, 14:53
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Hello

Isn't your assigned cave/storage space mentioned in your contract? I really don't understand why the owner of the flat or the regie doesn't step in here? For example, all the caves in our building are numbered and there can be no doubt over this.

For example, my motorcycle spot, for which I pay 30 CHF/month since August 2014, was empty since we moved in, as I only bought a motorcycle last month.

It didn't take long before someone noticed and parked his bike in my spot. Since there are about 100 flats in our compound, it was impossible for me to find out who parked it there (and I couldn't be bothered either).

I therefore sent a letter to the regie and the bike was gone a few days later.

Ciao
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  #28  
Old 14.04.2015, 15:02
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

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Hello

Isn't your assigned cave/storage space mentioned in your contract? I really don't understand why the owner of the flat or the regie doesn't step in here? For example, all the caves in our building are numbered and there can be no doubt over this.

For example, my motorcycle spot, for which I pay 30 CHF/month since August 2014, was empty since we moved in, as I only bought a motorcycle last month.

It didn't take long before someone noticed and parked his bike in my spot. Since there are about 100 flats in our compound, it was impossible for me to find out who parked it there (and I couldn't be bothered either).

I therefore sent a letter to the regie and the bike was gone a few days later.

Ciao
Yes, we have assigned numbers on the cellar and it is also mentioned in my rental contract. Still, the agency refuses to participate and everytime I try calling them hoping a new person would receive it, I get the same lady on the other side and she gets a bit agitated when I explain my situation to her.

By the way, what is a Regie ? you mean the renting agency ?

Last edited by hemant patadia; 14.04.2015 at 15:03. Reason: info added
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  #29  
Old 14.04.2015, 17:22
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

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... everytime I try calling them hoping a new person would receive it, I get the same lady on the other side and she gets a bit agitated when I explain my situation to her...
Stop calling, as they can pretend they've never heard from you. Send a registered letter, preferably addressed to a specific person and referencing the language in your contract. It also wouldn't hurt to do as MathNut suggests and contact the Mieterverband for assistance.
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  #30  
Old 14.04.2015, 17:38
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Try leaving a note in the entrance of the building asking who is occupying cellar X. There is probably a number on the door of the cellar somewhere.
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  #31  
Old 14.04.2015, 17:53
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

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No. the cellar was allocated to me when I took over the house and we also had a viewing of the cellar during the handover process.

How can it belong to someone else ? I am just pissed that people even dare to do such things without even prior permission or approval !
Sometimes landlords and rental agencies don't have a clue and are lazy. Just because they showed you an empty cellar doesn't mean its yours. This is especially possible if the person was just some paper pusher who normally sits in the office and isn't 100% familiar with the building. Have you checked whether that could be? Is there is no other empty cellar elsewhere?

Why don't you contact the agency and ask them to come over and positively identify which cellar is yours?

Do you live in a building with many parties? Would it be feasible to talk to them all? Somebody would have to admit to it being their cellar, officially or otherwise.
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  #32  
Old 14.04.2015, 18:14
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Just load everything into a van and take it all to the tip. You can get rid of quite a lot of rubbish for free with the annual vouchers.

Just make sure nobody sees you and deny all knowledge.
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  #33  
Old 14.04.2015, 18:36
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Can you see anywhere in your rental contract where your cellar is allocated to you? Number or location of cellar? If you have that, then it is rightfully yours, so contact the local police, advice them of your contract were it is stablished that it belongs to you and proceed with their advice of whether to empty it and get rid of their stuff or adding a new huuuuuge lock on it with a sign that says, the police and I are watching you, come to me if you want your stuff back of deal with the police

Good luck!
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  #34  
Old 14.04.2015, 22:40
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Isnt it also classed as theft and tresspassing?

Its a service you are paying for but being benefited by someone else without your permission...

Your agency has to take ownership...if they dont seriously contact the Mieterverband (https://www.mieterverband.ch/)...A non profit organisation who can help with the legalities if you are having problem with your landlord/agency.

For 100CHFs a year you can become a member and file a case. The claim the money back from your rental agency as the case is in your favour.
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  #35  
Old 15.04.2015, 04:24
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Here's the tenants' association:
https://www.mieterverband.ch/mv-zh/kontakt.html

If you are not already a member, go down there during a time when there is NO free legal clinic, with all your identity documents and contract, etc., just in order to join the association. Be clear that you understand that you cannot ask them your legal questions on that visit, but should return on the day of the legal clinic. However, it is a good idea to ask them whether, when you return on the legal clinic days, someone will be able to speak a language you understand, or whether you'll need to bring along your own interpreter.

