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Old 23.05.2016, 17:40
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Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

Does anybody know any banks that will offer a Swiss CHF mortgage for a property in France? So far I have found Credit Agricole and BCGE do, but most other banks I have asked won't (e.g. Credit Suisse, Swissquote).

Alternatively if anybody can recommend a good mortgage broker who can help in this area that would be helpful.

Thanks!
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Old 23.05.2016, 19:02
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

Why would you want a mortgage in CHF for a property in EUR? You do understand currency risk I hope or do you know something that we do to know.

Yes there is low rent in CHF but you run the risk of the euro devaluating. You might remember the iceland credit crash.
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Old 23.05.2016, 20:00
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

Try the French banks. They will all do this. We're with CIC in St. Louis.

As for why - if you're earning in CHF it's much more predictable to buy in CHF, so that you're avoiding any risks. The money is converted into Euros at today's exchange rate, so yes, if the Euro goes even lower then you're not going to see any advantage from it, but if it goes up it's not going to be more expensive either.

I haven't checked interest rates recently, but when we were buying the rate on a chf mortgage was considerably better than a Euro one (or French Francs, actually).
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Old 23.05.2016, 20:11
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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Does anybody know any banks that will offer a Swiss CHF mortgage for a property in France? So far I have found Credit Agricole and BCGE do, but most other banks I have asked won't (e.g. Credit Suisse, Swissquote).

Alternatively if anybody can recommend a good mortgage broker who can help in this area that would be helpful.

Thanks!
That will be difficult I suppose.
I wanted to buy a house in the Netherlands in the 80-ies. I couldn't because the Dutch didn't give me a mortgage as they had no access to my Swiss income and the Swiss wouldn't because they had no access to my house.
What a shame, I know where I'd be right now otherwise ......
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Old 23.05.2016, 21:33
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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Try the French banks. They will all do this. We're with CIC in St. Louis.

As for why - if you're earning in CHF it's much more predictable to buy in CHF, so that you're avoiding any risks. The money is converted into Euros at today's exchange rate, so yes, if the Euro goes even lower then you're not going to see any advantage from it, but if it goes up it's not going to be more expensive either.

I haven't checked interest rates recently, but when we were buying the rate on a chf mortgage was considerably better than a Euro one (or French Francs, actually).
My humble advise is to keep the mortgage in the same currency as the property. On the other hand you might get lucky and CHF will depreciate against the euro. With a property/mortgage you have to take a long view.

Maybe you can extend or get a mortgage on property you own in Switzerland (not likely).
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Old 24.05.2016, 09:19
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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My humble advise is to keep the mortgage in the same currency as the property. On the other hand you might get lucky and CHF will depreciate against the euro. With a property/mortgage you have to take a long view.

Maybe you can extend or get a mortgage on property you own in Switzerland (not likely).
If you earn in CHF and are buying in EUR you take a currency risk either way. CHF mortgage and the EUR devalues and your debt could be more than the value of the house. EUR mortgage and the EUR strengthens you may not be able to make the monthly payments in CHF.

The former though is at least hedged by the fact that as long as I can continue to earn CHF if the EUR devalues my spending power increases. It's only a cash flow issue if I lose my job and can't get another. For the latter if I have a EUR mortgage and the EUR strengthened back to historical norms the monthly payments could become an issue. Yes in theory I could sell up and cover the debt, but there are significant transaction costs, and who wants to be a forced seller?
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Old 24.05.2016, 09:24
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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Does anybody know any banks that will offer a Swiss CHF mortgage for a property in France? So far I have found Credit Agricole and BCGE do, but most other banks I have asked won't (e.g. Credit Suisse, Swissquote).

Alternatively if anybody can recommend a good mortgage broker who can help in this area that would be helpful.

Thanks!
Is there some reason that the offers from these banks aren't suitable? The current 10-year fix at Credit Agricole Financements Suisse (http://ca-financements.ch/) is 1.29%, which is very competitive.

We took our mortgage with them on the recommendation of another expat family that had used them (to mortgage a property in Germany) and we've been very happy with the service offered.
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Old 24.05.2016, 09:32
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

I also have a mortgage in EUR with a CHF salary. I fixed the rate for 20 years and the amount is not that high so even with a depreciation of the currency, I will be able to manage that.
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Old 24.05.2016, 09:56
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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I also have a mortgage in EUR with a CHF salary. I fixed the rate for 20 years and the amount is not that high so even with a depreciation of the currency, I will be able to manage that.
It means you have the asset and the liability in the same currency so to hedge big changes. Thats what I would advise. You may have had some luck the last couple of years as your debt has evaporated a little.
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:00
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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Is there some reason that the offers from these banks aren't suitable? The current 10-year fix at Credit Agricole Financements Suisse (http://ca-financements.ch/) is 1.29%, which is very competitive.

