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Old 03.07.2017, 00:15
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Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

Hello,

I have just moved a new build apartment. I am trying to install my old lights , but I am having trouble figuring out how to do this with a concrete ceiling.

Attached are two pictures. All of the electrical connections are embedded into the ceiling with a red plastic thing, with no visible way to screw or attach anything to them.

Does anyone have any suggestion on how this could be done?

Thank you for your time.
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installing-lighting-concrete-ceiling-img_3842.jpg   installing-lighting-concrete-ceiling-img_3843.jpg  
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Old 03.07.2017, 00:22
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

Drill a hole and screw something into it with a 'Dübel'
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Old 03.07.2017, 00:37
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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Hello,

I have just moved a new build apartment. I am trying to install my old lights , but I am having trouble figuring out how to do this with a concrete ceiling.

Attached are two pictures. All of the electrical connections are embedded into the ceiling with a red plastic thing, with no visible way to screw or attach anything to them.

Does anyone have any suggestion on how this could be done?

Thank you for your time.
We can only guess at what sort of lights and how they mount, so you are maybe looking at a hammer drill, masonry bit, and rawl plugs. Or you could get away with butterfly fixings, depending on the diameter of that red nylon boss... or get someone in.
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Old 03.07.2017, 08:57
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

Is the ceiling in the photo in your cellar? I am asking as the ceiling looks unfinished (unless you have one of those places where they just left the concrete as is.)

If you do not have the right toold or know-how, get someone in.
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Old 03.07.2017, 09:24
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

What kind of lamp do you want to install? If it's a fluorescent or similar type with a larger base then you'll want to drill and use rawl plugs/Dubel. Sometimes you can mount the lamp so that it covers that Unterputz box, sometimes you need to use a domed cover over the box and cut a notch in that to feed the cable out. Pay attention to where the tubing runs into and out of the box when you're drilling for the dubel.

There are also expanding hook thingies for hanging lamps, if the lamp comes with a cover.

The installation will fail inspection if the contents of the box are visible.
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Old 03.07.2017, 09:43
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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.

The installation will fail inspection if the contents of the box are visible.
What sort of "inspection" are you referring to here? By whom, and to what end?

(Genuine question, btw).
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Old 03.07.2017, 09:51
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

My apartment is similar (concrete - just mine's painted white).

Two holes (on the sides where the wires aren't routed in the concrete) with a drill, some plastic rawl plugs and lights are up
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Old 03.07.2017, 10:01
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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What sort of "inspection" are you referring to here? By whom, and to what end?

(Genuine question, btw).
A major change to the installation, or a change in ownership usually entail an inspection.

As a rule, no connections should be visible without removing a cover.
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Old 03.07.2017, 10:18
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

As others have said, it depends on what fixture you are mounting. However, for a lightweight fixture, any of the small holes in the cross-shaped pattern at the bottom of the red box can be used to screw into, to hold up your fixture. If you post up a photo of your fixture, I'll tell you how I would mount it.
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Old 03.07.2017, 10:27
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

NOTE: drilling a hole into the concrete ceiling will require a good concrete drill bit and slow steady drilling because the concrete is the hardest you will even drill into.
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Old 03.07.2017, 10:37
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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A major change to the installation, or a change in ownership usually entail an inspection.
By whom, and to what end? And at who's behest?

We certainly didn't have any inspection when we bought our place, and I've made quite a few electrical changes (just lighting and stuff) without feeling the need to tell anyone about them.

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As a rule, no connections should be visible without removing a cover.
Sure, that's as it should be, inspection or not.
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Old 03.07.2017, 10:47
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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By whom, and to what end? And at who's behest?

We certainly didn't have any inspection when we bought our place, and I've made quite a few electrical changes (just lighting and stuff) without feeling the need to tell anyone about them.
You can initiate it yourself. Just find a local electrical contractor to carry the work out. The norm is that the company/person inspecting must be different from the company/person doing the work.

Even if it's only a minor issue, and unrelated, an installation which deviates from code which gets noted on a forensic examination gives the insurance company a start on an "out".

Even with a full inspection on a new build I've found minor things like interior fixtures used on the exterior and such.
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Old 03.07.2017, 11:35
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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By whom, and to what end? And at who's behest?

We certainly didn't have any inspection when we bought our place, and I've made quite a few electrical changes (just lighting and stuff) without feeling the need to tell anyone about them.



Sure, that's as it should be, inspection or not.
They are a little slow in Engelberg. We never had an inspection when we purchased our house either. However, 4 years after our first remodel, we received a letter from either the Kanton or EWO (Elektrizitatswerk Obwalden), can't remember which, stating that we needed to perform an inspection -- "Periodische Kontrolle der elektrischen Installation". It took about an hour and they checked only the work that had been undertaken during the remodel. ~300 CHFs for the inspection and certificate.

I imagine this inspection was triggered by the fact that the remodel required approval from the Gemeinde and Kanton. I haven't been around long enough to see if they ask for periodic inspections on non-modified constructions.
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Old 03.07.2017, 11:52
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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NOTE: drilling a hole into the concrete ceiling will require a good concrete drill bit and slow steady drilling because the concrete is the hardest you will even drill into.
No, what you need is a good hammer drill. And it'll go through concrete like hot knife through butter.
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Old 03.07.2017, 11:55
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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No, what you need is a good hammer drill. And it'll go through concrete like hot knife through butter.
yes you do need a hammer drill however structural supports of the building have extremely hard concrete that has rocks mixed into it and iron bars... so if you hit a hard rock and some metal you will need to go slow and steady...
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Old 03.07.2017, 12:12
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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No, what you need is a good hammer drill. And it'll go through concrete like hot knife through butter.
Have you ever drilled a hole in the concrete used in Swiss cellar/bunker construction?

Hot knife through butter is hardly an applicable simile, hammer drill and masonry bit notwithstanding.
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Old 03.07.2017, 12:15
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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Have you ever drilled a hole in the concrete used in Swiss cellar/bunker construction?

Hot knife through butter is hardly an applicable simile, hammer drill and masonry bit notwithstanding.
Exactly. Just last month I wanted to install some hooks in the cellar wall but I gave up. Its even harder than the ceiling walls...
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Old 03.07.2017, 12:29
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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Exactly. Just last month I wanted to install some hooks in the cellar wall but I gave up. Its even harder than the ceiling walls...
For a typical 6-8mm hole Dubel to fit a lamp or such, a good bit and a decent hammerdrill will manage. I have a cheap (60CHF) Einhell cordless hammerdrill with SDS... I bought it to save my Makita cordless from concrete dust by not getting a combination machine. tbh I didn't think it would last or be much good. 8 years later it goes through even the oldest hardest concrete. Not quite like butter, but significantly better than any combi, or corded drill I've ever used.

The corded ones tend to spin too fast and not have much stroke. It's the impact which does the work, the turning just keeps the hole straight and evacuates the dust.

EDIT: Even a Kangol or Hilti will not go through rebar...
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Old 03.07.2017, 14:05
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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No, what you need is a good [b]SDS[/b] drill. And it'll go through concrete like hot knife through butter.
Fixed that for you.

SDS rocks.
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Old 03.07.2017, 14:07
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Re: Installing Lighting on Concrete Ceiling

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I imagine this inspection was triggered by the fact that the remodel required approval from the Gemeinde and Kanton. I haven't been around long enough to see if they ask for periodic inspections on non-modified constructions.
Right. We've not done any work of that magnitude, i.e. no structrual changes, but have been there for ten years now, so I'm guessing they only do it after declared work such as you did.
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