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Old 24.05.2008, 22:53
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Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

Have done some search in the forum and I understand the Renter association (ASLOCA) is the mostly recommended. Still, I want to get some topline advice on this before approaching them as there might not be much we could do....

We just received the notification of rental increase of 7% (taking effect in October by when we will be living in the apartment for 2 years) . According to the breakdown which includes 2 parts

1)IPC (consumer price index) at 0.99% (which is 40% of the average consumer price increase in 12 months; according to the agency, this is the max. % they could apply)


2)mortgage rate at 6% (as a result of increase from 3% to 3.5%; again, according to the agency, the law allows the owner to increase the rent by 3% for every 0.25% increase in mortgage rate )

my questions are :
a) should we accept this as a 'fate' or if there is anything we could do like negotiating the rate (say not charging to max), etc etc

b) regarding to the item 1 (IPC at 0.99%), we did the calculation by ourself on the same base and found that it's actually only 0.96%. In short, it's a calculation mistake --could we go before the commission and have the increase recinded on the ground that is illegal?

Your advice would be highly appreciated.

ps my canton is Vaud
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Old 25.05.2008, 16:39
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

Hi,

We have also recently been notified of a rent increase on our anniversary in the apartment. It is only around 4% increase but we're already paying a pretty steep rent (the rent we pay now we know is significantly higher than the previous tenants) and it's not clear to us whether we should/can challenge the increase.

The reasons for the increase quoted are:
- Le taux hypothécaire (mortgage rate)
- L'indice suisse des prix à la consommation (ISPC)

Thanks,
Mark.
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Old 26.05.2008, 15:31
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

www.mieterverband.ch/ - (german) is good site to go to - and it's described how much they can change.
Once thing to look at is - when was last price adjustment and to what interest rate level as for many years there have been landlords increasing on the mortgage rates increase but never going down when interests went down - making it illegal - and you could claim with +4% interests on the 'over paid rental'.

Also landlord has to prove to 'renters association' that real costs increased to the level of the rental increase - it can't be unreasonable increase (for instance - if house is split 50/50 - 50k is mortgage and 50k is cash of the owner - now, 50k is on 3.5% mortgage while other 50k is on 5 years 'bank deposit interests' which would give owner clear win of 3% when deposited in bank .
So it's 3.25% of 100k which is total 'costs'). Increase of interests rates from 3.5% to 4% on mortgage does not result in 5 years '50k deposit' interests rates same way .
So now calculation is 4% and 3% (or 3.1% as slight chance to get a bit more on 50k investment for 5 years) .
Now - real increase is 0.6% on 50k - or 0.3% on 100k - which means that effective costs grown by 0.3% - when interest rates went up 0.5% *

Whenever landlord is allowed to increase 3% per 0.25% base interest rates depends on many things – main concern hers is ‘other costs’ – like heating these days. Whenever it’s included in the base price – that could be reasonable – while when it’s not in the apartment price – and separate year end closing is made – than I see it unreasonable to raise 3% on every ¼ base interest rates grow.

It doesn't matter when you actually started your rent. And you can deny to sign new contract - down to landlord what to do now - let you go or let you stay or most of the cases - negotiate (and most to win - agree on new terms however ask for extra 3-4months on current rate - to what landlord offered - take look on average market prices and make your move or stay.)

* This is what I was told by my friend (owner of few apartments in BS) .

cheers
h.
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Old 26.05.2008, 15:37
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

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We just received the notification of rental increase of 7% (taking effect in October by when we will be living in the apartment for 2 years) . According to the breakdown which includes 2 parts
I'm afraid there's really not much you can do. As in the past 2 years interest rates have only risen, the landlord (unfortunately) has the right to charge you more. What I find odd is the thing about the rising consumer prices: AFAIK in Switzerland the rents are only tied to the interest rates, not to the consumer prices.

I'd definitely go to the "Mieterverband" but I seriously doubt there's much you can do. I'm myself dreading the day we get our rental increase - it's been overdue for a while. Once that happens, we're going to have to move. The rent's already way too high.

peter
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Old 26.05.2008, 16:51
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

Hi

As you're in Pully, the equivalent of mieterverband in Suisse Romande is www.asloca.ch. They have offices in Lausanne They are very helpful, including having quiet a few English Speaking consultants

Good Luck and don't just accept the increase without chatting to them first.

Good Luck
Nathalie
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Old 26.05.2008, 22:22
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

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Hi,

We have also recently been notified of a rent increase on our anniversary in the apartment. It is only around 4% increase but we're already paying a pretty steep rent (the rent we pay now we know is significantly higher than the previous tenants) and it's not clear to us whether we should/can challenge the increase.

The reasons for the increase quoted are:
- Le taux hypothécaire (mortgage rate)
- L'indice suisse des prix à la consommation (ISPC)

Thanks,
Mark.
thanks Mark.

since we're in same canton, your case is very relevant to me.

could you tell me if you deal with owner directly or through agency? also, if you don't mind, could you tell me the split between the mortagae & ISPC in your 4% increase. PM me if you think it's more appropriate.

appreciate a lot for your help.
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Old 05.06.2008, 13:58
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

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Hi

As you're in Pully, the equivalent of mieterverband in Suisse Romande is www.asloca.ch. They have offices in Lausanne They are very helpful, including having quiet a few English Speaking consultants

Good Luck and don't just accept the increase without chatting to them first.

