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-   -   Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ] (https://www.englishforum.ch/housing-general/266215-stop-running-european-toilet-tip.html)

curley 11.02.2017 23:06

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by JagWaugh (Post 2739493)
Yep, and getting worse by the year.

Bauhaus has the biggest assortment, but I don't think there is one near to you.

The larger Migros and Coops have some stuff, but they are reducing the range, as far as I can tell.

Obi is sort of halfway between Migros and Bauhaus in terms of being able to walk in and get all the bits you want for your project.

As much as I dislike Box stores, I basically just go straight to the Bauhaus now.

Bauhaus in Schlieren?
I got an other question: I have a in-wall-built-flush-thingy. Attachment 122513The cover is plastic and changed color to yellowish (was like that when I moved in already). Yep, I'm fussy, so I tried Cif and the likes, anticalc-stuff, scotch-sponge (the one you use for walls), baking-soda .... to no avail. I just read today that plastic changes color full stop. Nothing one can do.
True?
These things are not standardised are they? Like I can't get a cheap one in for example Bauhaus? I don't really want to spend money as I'm renting and my landlord doesn't care about tiny details like this.

JagWaugh 11.02.2017 23:18

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by curley (Post 2739497)
Bauhaus in Schlieren?
I got an other question: I have a in-wall-built-flush-thingy. Attachment 122513The cover is plastic and changed color to yellowish (was like that when I moved in already). Yep, I'm fussy, so I tried Cif and the likes, anticalc-stuff, scotch-sponge (the one you use for walls), baking-soda .... to no avail. I just read today that plastic changes color full stop. Nothing one can do.
True?
These things are not standardised are they? Like I can't get a cheap one in for example Bauhaus? I don't really want to spend money as I'm renting and my landlord doesn't care about tiny details like this.

Some plastics yellow. Have you tried NeverDull, or Brasso?

There aren't all that many variations of the einbaukasten (Geberit is the big one - look for a brand name on the in wall unit, or possibly on the back of the cover). Take your cover off and take it with you to the Bauhaus.

EDIT: Just looked a bit closer at the pic, it is a Geberit, so you'll be able to get a replacement.

curley 11.02.2017 23:29

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JagWaugh (Post 2739500)
Some plastics yellow. Have you tried NeverDull, or Brasso?

There aren't all that many variations of the einbaukasten (Geberit is the big one - look for a brand name on the in wall unit, or possibly on the back of the cover). Take your cover off and take it with you to the Bauhaus.

EDIT: Just looked a bit closer at the pic, it is a Geberit, so you'll be able to get a replacement.

Nope, never heard of NeverDull or Brusso. Looking them up told me, they're for metall? :confused:

Yes, I know it's a Geberit ..... but Geberit is quality = expensive, no?

addition: Do you go to Bauhaus Schlieren or is there one in "our" area?

JagWaugh 11.02.2017 23:42

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by curley (Post 2739504)
Nope, never heard of NeverDull or Brusso. Looking them up told me, they're for metall? :confused:

Yes, I know it's a Geberit ..... but Geberit is quality = expensive, no?

addition: Do you go to Bauhaus Schlieren or is there one in "our" area?

NevrDull is essentially cotton wool which is impregnated with Brasso, which is a suspension of very fine clay powder in an ammonia/water suspension (more or less). No problem for hard plastics like that cover, or Bakelite. I use Nevrdull on glass and hard plastics, as well as metal.

I go to the one in Schlieren.

A new cover like yours should be between 20 and 50 CHF I would think (Judging by the prices on Ricardo - one of the things that bothers me about Bauhaus is that their online presence is crap, so you can't check to see what they have, you just have to go and wander through the place).

curley 11.02.2017 23:55

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JagWaugh (Post 2739507)
NevrDull is essentially cotton wool which is impregnated with Brasso, which is a suspension of very fine clay powder in an ammonia/water suspension (more or less). No problem for hard plastics like that cover, or Bakelite. I use Nevrdull on glass and hard plastics, as well as metal.

I go to the one in Schlieren.

A new cover like yours should be between 20 and 50 CHF I would think (Judging by the prices on Ricardo - one of the things that bothers me about Bauhaus is that their online presence is crap, so you can't check to see what they have, you just have to go and wander through the place).

