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  #21  
Old 14.11.2016, 17:11
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Re: Apartment size

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When you say unfurnished accommodation only includes light fittings in bathroom and kitchen, what do people tend to do? Buy ceiling lights and take them with each time you move? How bizarre! And curtains surely need to be custom made for different sized windows, so how does that work? What do people do with their curtains when they leave? Get them altered for their new place?

So I'm going to have to shell out of light fitting and curtains when I move in? OMG, I didn't count on that in my budget.
Correct. When a tenant leaves a flat it needs to be completely empty (this means removing light fittings & curtains) unless there is a written agreement between the old & new tenant that stipulates otherwise.
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  #22  
Old 14.11.2016, 17:15
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Re: Apartment size

Also, I personally am rather ok with this, if I see what taste some people have in curtains/lamps, I would not want to live with those monstrosities (similarly as some probably won´t want to live with mine :-) )
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  #23  
Old 14.11.2016, 17:26
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Re: Apartment size

To give you a few pointers:

I used to have 2.5 rooms (1 large living room, 1 bedroom), 1 bath, 65 or 70sqm (can't quite remember)
Now I have 3.5 rooms (1 large living room > 40 sqm, 2 bedrooms), 2 baths, 105sqm

Bathrooms and kitchen are normally excluded from the net square footage (unless maybe the kitchen is open towards the living room - never really sure about this one) as are balconies/loggias.

Finding 110-130sqm is pretty easy. That's a standard size for 4.5-5.5 room apartments, in most areas anyway.
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  #24  
Old 14.11.2016, 17:33
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Re: Apartment size

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When you say unfurnished accommodation only includes light fittings in bathroom and kitchen, what do people tend to do? Buy ceiling lights and take them with each time you move? How bizarre! And curtains surely need to be custom made for different sized windows, so how does that work? What do people do with their curtains when they leave? Get them altered for their new place?

So I'm going to have to shell out of light fitting and curtains when I move in? OMG, I didn't count on that in my budget.
Yeah, that really surprised me over here too. I couldn't imagine that lights weren't part of the apartment... but that's the way it works.

I had to downsize quite a bit when I came over here (from a 240 sqm house to myself down to about 48 sqm all to myself, though I've since upgraded quite a bit). You do get used to it - but I suppose a lot is going to have to do with how old the kids are and whether they've gotten accustomed to having their own space. That concept doesn't really exist in Switzerland the way it does in the US.
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  #25  
Old 14.11.2016, 18:01
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Re: Apartment size

Again, depends where you live - here it is the norm too.

Most apartments have windown blinds, or shutters, normally external, often remote controlled- which are perfectly adequate so curtains are just not necessary at all.

As for light fittings, IKEA is just around the corner so it is not going to blow your budget.
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  #26  
Old 14.11.2016, 18:36
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Re: Apartment size

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When you say unfurnished accommodation only includes light fittings in bathroom and kitchen, what do people tend to do? Buy ceiling lights and take them with each time you move? How bizarre! And curtains surely need to be custom made for different sized windows, so how does that work? What do people do with their curtains when they leave? Get them altered for their new place?

So I'm going to have to shell out of light fitting and curtains when I move in? OMG, I didn't count on that in my budget.
That's pretty much the case.

We've only had light fittings in the hall, bathroom and kitchen in our 2 apartments. The other rooms have had wires with connectors hanging from the ceiling. Haven't had any window dressings in either apartment, except for external blinds and shutters which have been (surprisingly) more than adequate.
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  #27  
Old 14.11.2016, 18:40
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Re: Apartment size

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Mhmm, interesting. I have 1x living room, 1x bedroom ,1x kinderzimmer (dining room), 1x kitchen and 1x bathroom/toilet, all separate rooms, and my place is only labelled a 3 roomer?
Kitchen and bathroom don`t count. At least in Basel-Stadt.
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  #28  
Old 14.11.2016, 18:40
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Re: Apartment size

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I think these villages became pricier over the past few years. If you take into account the cost of an extra car + associated costs it's not necessarily that cheaper. Compared to living in a city, you do get more outdoor space though.
You got my nostalgia going here- as I remember the days when there were only pretty villages with traditional houses between Geneva and Lausanne.
My god parents rented a big old house near Eysins - and there was no nuil build at all, no apartment blocks or villas. In the 50s when my godfather was Manager of the massive new Manor store in Nyon - the biggest in CH at the time, lol. It has become just one concrete dormitory
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  #29  
Old 14.11.2016, 18:46
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Re: Apartment size

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Most apartments have windown blinds, or shutters, normally external, often remote controlled- which are perfectly adequate so curtains are just not necessary at all.
That is why if you walk around at night you can pog into peoples flats or houses as they have no curtains to close . We have curtains as well as blinds. Feels psychologically cold + exposed without them to me.
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  #30  
Old 14.11.2016, 20:19
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Re: Apartment size

Hihi - there is absolutely no-one who can look into our windows - the nearest path is about 150m away - another advantage of living away from the Riviera
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  #31  
Old 14.11.2016, 20:59
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Re: Apartment size

Having lived in both Shanghai and the US, albeit both a long time ago:

The difference in accomodation - size, quality, and privacy - came as quite a shock to us. All these years on I still struggle with living in a shoebox for which I pay significantly more and get significantly less.

Some people adjust easily. For many in Switzerland housing is less important, it's just a place to sleep between exciting adventures. If you are not of that mindset, though, do be honest with yourself as to how much your accomodation means to you and your family.

Are you coming here on an expat package of some sort? If so, try to negotiate an 'equal accomodation' allowance where your company picks up the difference between Swiss housing prices for the kind of housing you now have and what you are currently paying. Caveat: These deals are not common anymore, gilded packages became quite scarce with the coming of the financial crisis and the FMOP. However, if you have the upper negotiating hand you can try...