Good Luck
Nathalie
I called the association and in contrary to what you have said, they were very unhelpful None of them speak english ! I asked the woman picking up my call that if I could talk to anyone in english, the answer is 'non', I then asked her which office would have people speaking english, the answer is 'non' again. what a bad experience which is ,however, pretty much aligned with what i had in Lausanne so far. service sucks here !
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Old 05.06.2008, 16:04
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

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I called the association and in contrary to what you have said, they were very unhelpful None of them speak english ! I asked the woman picking up my call that if I could talk to anyone in english, the answer is 'non', I then asked her which office would have people speaking english, the answer is 'non' again. what a bad experience which is ,however, pretty much aligned with what i had in Lausanne so far. service sucks here !
Sorry to hear that they couldn't help you - I always found the Basel office very friendly and forthcoming.
However, please don't claim that service sucks here just because people don't know English. English isn't an official language here. You're the one who's expected to learn the local language; it's not the Swiss' task to learn the languages of the immigrants. Many Swiss do speak English - but consider that a bonus, nothing else.

You might want to ask someone who knows French to help you with the Mieterverband.

peter
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Old 05.06.2008, 16:09
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

You can calculate reasonable rent increase by using this tool:

http://www.bonasavoir.ch/index_bas.p...ask=view&id=22

But 7% seems steep in any case.

ASLOCA is a political organisation so there are cases where it is of no help, but in this case I think they would offer some reasonable legal advice. You have to call to schedule an appointment or go there directly. Usually some of their lawyers speak English, but not their switchboard staff.

Do not give up, there is rent increase that is reasonable and there is pure ripping-off and you need to establish exactly where you are.

I understand your frustration and it is true that customer service here is not what one would expect, but if you have the time and patience to learn to use the system, you will often discover that it actually works to your advantage.
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Old 05.06.2008, 16:13
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

A friend of mine recently had her rent put up by a huge ammount, over 50%, I was certain it can't be legal, but maybe the situation is different.

Kanton is Luzern, the building she's lived in for the last 8 years was sold to a new landlord. They initially threatened her with eviction while they did major renovations. Not being to happy about this, she complained to the new landlord, and went to the rental assoc. She's no longer threatened with eviction, but was given the rent hike instead.

Is this allowed?

EDIT: In the eight years she lived there, she didn't receive any rental increase, the surrounding area has soared in rental value.

Last edited by cyrus; 05.06.2008 at 17:00.
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Old 05.06.2008, 16:57
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

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I called the association and in contrary to what you have said, they were very unhelpful None of them speak english ! I asked the woman picking up my call that if I could talk to anyone in english, the answer is 'non', I then asked her which office would have people speaking english, the answer is 'non' again. what a bad experience which is ,however, pretty much aligned with what i had in Lausanne so far. service sucks here !

I'm so sorry to hear that, I had excellent help from them - it was a couple of year ago though. I agree with Peter though - if you can enlist the help of someone who speaks french I'm sure the advise they will offer you will be invaluable.

Cheers
nats
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Old 08.06.2008, 11:44
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

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A friend of mine recently had her rent put up by a huge ammount, over 50%, I was certain it can't be legal, but maybe the situation is different.

Kanton is Luzern, the building she's lived in for the last 8 years was sold to a new landlord. They initially threatened her with eviction while they did major renovations. Not being to happy about this, she complained to the new landlord, and went to the rental assoc. She's no longer threatened with eviction, but was given the rent hike instead.

Is this allowed?

EDIT: In the eight years she lived there, she didn't receive any rental increase, the surrounding area has soared in rental value.
Major renovations here is the key word. In such cases rents can be increased considerably depending on the work done and my understanding is that tenants can indeed have their contracts terminated to allow signifcant renovations to be carried out.
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Old 16.06.2008, 20:56
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

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A friend of mine recently had her rent put up by a huge ammount, over 50%, I was certain it can't be legal, but maybe the situation is different.

Kanton is Luzern, the building she's lived in for the last 8 years was sold to a new landlord. They initially threatened her with eviction while they did major renovations. Not being to happy about this, she complained to the new landlord, and went to the rental assoc. She's no longer threatened with eviction, but was given the rent hike instead.

Is this allowed?

EDIT: In the eight years she lived there, she didn't receive any rental increase, the surrounding area has soared in rental value.
--------

This is unbelievable in that they can either get you out on the basis of doing renovations ? Don't they have to give you a notice period etc. ?
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Old 17.06.2008, 00:54
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

looks like everywhere in Vaud some increasing is coming and always with detailed explanation may be or sure petrol price influences
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Old 17.06.2008, 01:15
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

Have a look at today's Tages Anzeiger where they announced that properties owned by the City of Zurich will be open to an average rental increase of 27%... Granted, this will apply to new leases, but it still is a very clear indication that rental prices are under a great deal of pressure in this country. The example they gave was a 5 (6?) room flat in Kreis 4 that had previously rented for 3100 and that would now be renting for just over 4000 per month.

Get used to it folks, it ain't the 1990's anymore, inflation is back.
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Old 19.12.2008, 10:58
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Re: Advice pls - rental increase 7% reasonable ?

I recently got a 7% increase as well here in Geneva.Could you tell me what happen at last on you story? Have you challenge it? what is the result?
I have to decide soon whether to contest or not.
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