Thanks a lot. I can get get NeverDull from pearl.ch, I just saw LOL. I'll try that first.
Yeah, the webiste is not very detailed but hey, I'm glad there is something like that again. In the old days Migros Do It used to be groovy but that really is ages ago.

JagWaugh 12.02.2017 00:01

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by curley (Post 2739510)
Thanks a lot. I can get get NeverDull from pearl.ch, I just saw LOL. I'll try that first.
Yeah, the webiste is not very detailed but hey, I'm glad there is something like that again. In the old days Migros Do It used to be groovy but that really is ages ago.

Metarex is pretty much the same thing as NevrDull. Migros and/or Coop (I can't remember which) carry Metarex in the building/hobby centers .

amogles 13.02.2017 14:17

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom1234 (Post 2739494)
I don't like Bauhaus either particularly. I usually go to Hornbach.

I don't have a Hornbach near me unfortunately. I find Jumbo and Bauhaus are good enough for the basic tools and consumables, although over the years both have shifted from more choice to more of the same. For the specialist stuff I usually go to the internet. For example if you want anything that's slightly nicer than bog standard door fittings, lights, sockets or light switches, there is so much more choice online.

venetian 16.02.2017 09:51

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by curley (Post 2739497)
I just read today that plastic changes color full stop. Nothing one can do.
True?

95% true.
Yellowing of plastic parts is a light-induced chemical process; it can be reverted with the use of some tricks, but it needs some practice and the effect might not even be permanent. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retr0bright for short description and http://www.vecchicomputer.com/retr0bright/ for photos (Italian only).

In your case, buy a replacement :)

curley 16.02.2017 11:32

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by venetian (Post 2741530)
95% true.
Yellowing of plastic parts is a light-induced chemical process; it can be reverted with the use of some tricks, but it needs some practice and the effect might not even be permanent. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retr0bright for short description and http://www.vecchicomputer.com/retr0bright/ for photos (Italian only).

In your case, buy a replacement :)

Thanks for the link (Italian only? I looked thoroughly English to me :msncool:)
Guess no "rewhitening" would be permanent as the plastic would not change it's nature and bilge all over again.

venetian 16.02.2017 11:44

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
The second one should be Italian only. Maybe there is an english version activated depending on browser settings...

You are right, whitening is definitely not permanent! I kept reading and I run into this other article: http://www.classic-computers.org.nz/...-temporary.htm

By the way, I think those computer guys would be amazed to see Retr0bright applied to toilet plastics :D

curley 16.02.2017 11:58

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by venetian (Post 2741594)
The second one should be Italian only. Maybe there is an english version activated depending on browser settings...

You are right, whitening is definitely not permanent! I kept reading and I run into this other article: http://www.classic-computers.org.nz/...-temporary.htm

By the way, I think those computer guys would be amazed to see Retr0bright applied to toilet plastics :D

Ooops, yep, I didn't see the second link.

Funny how guys bother whitening their computer cases LOL. Well, unlike a pc you see the toilet plastic every day (although mine is far from looking the way those items on that site did).
Still, retrobright seems pretty effective - do you know a source to buy it from in Switzerland?

btw. I don't think it's the UV only that makes those things yellow but also dust. Or the two things together.

venetian 16.02.2017 12:51

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
In the last link there is description of yellowing happening in closed boxes, so it's likely not only light.

I don't think you can buy retrobright as a ready-to-use product, you have to prepare the mixture starting from commercial polishing products. Maybe someone is selling it on the internet but I'm not aware of it.

curley 20.09.2018 15:16

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
1 Attachment(s)
almost two years later ..... unfortunately none of your really good tips worked, so I lived with my yellowish toilet tank cover.

Today the plumber had to come by about the thread-title-problem.
I showed him my problem and asked how much such a cover costs. He looked at it and decided "I declare it broken". :)

Attachment 134439

I know it's a tiny thing but hey, what a sight!
I still won't know what it costs but who cares? ;)

grnfish 20.09.2018 16:49

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
you might be informed how much it cost if you will need to pay for it :)

I think up to 10% of the yearly cost for "nebenkosten" you need to cover for such things... If I'm not mistaken

at least I do have it in my contract...

curley 20.09.2018 17:16

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by grnfish (Post 2993630)
you might be informed how much it cost if you will need to pay for it :)

I think up to 10% of the yearly cost for "nebenkosten" you need to cover for such things... If I'm not mistaken

at least I do have it in my contract...