We took our mortgage with them on the recommendation of another expat family that had used them (to mortgage a property in Germany) and we've been very happy with the service offered.
are these favourable terms for property in Germany or did you have to pledge your Swiss property?
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:06
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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If you earn in CHF and are buying in EUR you take a currency risk either way. CHF mortgage and the EUR devalues and your debt could be more than the value of the house. EUR mortgage and the EUR strengthens you may not be able to make the monthly payments in CHF.

The former though is at least hedged by the fact that as long as I can continue to earn CHF if the EUR devalues my spending power increases. It's only a cash flow issue if I lose my job and can't get another. For the latter if I have a EUR mortgage and the EUR strengthened back to historical norms the monthly payments could become an issue. Yes in theory I could sell up and cover the debt, but there are significant transaction costs, and who wants to be a forced seller?
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:15
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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are these favourable terms for property in Germany or did you have to pledge your Swiss property?
I don't own property in Switzerland - I own property in France (and my colleague owns property in Germany).

In my case, they took a pledge on my pension as the guarantee.
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:19
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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It means you have the asset and the liability in the same currency so to hedge big changes. Thats what I would advise. You may have had some luck the last couple of years as your debt has evaporated a little.
My salary is in CHF; my mortgage is in CHF -- there is never a risk that my monthly payment becomes unaffordable due to exchange rate fluctuations. I intend to stay in my house for a long time, so the most important thing for me is the certainty that I can make the mortgage payment each month. If the exchange rate moves against me, the only real "loss" comes when I sell the house; otherwise, it's all on paper.

Want to see what happens when you borrow in a currency other than what you're paid in? Have a look at Poland and Croatia...

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/strong-f...gages/42088916
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:32
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

This has been discussed several times recently; including someone else recently from Geneva who asked exactly the same question!

Buying a home in France - loan in Swiss Francs or Euro?

Mortgage broker suggestion - buying non-primary property in France

I expect there are other, slightly older threads on the same subject as I distinctly remember replying to some... the OP could try using the search engine?!

Anyway, my mortgage is with Credit Ag. Finance in Geneva, in CHF for a principle property in France. Income in francs so it's simply easier to know how much the outgoings are each month.
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:38
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

Just came across an article regarding FCM (Foreign Currency Mortgages) here, where it says that a lot of banks will probably stop making these mortgages due to additional risk being passed on to them by the European Commission by asking them to cap the risk associated with these types of mortgages or allow the customer to change the currency the mortgage held in once a certain level of FX loss has been reached.

I managed to dig down the directive and in Article 23 are the full details: here

Another article from the FT on the same topic: here (you might have to do some internet hokery pokery to access the restricted article)

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Mr Gammon said another risk, which emerged when the Swiss franc fell over 20 per cent against sterling this year, was that some lenders had exercised their contractual power to switch out of a foreign currency loan at will. “The lender moved them into sterling without their knowledge, essentially crystallising their losses.”
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:39
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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It means you have the asset and the liability in the same currency so to hedge big changes. Thats what I would advise. You may have had some luck the last couple of years as your debt has evaporated a little.


You should have seen the smile on my face last year January. But even if the rate goes up again, I have hedged already a fair amount EUR/CHF that should cover me for a good time.

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are these favourable terms for property in Germany or did you have to pledge your Swiss property?
In my case the property in Germany is pledged.
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:51
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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You should have seen the smile on my face last year January. But even if the rate goes up again, I have hedged already a fair amount EUR/CHF that should cover me for a good time.
well done. think of paying part of the loan off (though you already took risk out by hedging EUR/CHF)
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Old 24.05.2016, 10:59
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

I do and am doing that, yearly repayment is already scheduled :-)
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Old 24.05.2016, 21:16
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

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This has been discussed several times recently; including someone else recently from Geneva who asked exactly the same question!

Buying a home in France - loan in Swiss Francs or Euro?

Mortgage broker suggestion - buying non-primary property in France

I expect there are other, slightly older threads on the same subject as I distinctly remember replying to some... the OP could try using the search engine?!

Anyway, my mortgage is with Credit Ag. Finance in Geneva, in CHF for a principle property in France. Income in francs so it's simply easier to know how much the outgoings are each month.
I asked for banks other than CA and BCGE. Neither of those links you've found ask that specific question. Perhaps you should try using the search engine next time?
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Old 24.05.2016, 22:02
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Re: Banks that offer Swiss CHF Mortgages for Property in France

Rude.
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