The reason to make two separate trips is that on the busiest days of the legal clinics, the queue can go way down the street, and you don't want to be wasting precious queuing time by first having to stand in the other queue to become a member.

Once you are a member, minimise queuing time by being there an hour before the legal clinic opens. Be sure to have all your documents with you. The better prepared you are, with notes of all the steps you've already tried (including copies of what you've given to your landlord and your neighbours), the more effectively they will be able to help you.

By the way, besides hanging up notes in the building, have you written individual letters to every single tenant in the building? And have you rung every single bell or knocked on all the doors, persistently, until you've spoken to everyone? Have you looked up all the telephone numbers in www.directories.ch and phoned all those you can't reach in person? Asked the neighbours if they know how you could reach the others, or where they work?

Show each neighbour a photo of what you've seen downstairs in your cellar. If they say "oh, that's not my stuff", ask them to sign your pre-designed form to confirm this. Then, in a few days' time, you could send a copy of your form to your landlord, showing that that you have reached all other parties except Frau X and Herr Y, whose doorbells you have rung and to whom you have written letters and whom you have tried to phone.

Ask the landlord if he/she could please pass on a letter from you, for example if they have the email address or the work address or a phone number. You're unlikely to get any of that data from them, but they might pass on your question: "Is this your stuff? You need to remove it by DATE".

Sometimes people (like your landlord) who've said "no" become cooperative once they can see all the effort you have put into trying to do the right thing.


Oh, and by the way, a "regie" is the French word for "landlord" or the "letting agency" acting in the interests of the landlord. In German "Vermieterin" or "Vermieter" or, more rarely, "Agentur".
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  #36  
Old 15.04.2015, 06:52
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

My guess is the agency have screwed up, they know they've screwed up and are adopting a head-in-the-sand approach.

MathNut said it all. Don't muck about with anything other. Stop phoning. Write letter, send registered.
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  #37  
Old 15.04.2015, 07:59
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Midge -> elephant?!

"found out that some has occupied my cellar and even locked it with their stuff inside"

From that I take it that this is one of these "open boxes", to be secured with a bring-your-own padlock.

Suggestion:
* stick a note to that very cellar
- including a (partial) copy of your rental contract pointing out it is your's
- advise that after two weeks of wait, you will open your cellar (break the lock) and discard of everything properly (recycle / Brocki)
- provide as many contact details for yourself as possible
* stick a note of the above to every single entry into your building area - and include photos of that cellar and its contents
* notify the administration of the above steps in a registered letter
* notify the local police station of the above steps, in person, and heed their advice
* wait two weeks
* execute

You are stuck with the cost of discarding until someone comes forward.

Unless the administration assigned that same cellar room twice, the administration cannot help you. How would you want to prove that the administration did that?

Lesson learnt: Whenever you take over responsibility for something (e.g. by renting it), secure it, or deal with the consequences.

In your case, at the time of you having moved in, you might have wanted to
a) add a padlock of your own
b) add a "this is mine" note to your cellar (business card / flat number)

[Funny thing in this (small!) building here, though: the administration put up a note to ask who was occupying cellar #4 as there was a problem with the water pipes. And that with this being "real" rooms, with proper, safe doors and door locks matching the master locking system for the flat/building]
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  #38  
Old 15.04.2015, 08:32
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

…not your stuff, not your problem, just leave it and save yourself a load of nerves, hassle and aggro, you paid a bit for something you are not using, somebody else used it.
But, you were there for two years and did not notice a thing? Why worry about it now.
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Old 15.04.2015, 08:46
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

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[Funny thing in this (small!) building here, though: the administration put up a note to ask who was occupying cellar #4 as there was a problem with the water pipes. And that with this being "real" rooms, with proper, safe doors and door locks matching the master locking system for the flat/building]
Something similar happened to me. The cellar compartments do have numbers on the doors and mine has the same number as my apartment. I asked the guy from the agency if that alone wasn't positive identification that it was my cellar, and he said no. He said he didn't know who had put the number there but that it didn't mean anything.
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  #40  
Old 15.04.2015, 09:03
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Re: Someone occupied my cellar

Hello

How many apartments have access to the celler?
I would write a letter to all of them, (take a photo also) and also hang the letter in the celler.

Then hope that it is just a mistake.

Good luck
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