Naaa, you see, me as well as the plumber know my landlord. ;)

Not to mention she was prepared to have the entire toilet bowl exchanged - she apparently had to do that in a few other flats due to heavy limescale deposits around the rims and expected the worst. She will be all too happy to hear mine is squeaky clean and the water comes out all the places it should.

While there are all kinds of contracts out there, not even you would have to pay for a 25 year old plastic-cover.

Helm 20.09.2018 17:24

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by curley (Post 2993606)
I showed him my problem and asked how much such a cover costs.

You mean how much the plastic thingy to flush?

Gimme a second... * grabs closest offer* The company is charging 88.50chf for "cheapish" SIGMA plastic one.

Internet says 73.50chf

https://www.baddirekt.ch/Abdeckplatte-SIGMA30-GEBERIT

So, count on about 80chf-100chf for the thing.

Phil_MCR 20.09.2018 17:47

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by TheLaughingCow (Post 2739160)
The floater was just covered in calcium, and I couldn't see it until I had sprayed it and pulled the floater out.

you might want to make some changes to your diet! :rofl:

k_and_e 20.09.2018 17:51

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by curley (Post 2993636)
Naaa, you see, me as well as the plumber know my landlord. ;)

Not to mention she was prepared to have the entire toilet bowl exchanged - she apparently had to do that in a few other flats due to heavy limescale deposits around the rims and expected the worst. She will be all too happy to hear mine is squeaky clean and the water comes out all the places it should.

While there are all kinds of contracts out there, not even you would have to pay for a 25 year old plastic-cover.

Congratulations with your new cover and your clean toilet.
You have all reason to be proud.

curley 20.09.2018 18:17

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil_MCR (Post 2993650)
you might want to make some changes to your diet! :rofl:

You have an interesting way to use your toilet. Do you unscrew the wall pannel everytime or do you just leave it open? :eek:

greengrass10 11.07.2019 10:05

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
5 Attachment(s)
Hello all,

I'm re-opening this thread due to a toilet which doesn't stop running. The toilet is in France, and some photos are attached. Does anyone know how to fix this? Would appreciate some help and suggestions. Look forward to hearing from you!

Greengrass

amogles 11.07.2019 10:49

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greengrass10 (Post 3082257)
Hello all,

I'm re-opening this thread due to a toilet which doesn't stop running. The toilet is in France, and some photos are attached. Does anyone know how to fix this? Would appreciate some help and suggestions. Look forward to hearing from you!

Greengrass

The plastic floater thingy is probably broken. You can get a complete assembly at Bauhaus for about 20CHF. A bit fiddly to fit if it's not exactly the same model, but quite doable. You can probably find youtubes of people showing how.

But before going there I would check that it is indeed the floater. Observe carefully as the tank fills with water. Does the floater rise with the water level? And does it stop the flow of water? If not, why not? Debris blocking its free movement? Stiffness in the joint? damage to the valve itself?

greengrass10 11.07.2019 12:56

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by amogles (Post 3082272)
The plastic floater thingy is probably broken. You can get a complete assembly at Bauhaus for about 20CHF. A bit fiddly to fit if it's not exactly the same model, but quite doable. You can probably find youtubes of people showing how.

But before going there I would check that it is indeed the floater. Observe carefully as the tank fills with water. Does the floater rise with the water level? And does it stop the flow of water? If not, why not? Debris blocking its free movement? Stiffness in the joint? damage to the valve itself?

Thanks, I can't figure out what is the floater. Could you point it out for me in the photo? I don't think anything is broken, though I did notice there is a lot of calcium/saltish stuff all over, so its possible the calcium debris is blocking free movement. The water is very hard. But what do I clean or which part do I replace if it is calcium buildup? Could you use the photos to direct me to the specific parts and describe what needs to be done?

amogles 11.07.2019 13:41

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by greengrass10 (Post 3082304)
Thanks, I can't figure out what is the floater. Could you point it out for me in the photo? I don't think anything is broken, though I did notice there is a lot of calcium/saltish stuff all over, so its possible the calcium debris is blocking free movement. The water is very hard. But what do I clean or which part do I replace if it is calcium buildup? Could you use the photos to direct me to the specific parts and describe what needs to be done?

Attachment 137239

The red arrow points to the actual floater. As your tank fills with water, this rises up and cuts off the inflow of water (possibly where the green arrow is, precise arangement varies from model to model).