A downside to these deals is that they are usually time limited. And it is not unknown that a 'max two year' assignment turns into 5, 10, 20 years. When the sweet deal expires you then have to move, or pick up the costs yourself. And go through the space adjustment you had initially put off.

If there is little chance of negotiating the housing allowance... accept that for the same price you paying now it's possible that your accomodation standard will drop. Plan for that, set your expectations (and your family's expectations) accordingly. Then if you end up one of the lucky few and find something similar to what you have had in the past - well then count your blessings and enjoy.

Good luck with your move...
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  #32  
Old 15.11.2016, 11:43
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Re: Apartment size

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We are a family of 4 (two growing kids that will need their own rooms), and I know its a personal decision and depends on how much furniture you have etc. etc. but I'd be interested in what size of apartment other families have managed with, and whether they find it adequate or too small?
You will most likely be looking at "4.5" apartments, which means 3 bedrooms + living room/kitchen, or "5.5" which is 4 bedrooms + living room/kitchen. Larger ones are scarce. Spare bedroom is a great thing to have if you want to be taking guests, have a small home office or just store items you don't use daily.

Space is a big problem in Switzerland. Most people can afford any amount of items they wish to have , but not the space to keep them.
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  #33  
Old 15.11.2016, 12:14
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Re: Apartment size

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When you say unfurnished accommodation only includes light fittings in bathroom and kitchen, what do people tend to do? Buy ceiling lights and take them with each time you move? How bizarre! And curtains surely need to be custom made for different sized windows, so how does that work? What do people do with their curtains when they leave? Get them altered for their new place?

So I'm going to have to shell out of light fitting and curtains when I move in? OMG, I didn't count on that in my budget.

Think yourself lucky there's a kitchen installed! In Germany there's often nothing in the kitchen at all.

Often in Switzerland you do kinda wish the previous tenant had taken the old bathroom with them :-)
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  #34  
Old 15.11.2016, 13:43
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Re: Apartment size

For the calculations of the size of the apartment, HALF of the size of the balcony is incorporated in canton Vaud.
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  #35  
Old 15.11.2016, 14:25
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Re: Apartment size

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You will most likely be looking at "4.5" apartments, which means 3 bedrooms + living room/kitchen, or "5.5" which is 4 bedrooms + living room/kitchen. Larger ones are scarce. Spare bedroom is a great thing to have if you want to be taking guests, have a small home office or just store items you don't use daily.

Space is a big problem in Switzerland. Most people can afford any amount of items they wish to have , but not the space to keep them.
...and not only space I would add - you can rent a (sort of tiny) place to deposit for a little over 100 chf a month apparently, but still-, but the fact that most/many apartments have a common laundry!!!
Tbh that was the most annoying thing for me.
So OP, be careful about this aspect too.
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  #36  
Old 15.11.2016, 16:21
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Re: Apartment size

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but the fact that most/many apartments have a common laundry!!!
Tbh that was the most annoying thing for me.
So OP, be careful about this aspect too.
It's already on my wife's list of must haves. She will not do the communal laundry thing since she uses the washer and dryer every day more than once.
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  #37  
Old 15.11.2016, 16:48
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Re: Apartment size

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When you say unfurnished accommodation only includes light fittings in bathroom and kitchen, what do people tend to do? Buy ceiling lights and take them with each time you move? How bizarre! And curtains surely need to be custom made for different sized windows, so how does that work? What do people do with their curtains when they leave? Get them altered for their new place?

So I'm going to have to shell out of light fitting and curtains when I move in? OMG, I didn't count on that in my budget.
People have very different tastes, your taste for fluorescent pink curtains with blus spots may not be to my liking.....

Generally people stay put for longer here and invest a little more in appartements than frequent moves.

Light fittings come is all sizes Chf 10.-- from Ikea up to Chf 6k from Artemide


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It's already on my wife's list of must haves. She will not do the communal laundry thing since she uses the washer and dryer every day more than once.
The washers work a lot slower here than American washers, you can count up to or over 2 hours per cycle sometimes
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  #38  
Old 15.11.2016, 16:59
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Re: Apartment size

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Generally people stay put for longer here and invest a little more in appartements than frequent moves.
Generally people go to Ikea and buy the cheapest crap they can find :-)

Seriously, you don't need curtains as most places have (outdoor) blinds. And light fittings are cheap but it is a hassle to have to put them in. Pretty sure there wasn't one in my kitchen when I moved in.


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The washers work a lot slower here than American washers, you can count up to or over 2 hours per cycle sometimes
That's because the way electricity works the 230 volts can only turn the motors half the speed of 110... And they're *tiiiiny*. I mean, have you seen them? How does one fit XXXXXL jeans and flannel shirts in there?!
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  #39  
Old 15.11.2016, 17:02
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Re: Apartment size

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That's because the way electricity works the 230 volts can only turn the motors half the speed of 110...
What total nonsense!

Tom
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Old 15.11.2016, 17:04
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Re: Apartment size

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It's already on my wife's list of must haves. She will not do the communal laundry thing since she uses the washer and dryer every day more than once.
Jaybus! Does she take washing in for the neighbours?? I don't even do laundry every day as a mum faced with food carnage and mud!

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The washers work a lot slower here than American washers, you can count up to or over 2 hours per cycle sometimes
They are the eco-programmes. Most have much shorter programmes with an option to shorten that further. The only problem is that (according to the plumber that fitted our machine) the shorter the programme, the more water it uses.

I couldn't figure the logic, either, but apparently a shorter rinse time needs more water.

Our shortest "normal" programme is 52 mins. If you want an express programme, that's 20 mins.
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