Does the thing the red arrow points to rise up when the tank fills with water?

If that is not working correctly, you need to figure out why its not rising. maybe it's just debris or chalk deposit that you can easily remove. You can check whether it moves freely by moving it up and down by hand, even without water. If the reason it doesn't work is that its old and broken, you need to replace it.

The whole assembly, that is, the thing the red arrow points to and the thing the green arrow points to, and everything attached to it, this whole thing you can buy as one piece in Bauhaus and fit it yourself. As the water inflow is through this thing, you need to cut off the water supply before attempting to remove it.

aSwissInTheUS 11.07.2019 14:34

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
If the floater or inlet valve were the issue the cistern would fill and overflow through the blue tube into the bowl. But it looks like you have an empty cisterns, which means the sink hole does not close properly and water level never rises. Issue can be grime, limescale, or an aged seal.

greengrass10 11.07.2019 15:24

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by amogles (Post 3082325)
Attachment 137239

The red arrow points to the actual floater. As your tank fills with water, this rises up and cuts off the inflow of water (possibly where the green arrow is, precise arangement varies from model to model).

Does the thing the red arrow points to rise up when the tank fills with water?

If that is not working correctly, you need to figure out why its not rising. maybe it's just debris or chalk deposit that you can easily remove. You can check whether it moves freely by moving it up and down by hand, even without water. If the reason it doesn't work is that its old and broken, you need to replace it.

The whole assembly, that is, the thing the red arrow points to and the thing the green arrow points to, and everything attached to it, this whole thing you can buy as one piece in Bauhaus and fit it yourself. As the water inflow is through this thing, you need to cut off the water supply before attempting to remove it.

Thanks, that's a big help! I checked the thing the red arrow points to, and it does seem to move up and down, though the surface it slides on is very grainy, possibly from calcium. Is there anything I can do remove the calcium? Also, someone mentioned some kind of flap which needs to seal and close properly. Where is this flap in the photo? In case it's a problem of the flap (not sure if calcium debris could affect this flap), what would I need to do to help restore a tight seal?

greengrass10 11.07.2019 15:25

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by aSwissInTheUS (Post 3082343)
If the floater or inlet valve were the issue the cistern would fill and overflow through the blue tube into the bowl. But it looks like you have an empty cisterns, which means the sink hole does not close properly and water level never rises. Issue can be grime, limescale, or an aged seal.

Thanks that's good to know. How can I get rid of limescale and change an aged seal? Would appreciate if you could show me on the photos, as I'm not familiar with these things at all.

aSwissInTheUS 11.07.2019 15:55

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greengrass10 (Post 3082362)
Thanks that's good to know. How can I get rid of limescale and change an aged seal? Would appreciate if you could show me on the photos, as I'm not familiar with these things at all.

It is the middle part. This can be somehow removed. When removed the limescale in the cistern can be scrapped of, you clean/the plastic parts and seals with vinegar or citric acid, or replace if needed.

Here a video, this one is simply clipped in. Yours could be screwed in or old down otherwise.

doropfiz 11.07.2019 16:44

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Have a look at some General Videos such as this, for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyoTm1FVvmo
The principle is the same no matter the kind of toilet cistern, or whether you use some fancy brand-name cleaner, or plain vinegar, etc. Obviously, though, the closer the cideo is to the actual cistern you have, the better.

First take clear photos from all angles of how it is all installed now. Maybe draw a diagram or write some notes… whatever works for you.

Then take each removeable item out, and soak and scrub individually. In the meantime soak the tank, then scrub that, then replace all parts according to your photos or drawings.

Only after that will you know whether anything needs to be replaced, at all.

amogles 11.07.2019 17:53

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by doropfiz (Post 3082380)
Have a look at some General Videos such as this, for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyoTm1FVvmo
The principle is the same no matter the kind of toilet cistern, or whether you use some fancy brand-name cleaner, or plain vinegar, etc. Obviously, though, the closer the cideo is to the actual cistern you have, the better.

First take clear photos from all angles of how it is all installed now. Maybe draw a diagram or write some notes… whatever works for you.

Then take each removeable item out, and soak and scrub individually. In the meantime soak the tank, then scrub that, then replace all parts according to your photos or drawings.

Only after that will you know whether anything needs to be replaced, at all.

All very sound ideas.

But please do also bear in mind that the entire inlet and floater assembly is cheap and lightweight plastic and (speaking from memory) costs around 20 CHF. It's also not that easy to disassemble without breaking something (because it's cheap and thin and ageing plastic) .So maybe replacement is the less hurtful option. Just my opinion.

greengrass10 11.07.2019 18:55

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by aSwissInTheUS (Post 3082369)
It is the middle part. This can be somehow removed. When removed the limescale in the cistern can be scrapped of, you clean/the plastic parts and seals with vinegar or citric acid, or replace if needed.

Here a video, this one is simply clipped in. Yours could be screwed in or old down otherwise.

Thanks!

greengrass10 11.07.2019 18:56

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by doropfiz (Post 3082380)
Have a look at some General Videos such as this, for example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyoTm1FVvmo
The principle is the same no matter the kind of toilet cistern, or whether you use some fancy brand-name cleaner, or plain vinegar, etc. Obviously, though, the closer the cideo is to the actual cistern you have, the better.

First take clear photos from all angles of how it is all installed now. Maybe draw a diagram or write some notes… whatever works for you.

Then take each removeable item out, and soak and scrub individually. In the meantime soak the tank, then scrub that, then replace all parts according to your photos or drawings.

Only after that will you know whether anything needs to be replaced, at all.

Thanks, good to see!

greengrass10 11.07.2019 18:57

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by amogles (Post 3082403)
All very sound ideas.

But please do also bear in mind that the entire inlet and floater assembly is cheap and lightweight plastic and (speaking from memory) costs around 20 CHF. It's also not that easy to disassemble without breaking something (because it's cheap and thin and ageing plastic) .So maybe replacement is the less hurtful option. Just my opinion.

Thanks, will bear that in mind.

doropfiz 12.07.2019 04:30

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by amogles (Post 3082403)
All very sound ideas.

But please do also bear in mind that the entire inlet and floater assembly is cheap and lightweight plastic and (speaking from memory) costs around 20 CHF. It's also not that easy to disassemble without breaking something (because it's cheap and thin and ageing plastic) .So maybe replacement is the less hurtful option. Just my opinion.

Yeah, I get that. I think I suggested it partly not realising how very cheap the replacement part would be, that's true.

For me, though, there's another aspect. Taking it apart - gently - and soaking and scrubbing it, and re-assembling, would feel like much less work than travelling All That Way to the right shop (and possibly first to the wrong one) to buy the replacement part.

Cherub 16.07.2019 16:55

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
One of the toilets in the house I have back in Scotland wouldn't stop running and I had to resort to getting a plumber. All of the gubbins inside the cistern had to be replaced as the dodgy developer / builder who did my house used an equally dodgy plumbing company. Turns out everything inside the cistern was broken and it had been stuck back together with some kind of sealant and then installed!:mad:

greengrass10 26.07.2019 15:58

Re: Stop a running European toilet [ * tip ]
 
Quick update: equipped with all the tips on this site, I set out to to clean and fix my running toilet. This entailed a saturday morning several hours reviewing this sites' tips, google researching and watching youtube videos on running toilet cleaning and repair, and a trip to leroy merlin (french home depot/hardware store) where I bought all the tools and a toilet replacement kit (in case one needed), including a leroy merlin membership card as it offered free telephone support for installation of the toilet replacement kit.

Long story short, I'd gotten a pretty good grasp of how the toilet works and having a sense of what I needed to do. But unfortunately I think I needed more practice in handling the tools. Accidentally broke one of the plastic parts with the wrench after realizing was twisting it the wrong direction, which made it necessary to replace the whole contraption. Then, hit a complete barrier when the square bolt attached to the water source seemed fused, and couldn't get it to turn in order to remove the contraption from the water source. Seemed quite easy in the videos, but not so easy in the doing. Anyway, ended up having to pay a plumber more than 250 euro to fix it (including additional weekend fee - hadn't realized plumbers in france don't work on weekends and will do it only for an additional weekend fee).

Realized I probably needed to start with Basic Tools 101. Did gain an understanding of the mechanisms through which a toilet works though which was good to know and also now have some appreciation for the person who invited the toilet and how much easier it makes our lives. Thanks in any case to all for the tips. I think would probably be able to do it successfully in case I needed to do this a 2nd time.

Greengrass


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